Hi everybody,

I'm a recreational player usuallly playing micro and lower stakes. I won a 125 euros ticket and played a deepstack tournament.
I'd like to know highstakes players opinions about the hand below.
Early stage, 11 minutes blinds structure, no info about villain.
I suppose at this stakes villain can have some bluffs in his 4bet range.
I found myself in a difficult situation because at lower stakes 4bets are quite rare and usually made with an extremely tight value range. So I think at the stakes I usually play I would have fold preflop.
What is the best move preflop and what do you do against villain small cbet on the flop?


Winamax, €114 + €11 - Hold'em No Limit - 125/250 (30 ante) - 4 players
Replay this hand on Upswing Poker

UTG: 20,000 (80 bb)
BU: 20,000 (80 bb)
SB: 20,000 (80 bb)
BB (Hero): 22,287 (89 bb)

Pre-Flop: (495) Hero is BB with Q♠ A♠
2 players fold, SB raises to 750, Hero 3-bets to 3,000, SB 4-bets to 7,250, Hero calls 4,250

Flop: (14,620) K♥ Q♦ 2♦ (2 players)
SB bets 3,625

Well, I think V will range c-bet this flop after the 4 bet, as it should clobber his range. He certainly can have a pair lower than Q, Ax suited (and he's defintely firing if it's diamonds), AJs, JTs. So I think you need to call flop and re-evaluate. Fold here is a big mistake, I think.

As far as preflop, I don't mind the play (and it's probably the theoretically correct play to 3! -- although I think you sized it too big, maybe around 1800), although at 80 bb eff stack and IP I might just flat the SB open. This is probably not GTO, but I personally like to flat a lot IP with situationally biggish hands (but not preflop stacking hands) that also have very good draw potential -- as an added benefit, your hand will also be well disguised if you just flat, as your flat range in this situation should be very wide.

preflop is must 3-bet but would go smaller like 2.8-3.2x or so. as played to the 3-bet either jam or call are both fine but lean towards call
flop is mandatory continue with call

Is this a reentry? If so, I would shove preflop BvB, assuming villain could have a looser range.

Yes, it is a re-entry tournament but I won only one ticket and I can't re-enter the tournament, 125 euros is outside my bankroll.

I agree my 3bet size is too big.

A-Qs is not in my get it in range at 80bb eff.stack, but I suppose we should have a bluff/semi bluff 5bet shove range at these stakes.

I ran the hand in HRC and I'm surprised seeing how wide are the 4 bet and the 5bet shove ranges. HRC gives me a 19.2% 5bet shove range. Even 2-2 is theoretically a profitable shove.

Preflop is a 3!, smaller sizing, and I’d prob just call the 4!. All this was kinda covered. Don’t really see any options for us on the flop besides calling.

Assuming you called, I’d be interested in how the rest of the hand played out. I think the turn is where things might get interesting. Not much to think about with this flop.

I would shove preflop. You cannot rebuy, but SB may be able to rebuy and he may think you are shoving light to gamble. He should not fold anyway, as he is getting about 2-1.

5! shove. About 2.05-1 14,500 in the pot and 13.750 behind.

I would not be crazy about villain 4-betting like that over the big 3! with less than pot behind, as it looks strong.

I think the pre-flop 3-bet should have been about 3x maybe slightly smaller. This would still have fold equity. If villain calls it gives us a little bit more flexibility post flop in position. But I don't think it would have affected much because villain would likely have bet the same more or less on the 4-bet..

The 4-bet was very tiny especially considering being out of position. But had it been normal it would probably would have been a jam. As played it was >33% of villain's stack. So I look at this as a lure or bait. The 4-bet IMO had almost 0% fold equity. Similarly the flop bet sizing is extremely small. Which again is looking like getting sucked in. If we call the flop bet the remaining effective stack size would be 50% pot which means that villain may very well check the turn to induce or to make a river shove look more like a bluff.

I think villain is not bluffing much here and their range is way ahead on this flop. If villain had hands like 99-JJ or AJs they would not have 4-bet or would have 4-bet jammed pre-flop. With bluffs or weakish hands villain is more likely to have folded to our 3-bet or just call. The 4-bet makes it extremely likely Villain is intending to get it all in by the river.

The other problem is that even if we improve we may still be behind. So basically we have to count on Villain to be bluffing. And it would need to be at least more than 33% of the time to be +EV (combining the turn and river bets).

I guess the reason to call the flop bet is ultimately to challenge villain if they are behind to actually follow through. The flop would seem to hit us hard as well (we can have AK/QQ/KQ/flush draws). So in theory villain could check turn and river. I just don't think it is likely.

Hah! You responded to that so quickly . I think I deleted it in less than a minute. I def misread your post which is why I deleted my reply.

I still prefer calling the 4! over 5! shoving but I don’t think jamming is a huge mistake.

Yeh, it is suspicious that SB 4! that sizing rather than shoved over the oversized 3! in a reentry. That could be KK/AA. I really do not think it is a good play with any hand, because BB is probably usually calling a shove. SB could be a satellite qualifier like OP.

I do not like the 3! sizing at all, mainly because it gives too much accurate information. It looks like a mid pp or big ace, which it is.

The turn is 7 of diamonds and SB shoves.

I'm not saying that I would never do it because I have and probably will again, BUT: generally speaking it is a really bad idea to get all in with A-Q if someone is 4-betting you.

This depends. I would have been fine calling a shove BvB in the reentry period. After this 4! sizing and the board and action the turn is probably a fold.

There are also situations shallow in tournament where AQo is an easy call the a 4! shove.

There are certainly situation in which you would flat call a 4! with AQo and gii on later streets.