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HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct?

04-12-2021 , 12:58 PM
HTX Poker Room $150, 150K Guarantee

Day 2 Restart. Approx. 111 left and 51 get paid. Blinds started at 3000/6000/6000. I started with 160k and chipped up to about 240k

HH of V. Young Asian guy that seemed competent but I'm not sure now..

1) At 3/6/6: V raised up front and got called by MP OMC. Flops 10c7c3h. Bet, call. Turns 2c. V jams and OMC calls with QcJc. V shows AKo

2) At 3/6/6: All fold to V on BTN to 15k, I'm the the SB and call with As9c, BB folds. Flop comes 8c6x4x. x, V bets 20k, I call. Turns Qc. x, x. Rivers Ac. x, V bets 40k and I call. V shows 10s7s

OTTH: I'm the eff stack ~220k, V has me covered. First full orbit at 4000/8000/8000

All fold to V in CO and raises to 20k. I'm BTN and 3! to 65k with AhKh. Folds back to V who asks to see my chip stack and tank calls

Flop (150k): AsJs4h

V bets 200k which covers me and I look at board again, think for a couple seconds and call. He shows 3s6s

I’m not concerned about the run out as much as I am questioning V's oop call with 6s3s? I get the "gambling" part and trying to snap off a big hand, etc etc.

Is V's call correct? Should I be 3! samller/larger? Comments are appreciated
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-12-2021 , 03:39 PM
I'm not sure if you're trolling. You told us that you're effective stack but didn't clarify what his stack depth was (which may determine how wide he floats OOP, even if done so incorrectly).

Based on the limited examples you provided, you fist pump get it in and hope to hold.

I'm really guessing you posted this because you didn't hold and wanted some validation... If so, unlucky and you have to get back in the saddle and register every game that kid is in.

Sent from my Redmi Note 9 Pro using Tapatalk
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-12-2021 , 03:50 PM
Sorry.... V's stack ~400k
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-13-2021 , 08:55 AM
Of course nothing villain did that hand is correct. But this is a small stakes live MTT. I imagine many "regs" play bad laggy like this trying to play a bunch of pots and outplay the players even worse than them.

You played it perfectly as far as I can tell. Its a pretty straightforward hand for you though.

Villain should be folding pf both times with this hand, and his stop n go shove on this board is pretty bad. He must be hoping you fold KK and QQ.
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-13-2021 , 12:08 PM
I’m so mad at myself for reading this jfc
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-13-2021 , 04:14 PM
Thanks for the responses....OK, literally I'm not trolling. Again, the run out is not a concern to me....

I am just trying to get a better grasp on what V was doing? Meaning, is V thinking on a different/higher level that he would call pre oop with his hand? If that "play" is a thing, I would like some back up so maybe I can better understand it and incorporate it into my play...

Obviously, to me on the surface, it seems really bad but maybe I'm missing some finer points or nuisances. Or if it's a cut and dry bad play than OK....
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-14-2021 , 03:41 PM
He has a flush draw and you likely don't. He may be able to get some weaker AX to fold out which gives V additional equity in his shove. And if called, he's never really drawing dead.

You're 3! is fine. But against someone that you considered competent, maybe a jam for 25bb might be more effective.

Either way, I think villains mistake one rests with his pf call... Everything else seems standard.

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HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-15-2021 , 03:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ledn
Of course nothing villain did that hand is correct. But this is a small stakes live MTT. ...
Villain should be folding pf both times with this hand, and his stop n go shove on this board is pretty bad. He must be hoping you fold KK and QQ.
I don't agree. He has to shove for about pot with the flush draw. You also appear to be assuming that hero's 3! range is QQ+/AK. If he 3-bet light and has no pair / no draw, he probably folds a hand that is ahead of 6-high. Not great to get into that situation, but shoving is way better than anything else at that point.
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-15-2021 , 05:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deuceblocker
I don't agree. He has to shove for about pot with the flush draw. You also appear to be assuming that hero's 3! range is QQ+/AK. If he 3-bet light and has no pair / no draw, he probably folds a hand that is ahead of 6-high. Not great to get into that situation, but shoving is way better than anything else at that point.
Hero isnt that tight but I dont think is optimally wide either, we are talking about a $150 live MTT. The better players in these things tend to play tight ABC poker and print off of everyone elses mistakes.

Hero can speak for himself here, but I expect a tight range from him of AQ+, 99+, AJs, and MAYBE some A2s-A5s for bluffs.

