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11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back 11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back

09-15-2010 , 03:15 PM
First game, 2nd level so somewhat early. I've been running all over villain so far. He 3-bet-shoved all-in over my 3x open in the previous hand so he could be tilting a bit. I estimate his BTN VPIP is around 60 and PFR maybe around 30 over 10 hands. I saw him limp 52s, but no other info on ranges.

Full Tilt Poker $11 + $0.50 Heads Up No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t20/t40 Blinds - 2 players

Hero (BB): t1700 42.50 BBs
BTN/SB: t1300 32.50 BBs

Pre Flop: (t60) Hero is BB with 7 7
BTN/SB calls t20, Hero raises to t120, BTN/SB calls t80

Flop: (t240) 6 Q 3 (2 players)
Hero bets t120, BTN/SB raises to t320, Hero calls t200

Turn: (t880) A (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN/SB bets t860 all in, Hero calls t860
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 03:24 PM
y raise limp
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 03:27 PM
I'd make it less pf, like 95ish. And 77 is at the bottom of my OOP raise-a-limp pocket pair range, against most opponents. I'll not infrequently limp it.

On the flop, I'd make a bigger cbet, like 160-170, and fold to a raise.

I'm not sure why you're merrily calling it off for stacks here. Reasoning?
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 04:32 PM
You look to be ahead on the flop, considering villain's limping range. Make it 250 and if villain raises, consider re-raising all in or folding - (Calling is wrong because it provides you with zero information and leaves you vulnerable to bluffs or any overcards he can hit on you).

You're looking at a flush draw, a queen or random garbage. I wouldn't consider any kind of straight draws here, since you have a blocker with the 77.

Also, if you're willing to call on the flop, why would you freeze up on the turn? What were you planning on doing when an overcard came? Besides, you're the one that's repping the ace by being the preflop raiser. Now would be the time to fold since you have no idea of where you are in the hand.
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 04:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by coffeeisgood
You look to be ahead on the flop, considering villain's limping range. Make it 250 and if villain raises, consider re-raising all in or folding - (Calling is wrong because it provides you with zero information and leaves you vulnerable to bluffs or any overcards he can hit on you).
I guess shoving gets you information, but isn't it a bit late for that if you shove?
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 04:49 PM
i am surprised crimson advocates checking it back pre, i thought i was too nitty for doing that. i think there must be value in raising pre, i just find myself in too many spots that i cannot handle. a good player must be confident enough in his postflop play to raise here though?

as played, i would bet the flop slightly bigger and fold to his raise. you cannot keep the pot small anymore and you don't want to get your stack in.
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 04:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crimsonchin
y raise limp
this. ur ahead of his limping range but playing oop w 2-3 overs to your pair on the board is not a pleasant experience unless villain loves to check it down or otherwise play face up
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 05:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hince
I guess shoving gets you information, but isn't it a bit late for that if you shove?
Shoving provides you with fold equity. If you shove and he folds, there's no need for additional information. But you might take away from it that he's capable of raising with air. Besides, I'm not making a case that shoving is the best play as much as I'm saying that calling is the worst. Folding is also a reasonable alternative.
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 06:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by coffeeisgood
Shoving provides you with fold equity. If you shove and he folds, there's no need for additional information. But you might take away from it that he's capable of raising with air. Besides, I'm not making a case that shoving is the best play as much as I'm saying that calling is the worst. Folding is also a reasonable alternative.
raising is far worse than calling, raising for information doesn't make sense, what information do you want?
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 06:19 PM
I donkJam the turn for information
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 06:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tortured Existence
raising is far worse than calling, raising for information doesn't make sense, what information do you want?
I'm getting a little tired of explaining the same points. Why don't you tell me why calling is better here.
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 08:58 PM
lol nothing like someone giving bad advice acting all indignant

i think on flop:

folding>>>calling>>>>>>shoving

77s dont play well oop also but they play great in a limped pot
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 09:02 PM
It's really important to think about postflop playability here being out of position when overcards are like always coming on the flop. I'd still raise it to like 95, no reason to create a big awkward pot here pre.

And stacking off here seems a little redonkulous, what did you expect him to have?
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-15-2010 , 11:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Punch Dancer
I donkJam the turn for information
Gold
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote
09-16-2010 , 01:54 AM
I called flop with the intention to c/c every blank turn thinking his range is mostly draws. I'm not sure if he has any Q in his limping range, maybe some Q2-Q6 type hands, but not sure he'd raise them on the flop.

When turn brought the A and he shoved I was pretty sure he didn't have Qx, so I'm only really beat by two pairs and I have pretty good equity vs his draws.
11$ HUSNG: 2nd pair gets played back Quote

      
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