pretty clear 20% to me, but yes you should have pm'd him, and yea a goodwill gesture is probably a good idea

the_most10 is just confusing vivek with icfund

oooops- my bad--- read the first message a few hours ago and forgot who was who.

Agree on all parts.

i dont get why everyone is saying if he pm'd him there wouldve been no problem...i mean it of course it wouldve been nice and he should have but it wouldnt change the answer here (assuming crisp didnt see/respond to the pm before the turny started)

either way, 20%

can someone explain to me why vivek was sold 5% and why it was taken from someone elses share?

This PM exchange should be binding

Quote:
Do you guys want any of my WPT Bellagio at 1.15? I am playing tomorrow, let me know asap

Quote:
will take 25%

Quote:
Ok, 25% at 1.15 booked. What's the best way to get me the cash?


Galen.

I don't think you can then make it crisp/ICFunds responsibility to then check the thread to see if their percentage has changed. Also think no malice intended on Goldens part.

I hope those who are saying "the seller alone can't decide to reduce the action, they need the buyers approval" realize this essentially means unless they are good friends or something changes, the seller will never be able to reduce actions since the buyer thinks he has a +ev investment and why would he give away equity he already has booked. I think there needs to be a set amount of time before the tourney starts where a buyer and seller can cancel action (probably further from the start time on the buyer end since the seller may need to travel). Of course, this would mean in this situation the seller would not be able to cancel or change action since it was last minute, which I think makes sense.

As for this specific scenario I would say 20% plus some sort of restitution as although based on current rules the seller was justified in his actions in my view, it's bad business the way it all went down.

5% is 30k which is 5k more than the original buy in of the tourney...Now if he busted the difference is 20% $1250 5k versus $6250 25%..In all seriousness and fairness to both parties I think there should be compensation more towards middle ground of 22.5% which is 15k..or the option of no makeup In future tournies whatever crisp preference is..Op sounds like he has his mind made up tho..

yeah, and i was pretty clear that tmay owed something. once the action is booked at 25% the buyer has a +ev situation, unbooking the action takes ev from him directly. thats why i think GB owes something of value substancially less than 30k, i'd say 5% of GB at 1.15 in this event was worth somewhere around 500-750$ ev, so i'd say if GB gave approx 2k in freerolls/reduced markup that would be a fair resolution

20% AINEC.

Nah, Galen has the right to take away action. He posted it in his thread. He clearly updated the thread before the tourney. He should have just pmd Crisp. That is the only thing he did wrong. I'd toss Crisp something.

Also, just like the TMAY thread. Its intent that matters. And theres no way in hell that Galen would have accepted 25% from ICFund when they pay....so ya.

Case closed.

Give Crisp something but its 20% and personally if he's bitching about 5% after i just shipped 600k when its clear that Galen isn't angling. I'd spite never give him action again tell him to *****.

Also stop knitting and have 100% of yourself galen and use that luckbox well. congrats.

22.5% sounds like middle ground, but middle ground should be based on lost EV not on the results (gb shipping mad loot)

It's an error on Galen halls part..dude is a beast been on a terror in 2011 not taking away anything from his game or think he is angleshooting..but if he isn't giving the 15k or 30k the only option has to be $1410(5% of 25k including makeup) equity applied to tourney of crisp choice the $705 (2.5%)wouldn't be fair Middle ground either imo..I am not sUre exact mu amount just approximate numbers and negotiating is purely based on events described from op..

=20%

imho

What would have happened if he said "booked" then last minute decided not to play? I think it's pretty clear 20% because anything else and he's being freerolled (and it's super clear unlike the tmay case) only issue is him "booking" it and then backing out. I'm not entirely sure what the consensus is on what sellers can do once action is booked.

You posted it before the tourney started that his share had been reduced to 20%, so that is solid. You also stated in your agreement to sell shares that you reserved the right to modify the agreement. Its all legit in my book. He'll enjoy the 120K you made him. Good Job.

This isn't even close to the tmay situation for those that are trolling because everything was in galen's confirmation thread stating everybody's action BEFORE the tournament started to avoid any confusion. Galen should have pm'ed icfund letting him know he had 5% less investment than originally planned but doesn't change the outcome. His disclosure that he put in his prior thread that icfund invested in saying he could buy back action prior to the tournament also saves him of any wrongdoing. This marketplace really needs some defined rules to avoid some situations but this case is very clear that icfund would have owed only 20% had galen not cashed since galen posted a confirmation thread prior to the event stating everyone's %. I don't think galen should owe anything more than 20% but his offer for no markup for wsop event is a nice gesture.

This, and also... while I do think that Galen should have obv PMed, I also think it's very likely that crisp saw this thread well before the event, and also could have PMed to clear up ambiguity. Because if I saw the thread and saw 20 next to my name, I'd clear it up ASAP. Now it's possible he didn't see it in time, but with as much MP activity as he does, and the fact that he was in here immediately before and after the event, is that really the case? Sergey?

I don't think any of that is super relevant to the point, which is that the % should be 20. But I also think we're jumping on Galen for not PMing, but it is also not completely unreasonable to assume that an MP buyer as active as crisp would see the thread pretty close to immediately.

Also, congrats Galen... so f sick!

You posted the 20% post right before you started playing. Are you saying that the buyer had the right, at the same time, to send you a text message saying that he had changed his mind and didn't want to buy a piece of you? Immediately before you started playing a $25K event? And after you and he had confirmed the 25% as "booked"?

That can't be right, IMO, so if you can dig up examples I'd like to see them.

It's 20% IMO

I remember reading this and thinking it was somewhat ambiguous but assumed you meant 5% for vivek

Galen posted that disclaimer in a completely different thread for a different tournament. I don't even see how it is relevant here.

But the Crisp sale of action never had anything to do with the thread? There was no links to it in PMs, nor did Crisp see the thread and then send a PM. If he had, I think it's clearly 20%, but you agreed to sell action to Crisp on the terms laid out in the PM - given the contents of the PM how was he supposed to know he was subject to other conditions which he wasn't aware of and might not have accepted had he known?

The only fair exceptions I can think of is if it's common marketplace practice to allow for people to buy back shares without contacting the buyer directly before the event starts (which I doubt) or if Crisp always bought action according to those terms and knew they'd be in play from the start - second one depends on how often you've traded and terms I guess, but for me unless he's bought a ton of action off you and you've made it clear every time that you always reserve the right to buy it back then I'd say 25% sorry

basically he wants 5% and is trying to get galen to give in. he should be happy that he even knows galen and got to buy any action. if i were galen i'd give him 20% tell him to gfy and not sell to him in the future.