Little 1 - $1K buy-in, 40K chips and 1 hour levels starting at 100/100.

We are in level 2 so 200/100 with not antes yet.

V1 is a young Asian guy - no great read but definitely not spew-aggro. We are so deep - I'd say we are both playing ~50K so 250+ BBs.

V1 opens UTG+1 to 500. Several (let's say 3) calls along the way to my button. I elect to call with 7s6s. Raising is an option but I'm very OK with playing a SC IP. At least one blind calls.

Flop = Qs, 3s, 2s.

V leads 2,100 into a pot of ~3K. Folds to my action where I raise to 7,500.

V jams for 50K (or ~40K over my bet). Hero throws up a little in the back of my mouth and?!?

His bluffs should be AsX where the other card isn't an ace (some fraction of them). Given he has 25-30% equity when called he shows an EV loss of 15k chips when called and wins 12.5k when he gets a fold. So you'd have to fold more than half your range to make his bluffs break even, and your range obviously shouldn't be more than 50% bluffs, which means you should be folding a fair number of value hands too.

How low down is this in your value range? Technically not that close to the bottom since it will includes sets, but it's probably better to call here with a set than a low flush. So if your value raise range is sets and flushes (which it probably is) this is close to the worst hands in your value range to call with which means folding would be optimal.

Flop is 5 way. Are you raising anything other than flushes? Seems like a fold with one of our weakest flushes aka weakest hands.

Idk, at first i was thinking its is an easy fold but pre and post flop action make me wonder wtf he is raising pre that he plays post as is. I mean, if you raise akss do you lead 2/3 pot into five people from utg with the second nut blocker and third nut q on board? What about any other a2-5ss? I would think you trap w all those hands otf and turn...do you really shove flop w nuts when you get one caller? Does j10ss raise pre from utg and lead flop and push out one caller otf?

Aq w q w as seems so much more likely. Kjss raising utg and pushing? Really, only getting called by better most of the time? 54ss, the only worse flush is oesfd too, but utg raising it?

So if utg is semi bluffing w a set or as, you are still losing 25% of time by river but if you dont call here, i think you have to stop playing 76 sooted (which may be good advice anyways). I am confused- when good players confuse me i fold, bad players i call....

You aren’t really allowed x/r very much on q32
Fold now

Good replies. Here was my thought process:

My hand is as good as it will be now. There are no more good cards in the deck for me, only whiffs for any V drawing to a better flush.

The only practical set for V is Q-Q. He really wasn't so loose as to EP raise 2-2 or 3-3. There were so many soft spots at the table that no decent player was playing very loose OOP.

Hero had a decent skill edge - I wasn't crushing but my reads were already so set that I was chipping up low variance nicely - hence the call with 7s6s on the button.

We are so, so deep here with one hour levels. I mean we won't be short at anytime on Day 1 with a starting stack. Why risk 250+ bbs when they won't really help you for 4 or 5 more hours?

I chose to b/f all the way.

Hoping Eggs might consider reviewing this scenario and letting me know if that was a "good node" to be on

Anyone else have input? Not a common scenario but I hope thread-worthy.

Imo, thinking about it further, i would bet he had AA with the As. QQ is not looking to gii on this flop w 5 callers (i know that when he gii its headsup) Without the As, he cant know you dont have the nuts. With Asxs, he is not playing this fast.

He shoves almost 2x pot, he wants the fold and must have certainty that you cannot call him w the nuts. He is never folding the aa, so he may as well gii. If you do call, he knows he has outs for the win....

Tough spot for sure.

Its utg guy who cbets right? Why do you say lead? )

Obvious fold as played but raising in the first place seems questionable for me.

V's sizing is hilarious bad. But hey, he just induced a r/f from a flush so...Even a blind clock finds a squirrel's nuts twice a day (I think thats how the aphorism goes, right)?

There isn't a single hand he wants to go this big with, in fact I don't think he's supposed to go more than 1bb with any hand.

Flushes, sure you can argue those might want to go larger but considering that flushes A. Need very little protection and B. Block many of the hands that'll pay them off it'll turn out that flushes merely wanna go with min sizing.

Even if flushes didn't have forces acting upon them that oppose the desire for flushes to take a larger sizing, V still, in theory, couldn't take that large sizing because he has nothing to comfortably balance it with.

He isn't supposed to go big with flushes because literally nothing else would ever want to go big. You can argue AsXo or KsXo maybe but first of all if we're splitting these combos off of our checking range or bet small range we're gonna have a hell of a tough time playing spade Turns and Rivers when we do check or bet small and second of all these are bluffs that are more than happy to take the path of least resistance (small sizing) when possible so if we're going small with our flushes, sets, AQ, etc why not just go small with our bluffs too?

Less than flushes clearly have no interest in going large on this texture--not even heads up, let alone with half the table seeing the flop.

So taken together, V should either be going as small as possible or just checking.

AP we're not supposed to have a raising range.

AP..IDK LOL. I mean we probably have to fold but it's so ****ty.

Think jjjou makes some trenchant points about what hands might (suboptimally) take this line but really what he has is anyone's guess.

This is like the 90th percentile of your range but yeah I guess close to the bottom of your (what should be nonexistent) raising range so I guess it's not necessarily true that if you're folding here you have almost no hands that aren't folding but IDK, you're definitely in a node of the game tree you're never, ever, ever supposed to be in.

QUESTION TO THE COMMUNITY: Is this always a VPIP pre?

Beach, why did you raise him on the flop and why that sizing?

When I think about betting or raising I always ask if my value range can handle a raise. In this case I would clearly deduce that it wouldn't (as we can see) and I would call... but would I call turm and river leads? I'm not sure ...but I feel like I always have to see a turn so I'm calling.

If I had posted the hand I would have cut the action off when it's to us the first time. I think that's an important decision point.

Yes its vpip Eggs 250bb deep 5way, gotta love SCs.

5way it makes sense to cbet narrower range using larger size - its more likely one or several players will have TP, good draws so you ought to have a stronger hand to VB and a better draw to semi-bluff.

OK I can get behind that.

At the time, I thought it was a value raise. In hindsight, a call is better but I was being a bit greedy and impatient. I shouldn't be looking to GII on the flop with 250+ bigs so that was a mistake.

Sizing was large to be polarizing - a b/f play where I should not be b/f. Another mistake. I should have made better use of being in position.

Really butchered this one.

I give him a set, or a queen, with ace spades.

Makes no sense he jams with a bigger hand.

Figure I am 70%+ favorite and cross my fingers.

If he had a moster he calls.

Maybe 8-9 suited, J-10, Q-J, afraid you have ace. But seems very spewy from someone you view as solid. He had a hand, or a draw, but probably not as good as yours.

But, as Hellmuth gets angry, sometimes people do irriational things.

And, why you think about it, with your stack, would you fold Ace's preflop against an all in?

I figure based on his range you are roughly the same percentage favorite after that flop.

Understand, you can't know. 10-8 spades is in his range, Q-J of spades. Hands that have you crushed trying to blow off an ace of spades.

But, i feel good about it.

Depends on your read of V. This screams of AA or KK with a spade. Not folding