In villains shoes, I would think that hero rarely has pure air on this board.

Its looks like we have ~180k behind with 150k in the middle. I guess villain has enough equity to c/c so he might as well shove himself if he thinks we are going to shove a high %. But I think he should expect us to bet like 40-45k with a high frequency here, so he has a decent hand to c/c flop, c/f turn. And if we check back flop, he has a decent hand to put pressure on that part of our range.

Also, as far as balance is concerned, if you are calling 3bets oop as wide as 63s and donk shoving most weak fds, you also have to be donk shoving most of your Axs, which you dont want to do either.

Last edited by ledn; 04-15-2021 at 05:33 PM.
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-16-2021 , 12:49 AM
Yeh, good points. OP is unlikely 3!ing light anyway or folding to a flop shove on many boards, leaving a pot sized bet behind and in position, so the caller can shove the flop.

It is sort of interesting that the caller with 63s has trouble when he hits. I guess there are some boards better for shoving a flush draw on. He is also maybe should x/f if he flops a pair. It is a pretty bad spot playing such a weak hand against such a strong range.

The OP post is extremely stupid and annoying, but it is a slightly interesting situation postflop from villain's point of view.
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-18-2021 , 07:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ledn
Hero isnt that tight but I dont think is optimally wide either, we are talking about a $150 live MTT. The better players in these things tend to play tight ABC poker and print off of everyone elses mistakes.

Hero can speak for himself here, but I expect a tight range from him of AQ+, 99+, AJs, and MAYBE some A2s-A5s for bluffs.

In villains shoes, I would think that hero rarely has pure air on this board.

Its looks like we have ~180k behind with 150k in the middle. I guess villain has enough equity to c/c so he might as well shove himself if he thinks we are going to shove a high %. But I think he should expect us to bet like 40-45k with a high frequency here, so he has a decent hand to c/c flop, c/f turn. And if we check back flop, he has a decent hand to put pressure on that part of our range.

Also, as far as balance is concerned, if you are calling 3bets oop as wide as 63s and donk shoving most weak fds, you also have to be donk shoving most of your Axs, which you dont want to do either.
Hero should consider some other hands as bluffs, so that he isn't too strong on this board. Some suited broadways and smaller connectors should work fine.
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote
04-19-2021 , 05:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by flossinlo
Thanks for the responses....OK, literally I'm not trolling. Again, the run out is not a concern to me....

I am just trying to get a better grasp on what V was doing? Meaning, is V thinking on a different/higher level that he would call pre oop with his hand? If that "play" is a thing, I would like some back up so maybe I can better understand it and incorporate it into my play...

Obviously, to me on the surface, it seems really bad but maybe I'm missing some finer points or nuisances. Or if it's a cut and dry bad play than OK....
This $150 live MTT is equivalent to a $2-5 MTT online, maybe even lower. The level of play is extremely soft. At that level, a lot of people find success by simply keeping calling to a minimum and being aggressive. Since they aren't 3bet enough by the opposition, they tend to get out of line by raising more than they should pre. As stacks get relatively shallow this makes them relatively successful as they are able to steal blinds relatively easy and sustain healthy stacks.

However, that's under the assumption they don't encounter someone to punish them for their being out of line pre. Postflop doesn't get any better since those players have a ton of leaks, as they don't understand well at which spots to be aggressive and which spots to play defensively. Needless to say, they aren't really balanced nor do they know how to play balanced if need be.

Villain shouldn't have raised 36s from CO. When 3bet, he should have instamucked. Having called, he should definitely have gone for a check, as the board smashes hero's range and it's extremely hard to play a proper donking strategy. Then he can decide whether to call, fold or raise depending on size of hero's bet.

When he shoves, he can't have AA or JJ, because he should have been 4betting them pre. He can't AJ or 44, because who want's to fast play monsters on such a dry board? If he as AT or lower, why would he shove if he's going to get called by better and fold worse? What does he need protection from? KQss? This only leaves the type of hand he had. A flush draw. Which makes it a snap call for you .

One thing you should work on i s trying to differentiate between those type of semicompetent villains and the truly bad players. The truly bad players will donk shove top pair on a 3bet pot especially if it's K high or worse.

That's it. That's all you have to know.

Last edited by leviathan74; 04-19-2021 at 06:04 PM.
HTX Poker.... Is this V's OOP call correct? Quote

      
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