~195 people making it to day 2. 108 get paid. ~$200k up top. I come in top 15 in chips and 20 minutes in I have about 150k (500/1500/3000) after losing a couple small pots. V1 on my right has 220k, no reads yet, we are just going through the first orbit and I didn't play with anyone here day 1.

Cutoff opens for 10k (first time he's opened), V1 in sb on my right calls, I decide to call the big raise given I'm getting ~4:1 with J8cc.

Flop is T88 two spades. V1 donk leads 30k.

Hero?

Call. Give CO a chance to go crazy with his overpairs.

I like calling as well. If we raise, our hand really looks like either a good draw or an 8 (as we should rarely have overpairs here) and we want to keep hands like QT+ and JJ in as long as possible. It's very possible those hands fold to a raise and the only hands that continue are 8x hands (of which only 98 and 87 we'd be ahead of) or draws with tons of equity vs. us.

+1


Pretty much never folding on future streets unless it's like the Qs or 7s ott and v1 shoves and CO is still behind.

I like raising if SB bets a smaller size otf

Call w/ OR yet to act
we're pretty face up calling psb donk
jamming we rep wider but w/ OR yet lets just call vs stupid lead.

Shove

I prefer a shove here... there's 70k in the pot and it's a live donkament. TONS of people with overpairs calling here. Plus the shove looks like a flush draw.

Get the money in while you're way ahead is never a bad play. Don't over-think it. How many hands is he going to 2-3 barrel here with nothing that can beat you?

while we have a strong hand, there is still f draws, straight draws, x2 tens in the deck and x2 outers for over pairs. Alot of cards can come on the turn that can make us not like our hand as much.

These spots where its close I like to take the more aggressive then passive action to cultivate or capitalize on a lag style

Unless you had a better read than what you posted, shove.

you hand is pretty much "made" for most run-outs and both Vs have shown interest already. The donk lead feels like a hand with probably A-T strength - not premium but not a bluff. The large open pre-flop sometimes means a big pair like TT-QQ. I'd tank shove here and expect to be frequently called by worse.

Something else you should keep in mind is how to balance this shoving range. We can't only shove having an 8 here ... but since we're jamming twice pot we only need to be bluffing or semi-bluffing a small percentage of the time (20%?). Those bluffs will usually be something with a strong draw - J9s, 97s, any ace/spade suited. That's 8 nut flush draw combinations and two other combinations for a total of 10. I'm not including AK or AQ suited because will always 3bet those big.

So to balance that semi-bluffing range we have to shove at least 30 nutted combinations of cards. There are two 8s left in the deck. Since we're getting an amazing price preflop to call we can call with pretty much anything, so let's include all combinations with an 8 in our hand (except for 83o or 82o).

A8 is 8 combinations.... two eights, four aces... using that logic with A8 to 48 for all combos, 1 combo of 88, 2 combos of 83s and 82s, folding other 83/82 ... I get 85 combinations of value-shoving.

Sometimes the opponent is going to have an 8 here (A8, 108, J8, etc.) but we still have way more than enough nutted combinations to make that shove profitable. I would say we can also throw in another 10-15 combinations of some cards to increase our bluffing range as well. Perhaps a couple J9 or 97 hands that have one spade, or the four combinations of AJ that has the ace of spades.

Jam: All 8s that we call preflop, any nut flush draw hand, J9s, 97s, and a few single spade blocking hands like AsJo that also block overpairs.

Anyway, this is a clear jam. You're going to get called by worse a lot and you can very much balance your nutted vs drawing range.

How are we getting an "amazing" price pre when the open is 3.3x and there's only one intervening caller? Calling 3.3x opens readless with things like 84o or 82s seems really horrendous here.

I'm sorry I read it like it was a min-raise.

I think in general we get a lot better price to call with multiple callers. I thought it was a near minraise with another caller - in that case I'm calling BB with almost anything.

Makes sense. I actually feel like this defend is fairly marginal. If the caller was BTN instead of SB so that we are 1st to act of 3 I would just muck.

Yeah, jamm looks more FD heavy, but i would call since OR could have overpair and i will like an 30k extra, also givin SB leading here with that size, i will assume is a recreational player, so he could overvalue his TP/overpair, but might fold if we jamm, but either option is fine imo.
We fold pre if we suck postflop. (we are getting 3:1 on a call)

Almost 4:1. But the problem is it is hard to win when we are readless, out of position, with a meh hand and without the betting initiative. What percent of the time are we check-folding? Since we are readless what is our plan on flops like Q85hhd?

They’re also readless, and call is pretty standard, I doubt anyone will say the opposite.
What happened next ?


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Right agree it's pretty standard. I said it was marginal. I think it might be a fold if both our opponents have position on us.

What happened next? Same thing that seems to always happen in my tourneys. I shove, as I think it looks drawy and I definitely can get called by worse a lot. Original raiser laughs and folds, tool on my right thinks for 10 seconds and sticks it on in with K6ss. Turn 5h, River 9s. I go home, and he finishes 18th for $10k+.

He obviously played it terribly, and on my end, I know I have to be happy getting it in as a 3:1 favorite, I just tend to err on the side of aggression a lot in these spots and consistently run below EV. All that doesn't matter, I just want to take the optimal approach to each hand, but as I see people have more consistency deep in tourneys, I wonder if I need to take the lower variance route in these types of spots. I doubt it matters in this particular hand tho, I assume if I just call flop, that if this nut was gonna call it off with K6ss on flop, that he probably isn't check/folding if we make it to turn.. but who knows.

i'm n the call camp also, but hard to argue with the 3:1 spot that eventuated. run better!