wow this is nuts...almost a year later now

bump

buuuump.......I backed Justin Ogden for a very short time (less than 1 month iirc) because he was referred to me by a current horse. I did a bit of research on him but never saw anything negative. So, first of all, this thread title really needs to be changed to show that he's a scammer.

I wanted to cut him within a few weeks of signing him but never got the chance because of April 15th. Jogden139 was involved in our group skype chats and proved that he was about the most idiotic, scummiest, most worthless human being I've ever interacted with. He was hostile and caused fights over nothing. His views on life are so corrupt he will end up in jail or dead, there's no question. Anyone involved in this thread will never get their money back. Obbbbbbv he rolled my staking group for 100% of the funds in his Stars account after April 15th, despite keeping in contact and claiming he'd make good. He's now searching for more backers. I'll be posting a quick write-up in the negative feedback thread as well.

I've disliked many people I've met in poker, but there's few that I would punch in the face if they ever came up to me.......Jogden makes that list 10000000000000%.

Mods- please change thread title so potential backers (victims) will see he's a scammer and not have to dig into the thread. Ty

saw him grinding on ps yesterday, pretty ****ty for both investors and Matt238

Um, yeah I actually got a chance to talk to him and he told me he's on a 3 month contract with someone right now for 180s.

IMO the new title is completely absurd.

Obviously not my decision to make, and I am not owed any money (nor have i ever been), so no skin in this game.

However, i think the way this was handled by the mods was pretty bad. from first to literally right now when they changed the title. OP should have been banned a dozen times, and its not like (afaict) the mods are even giving second and third chances -- theyre just flat out ignoring it including:

-- apparently pursuing other stakes -- to be fair
-- creating a gimmick account and trying to gain marketplace approval (afaict he had an ip match with his real account and got denied, but not even the gimmick account got banned. Really?)
-- after being refused, applying for MP approval again, getting it, and posting a thread in MP. They finally banned the gimmick account when he requested it.. and even that would most likely have never had occurred if he hadnt gotten into a confrontation in ATF and got outed.
-- trying to organize a poker house in central america, presumably with money, though he claimed later that wasnt the case.

what would you have had them done differently?

I should probably have not singled out the mods, because i think this has been handled weirdly/badly by pretty much everyone. And i guess its not really even a criticism -- i just really dont get why everyone seems ok with jogden doing things that people on 2p2 are generally not OK with as a rule. I feel like im missing something.

And no, i dont think any different sort of handling would have made the victims more likely to get their money back. I guess im not really saying that it was handled badly so much as "i really feel that everything itt is super weird and im missing something" that said:

1. I don't get "alleged" He took 10K to play a tournament and instead of playing the tournament, gambled some of it away and ran off to another country with the rest. It has not only been documented itt, he has flat out admitted it. Is there some alternative definition of alleged that i havent heard about?

2. If you look at RW thread , the general consensus was that its pretty ridiculous for someone to be playing on stolen money in an attempt to make enough to pay back his victims. And IMO in 99% of cases that very same standard would be applied here -- i dont get why absolutely everyone was not only OK with it but cheering him on. Obviously thats you guys' decision, but it is very atypical. Also, this thread became host to jogdens new "stake" where he grinded with what was left of the money he stole then paid you guys back an undisclosed portion of the profits. I don't know, i think in most cases ppl would have come forward here and say something like "wait -- this is a really dumb idea" I don't think i have ever seen another thread where this has happened or even been floated besides Roman's and it is treated here like something thats not only perfectly normal, but laudable. Don't get me wrong, its your all's money, and if youre cool with it more power to you -- it just seems really weird to me and feels like im missing something.

3. Its pretty clear that OP had significant amounts of money to repay but did not. I don't know how much it costs to fly from vancouver to panama then live in central america for months, but it probably costs more to do those things than to not do those things. Except a random mention by the jake and an "ignore the haters" when he left, no one really seems to have a problem with this. Again, its your money, and if youre cool with it youre cool with it. I just dont get why.

