Hi,

this hand took place in WPT Berlin 150€ turbo tournament:

Blinds 150/300; 9 Handed; Avg. 18.000; 3rd level

3 Players from mid. and late pos. limp, Hero is in the BB with KQ, Stack 23.000.

Hero raises to 1500, first limper (14k) and Cut off (16k) call.

Flop: A 9 5

Hero bets 2500; first limper calls, Cut off folds

Turn: 6

Hero bets 5000; villain calls

River: 2

Hero Checks; Villain goes all-in (5k); Hero folds


Badly I didn't have many informations about the first limper. My thoughts on this hands were that both limper, especially the first one, are likely to have missed that bord and fold to a c-bet.

On the turn I think regarding his stack size he must fold all auf his hands like flush draws, straight draws, mid pairs, pairs from 3s to 8s and maybe I get weak aces to fold. The only hands that will probably continue are sets, two pairs and some aces. But i assumed that a lot of them are check-raised on the flop.

On the river I just give up because I think that he almost never has a hand that doesn't call the remaining chips, especially becaus if the third spade and the 6, so there isn't really a draw that completely missed.


Is this a bad bluff regarding that I don't have many informations, I risk 40 % of my stack and it's an early point of the tournament or was my thinking process okay plus it was a turbo tournament, so you usually have to speed up a bit?

thanks

Muckomat

I personally tighten up when faced with several limpers. I wouldn't raise KQ in the BB here. We have a decent hand to see a flop with and have no real need to raise IMO. Simply check it and see the flop.

I'm not a fan of the cbet on that board. OK, it's Ace high which is to our advantage, but into two limpers and the fact that there is a flush draw...I don't think a cbet achieves anything here.

The turn only further improves our opponents range. We need to just check here.

As played, check fold river.

You got yourself tied up in all sorts of knots here - don't be stubborn, especially with marginal hands that have little to no equity. You work too hard to build your chips, so look after them and get them in to your advantage with logical thinking.

We have been at the table for what, 40 minutes now? 30 minutes? We must have some read on Vs. Tight? Loose? Lots of limp calling? Limp folding? Anything helps.

I'm mostly checking my option here but if I raise, it's to a larger sizing. Your sizing was not bad if your hand was strong enough to raise for pure value. With this specific hand in the bb, there is a strong element of bluff in our raise. We want to take it down pre because we are oop, only have K high, are deep so we can't leverage our stack early, and our equity vs continuing ranges is meh.
This is KQo vs an (imo) likely l/c range from average players (who limp call, witch is bad). It's an approximation...

Equity Win Tie
MP1 48.58% 46.77% 1.81% { 88-22, ATs-A2s, KJs-K8s, Q8s+, J8s+, T8s+, 97s+, 86s+, 76s, 65s, AJo-A5o, KJo+, QJo, JTo }
BB 51.42% 49.61% 1.81% { KQo }

And now we are oop in a bloated, mw pot.

Here is A8o vs same range:

Equity Win Tie
MP1 47.27% 42.57% 4.71% { 88-22, ATs-A2s, KJs-K8s, Q8s+, J8s+, T8s+, 97s+, 86s+, 76s, 65s, AJo-A5o, KJo+, QJo, JTo }
BB 52.73% 48.02% 4.71% { A8o }


Same (better) equity. Would you raise 5x from the bb with A8o in a multi-way limped pot?

So I probably go 2000 pre if I raise, hoping to pick it up or at least get hu, but probably just check.

I agree the flop is ok for our range, but we totally whiffed. Hu cbet is standard but multi way I just give up here.

Turn is spew and exactly why we don't raise pf. His range is Ax heavy so just c/f.

Hm, been there for maybe 25 Minutes. Table looked to me like a lot of medium hands were given up when faced pressure.

I just felt like I get a lot of those medium hands like weak aces and 9x and mid pairs to fold, same with flushdraws. And I didn't really wanted to play KQo five handed oop either...

But I agree, raising bigger and check-fold the turn or checking preflop are better options then betting half blind into the limp-call range.

I don't mind raising for value and continuing on Kxx Qxx JTx etc, as most of your opponents limp range is AJ-, pairs, paint and suited connectors. You're frequently dominating the paint part of that range and rarely facing AK-AQ. Great time to get value from KJ QJ KT QT K9s Q9s over multiple streets unless V luckboxes two pair+.

So I don't mind the raise pre against limpers and sizing seems ok. We want to thin the field a little, but keep dominated hands in.

c-bet into two opponents is iffy. Heads-up I'd stab every time. Two opponents is uncomfortable. There are no turn cards that add any significant draw equity, so you'll be dark-tunnel bluffing every time if you decide to go for three streets. That's a big negative here. If you're worried about image, consider you have JJ-KK in your range and c/f against two opponents is perfectly reasonable.

Once you stab the flop and get a call, just c/f the turn. If V checks back the turn then his range is likely to be weaker Ax and fd's. There's some argument to then blockbet the river to stop busted draws putting you to herocall decisions, but I'm usually levelling myself in such spots and simply handing 2500 of good chips to a dolt with J9hh.

glgl