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Mid-High Stakes MTT Discussion and analysis of mid-high stakes MTT strategy

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Old 04-28-2017, 12:35 PM   #26
RalphWaldoEmerson
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

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Originally Posted by Beachman42 View Post
Personally, I think I raise to 19,500 and hope V1 shoves.
Wwy take the highest variance possible line on day 1 of the main? Also, you allow their TT-KKsx to put in minimum amount possible and get away from it on turns (whether turn is a spade or not they can get away from it).

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Originally Posted by Beachman42 View Post
Given the brief but effective description of V, I fold here without too much thought. He has the nut flush and nothing else.
Why? The pot is like 42k and we have 28k behind, no way we are folding this. Certainly he can play QQ+ with spade or lower sets like this, and we're not even in that bad shape vs. the nuts.


It's a pretty clear flop shove imo, neither of them have many flushes in their ranges, you will get called by worse, and you have outs against flushes.
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Old 04-28-2017, 01:44 PM   #27
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

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Originally Posted by DrSwaggerWagon View Post
In any other tourney, it's all-in on the flop for our hero. In the Main, it's an insta-fold on the flop. It's day 1 of the Main! There is absolutely no reason to get it all-in on day 1 unless you have the stone cold nuts. Even if you fold the best hand and would have won - you're gonna be with these guys all day, and there will be ample opportunity to get their chips later on since as described they sound like bad players...
This type of thinking is wrong. You are advocating playing scared because it's The Main Event. You don't get to flop sets often. When you do, you have to make the most of them. The more I am thinking about it, the more this has to be a shove. If V1 cc a 3 bet with small suited connectors and flopped a flush, gl to him.

I think what a lot of people are missing, is the possibility that V1 thinks V2 has a very high C'bet %. This is a scary flop and he is trying to take it away from him. His range is much much wider than small flushes and sets. He might have 77, he might have TT, he might have QQ and think it's the best hand. He might have air and think he can steal it (maybe he thinks V2 won't continue without a high spade). You have very close to the top of your range and as other posters have stated, you have outs if you are behind. You have to shove it.
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Old 04-28-2017, 02:20 PM   #28
Howard Treesong
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

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Originally Posted by RalphWaldoEmerson View Post
Wwy take the highest variance possible line on day 1 of the main? Also, you allow their TT-KKsx to put in minimum amount possible and get away from it on turns (whether turn is a spade or not they can get away from it).



Why? The pot is like 42k and we have 28k behind, no way we are folding this. Certainly he can play QQ+ with spade or lower sets like this, and we're not even in that bad shape vs. the nuts.


It's a pretty clear flop shove imo, neither of them have many flushes in their ranges, you will get called by worse, and you have outs against flushes.


What worse are you getting called by? 55 and 22 and that's it. Maybe AK off with the As. What range is raising the 4K bet to 10k? With a bet and a raise into you, the chance of facing a flush here is high: there are more flush combos than set combos and there are two villains. I do not think a flop shove here is at all clear.
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Old 04-28-2017, 08:00 PM   #29
cicakman
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

Everyone is calling off a 5-J high flush when it goes check, 4k, 10k, c/r all in 45k?
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Old 04-30-2017, 03:52 AM   #30
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

Shoving flop is great because some people fold flushes and some people make terrible calls.

As played and given descriptions not sure why a casino player can't be trying to protect his overpair? Seems like an easy call.
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Old 04-30-2017, 10:39 AM   #31
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

If he really had the nut flush here is he playing it so fast? Doesn't make a ton of sense to me. If I flop the nuts and someone is cbetting I let them continue to hang themselves... sure, can have the nuts here but it's not a given. Honestly seems like more of an ace of spade move.
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Old 04-30-2017, 02:09 PM   #32
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

We have to go with this hand.

Yes, it's day 1 of the main and it would suck. But we can't just continue here with made flushes, we have to call with some other hands. If we're folding top set here, we fold ~90% of our range on the flop.

Even if you told me our opponent's range here was strictly flushes and sets we have to continue. Even if he only plays a portion of his worse sets this way we have to continue.

Folding is fine if you absolutely think your opponent's re-raise range is made flushes, but are we sure of that? Can our opponent be overvaluing a worse set here? Betting with an overpair and a flush blocker?

If there's even some doubt, we have to call flop and gii on the turn.

Last edited by jpgiro; 04-30-2017 at 02:20 PM.
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Old 04-30-2017, 08:40 PM   #33
watevs
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

if you told me v's flop raising range was only T high flushes or better i'd still prob reraise flop in the main against a probable satty nit lul
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Old 05-10-2017, 01:59 PM   #34
ImaLouigi
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

I ended up folding OTT. It was the biggest lay down I've ever made but it was Day 1 of the Main Event! I still had over 30 bb's left behind. Any other tournament, I am getting my chips in for sure.

FWIW -- the villain told me when we were bagging at the end of the day that he had AK Saved my tournament life and I ended up making a decent run into Day 4 and the $$$.
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Old 05-10-2017, 05:13 PM   #35
DrSwaggerWagon
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

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Originally Posted by ImaLouigi View Post
I ended up folding OTT. It was the biggest lay down I've ever made but it was Day 1 of the Main Event! I still had over 30 bb's left behind. Any other tournament, I am getting my chips in for sure.

FWIW -- the villain told me when we were bagging at the end of the day that he had AK Saved my tournament life and I ended up making a decent run into Day 4 and the $$$.


Damn right! The Main is a unique beast. Good job surviving and nice run into the money!


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Old 06-18-2017, 12:57 PM   #36
plodonkey17
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Re: 2016 WSOP Main Event day 1 line checks

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Originally Posted by DrSwaggerWagon View Post
In any other tourney, it's all-in on the flop for our hero. In the Main, it's an insta-fold on the flop. It's day 1 of the Main! There is absolutely no reason to get it all-in on day 1 unless you have the stone cold nuts. Even if you fold the best hand and would have won - you're gonna be with these guys all day, and there will be ample opportunity to get their chips later on since as described they sound like bad players...
100% agree with this assessment
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