4. OK, so hes known to have stolen money. He creates a gimmick account. Not cool, but no real way to detect that. Then he applies for MP approval and hes denied because they know who the gimmick account really is presumably from checking the IP. That alone should tell you that hes up to diddos. I can see how theres two sides to banning the original account because it might make the victims less likely to get paid, but not even the gimmick account gets banned the first time. Then when he sneaks himself into mp, they dont even ban the gimmick account until he requests it.

5. Then he goes back to using the original account, trying to organize a house in panama or whatever. Again, no reaction from anyone.

6. No posts at all in the neg feedback thread until recently afaict (and i only just now did a quick search) -- there have been people reported in that thread for voicing the opinion that rolling a stake might be profitable for some people -- but this guy stole 10K and nothing. Again dont get it. There are 5 reports from last year about a jogden impersonator scamming $60 before the real jogden rolled everyone, but not a single report about the real jogden stealing 10K even though it happened over a year ago. Again, am i missing something?

is there something im missing here about this guy why hes getting what seems to be extraordinary treatment.

i guess i just dont get why no one seems to have had any problem with treating OP like this never happened when that seems 180- degrees from normal on 2p2.

People need to understand that mods don't just read every single post in every single thread in every single forum that they moderate. If you feel an action needs to be taken, whether it's banning a poster, locking a thread, changing a thread title, removing marketplace approval, etc. etc. you need to notify a mod. Help them out. Shoot them a PM or report a post and add a quick note with what needs their attention. I reported a post and within an hour or so the thread title was changed and Ogden was banned. Anyone could've done this and gotten the same result, and if this had been done sometime in the last year, I imagine some current headaches could've been avoided.

As far as people having their money scammed and being "cool with it", I'm sure none of them are okay with it. But when someone steals money from you, feel free to demand it back, but if they don't send it, you're pretty much locked into having to work with them to some degree. For many who only have a few hundred invested, it's not worth the time and effort to chase after someone. It cost them a few hundred dollars to realize so and so was a scumbag.

I think ultimately what happened in this case was Ogden just slipped through the cracks. No mods noticed enough posts worthy of banning him. No posters reported him. No one posted in the negative feedback thread. It just happens from time to time, people slip through "the system".

Although I do agree with one point, I see no reason why the thread title was changed to "alleged". He doesn't need a trial here before we point fingers. He's guilty. He didn't allegedly do anything. He did it. He's a thief and deserves to be called out for it.

I was in the same stake chat as he was before he rolled everyone, and he was conveniently still in the chat until today when this chat happened. He left soon after and apparently deleted me on facebook.

[1:01:32 PM] Jogden139: (wave)
[1:01:54 PM] Jogden139: trevor do mods know my ip if i make a gimmick account?
[1:02:29 PM] Jogden139: haters getting outta hand on 2p2 again
[1:03:22 PM] freddbird: he's grinding live
[1:03:33 PM] Jogden139: ah
[1:03:36 PM] freddbird: have you logged in to 2p2 from costa rica?
[1:03:47 PM] Jogden139: i dono probbaly
[1:03:57 PM] freddbird: then they can probably track you down
[1:04:05 PM] Jogden139: not sure if logging in matters tho, they maybe need activity
[1:04:31 PM] Jogden139: not worried about that j/w if they know my new gimmick acct
[4:12:33 PM] Trevor: we'll know your other acct
[4:12:34 PM] Trevor: yes
[4:13:35 PM] Jogden139: so change locations and make new one in ordder to go undetected
[4:13:50 PM] Trevor: why go undetected?
[4:13:52 PM] Jogden139: or just post under said gimmick account as jogden139 since it will be outted anyways
[4:14:25 PM] Jogden139: because whats the point of a username
[4:14:35 PM] Jogden139: if everybodyd knows ur real name
[4:14:37 PM] Jogden139: ur email
[4:14:39 PM] Jogden139: ur alias
[4:14:40 PM] Trevor: so you cant run off again?
[4:14:41 PM] Jogden139: ur poker screen name
[4:14:59 PM] Jogden139: lol wat
[4:15:12 PM] Jogden139: run off?
[4:15:20 PM] Trevor: idk just figured you were hiding because people are outing you for rolling them in marketplace
[4:15:20 PM] Jogden139: i went home
[4:15:46 PM] Jogden139: no i made gimmick account so i can browse/post without being flamed
[4:15:50 PM] Trevor: lol
[4:15:57 PM] Jogden139: its hard to search forums without being logged in
[4:16:20 PM] Jogden139: i dono it was a dumb move to ban jogden139 acct anyways
[4:16:28 PM] Jogden139: it accomplishes 0
[4:16:37 PM] Jogden139: except now i have no communication with the investors
[4:16:41 PM] Trevor: agreed
[4:16:59 PM] Jogden139: i havent scammed people
[4:17:14 PM] Jogden139: so much of that thread is just trolls putting false pieces together
[4:17:20 PM] Trevor: meh
[4:17:26 PM] Jogden139: i tryed to get MP approval to sell my sharkscope subscription lol
[4:17:34 PM] Trevor: you're ******ed
[4:17:41 PM] Jogden139: MP approved me tho
[4:17:46 PM] Jogden139: who's ******ed
[4:17:47 PM] Jogden139: lol
[4:17:53 PM] Trevor: still you
[4:18:03 PM] Jogden139: i cant argue that
[4:18:08 PM] Jogden139: only thing ******ed
[4:18:12 PM] Jogden139: was paying back anything
[4:18:16 PM] Trevor: lol
[4:18:21 PM] Trevor: so glad i never invested
[4:18:24 PM] Jogden139: shoulda walked away right away

Not looking like you'll see your monies again.

The part in red is pretty much the key.

We don't ban someone like him right away because often 2p2 accounts are the only way that they can be contacted. Not all new marketplace applications are checked through IP so it's possible for his gimmick to be accidentally approved.

Once that was done - sure - we could've banned him.

It comes down to post reports though. If something looks out of line, please report it. It's impossible to read every single post and keep track of everyone that owes money.

is there any way to create a forum in marketplace for stake rollers specifically to update thier repayment progress and ban the account from all other 2p2 activity? That would make it so they dont need access to selling shares boards and would group everybody in that forum making it easy for potential investors to see also.

while reading the OP how did this guy even get backed for a live event? I dont even see any results listed or even references in the OP.

I do wish the best for investors but that skype chat doesnt look too promising.

Super-*G* OP is asking me on skype for people to tell him how much he owes. What's the total? Not trying to dis Jogden but low chance you paid back imo lol. Prove us wrong plx.

Ok, he is saying he has the money but wants to be unbanned to send? I told him he was crazy and that he wouldn't get unbanned.

Who can work out with this guy who he should send to? PM me for his skype. Sounds like he wants to paydatmanhismaney.jpg... Not sure how to confirm he is not getting reverse scammed.

p sure im still fb friends w him, he can contact me

assuming hes sending on stars, prob sending to jorj is safe esp since he had 40% of this

i would be happy to be the one in charge of redistributing $ if need be

from the fb message i just got, i dont think were getting anything anytime soon

Ok, probably not a help, but I sent JL3 jogden's skype name.

i will be out of town til monday so i'm probably a bad immediate contact, just fyi

It's been so long and I never expected to get money he owed me. I'd have to check my records. I didn't have a piece of his stake, but he skipped town on rent and services to me as well when he left. He used to deny owing me anything. I certainly wouldn't like to see him unbanned unless he pays me back as well. I took a back seat because I felt the stakers getting money back was more important, and he was making an attempt at the time.

He owes me ~$1500

bump because im pretty sure everyone is still owed money and f him