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Is there a reason you 3b the 89s to $17? I expect the cold 4 to be slightly less likely to be light since your 3! Sizing was so big. At 100bb deep the call is going to struggle a lot. 89ss benefits a lot from initiative, think we just have a pretty clear fold.

89s plays better vs a cold 4bet range than KQs. Also he will hit most boards villain will miss and will play somewhat perfectly on most turns.

07-14-2018 , 12:32 PM

#452

Labax

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2015 Posts: 2,164

Think 89s is pretty reasonable, rather peel 76s and 87s but can’t see it being that bad

07-14-2018 , 05:47 PM

#453

Gabe16

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 493

89s oop seems a bad call to me in my micro playing mind. We’d need to be deeper, about 6x the bet effective behind isn’t enough.

Hand two how many bluffs does villain need to make this a call? Good fold.

Good luck with the lessons!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

07-15-2018 , 05:08 AM

#454

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rapidesh123

89s plays better vs a cold 4bet range than KQs. Also he will hit most boards villain will miss and will play somewhat perfectly on most turns.

Of course, but with this SPR at this depth I don't see how the EV of calling is higher than the EV of folding.

07-15-2018 , 07:23 AM

#455

Slugant

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 7,133

vs a normal 4bet range (its BB vs SB) you get direct good odss, how can ev of folding be higher ?

07-15-2018 , 07:41 AM

#456

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slugant

vs a normal 4bet range (its BB vs SB) you get direct good odss, how can ev of folding be higher ?

Do the direct good odds take into consideration you underrealise equity being OOP with this SRP? And rake too etc. The EV of folding and calling are definitely close imo, just don't see why everyone's saying it's a slamdunk.

07-15-2018 , 10:15 AM

#457

hurtNCYDE

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,358

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slugant

its not a big 3bet sb vs btn and its a standard call

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rapidesh123

89s plays better vs a cold 4bet range than KQs. Also he will hit most boards villain will miss and will play somewhat perfectly on most turns.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Labax

Think 89s is pretty reasonable, rather peel 76s and 87s but can’t see it being that bad

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabe16

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Of course, but with this SPR at this depth I don't see how the EV of calling is higher than the EV of folding.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slugant

vs a normal 4bet range (its BB vs SB) you get direct good odss, how can ev of folding be higher ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Thanks for the response, guys. Conclusively a debatable call then

After my driving lesson I had a really nice day at my friends house yesterday, ate some Dominos and played some FIFA. Realised just how much I've missed that game so much since flogging my PS4. They went out drinking and I went back home and did some studying, cleaned up my room and read some of my book.

Hardly played any poker yesterday, but I'm looking forward to putting a long grind after the World Cup final.

07-16-2018 , 02:55 PM

#458

hurtNCYDE

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,358

Vs guy who was a standard reg and is now in the 10% 3bet crew

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935064

CO: $204.30 (102.2 bb)
BTN: $202 (101 bb)
SB: $208.50 (104.3 bb)
BB: $226.90 (113.5 bb)
UTG+1: $349.21 (174.6 bb)
Hero (UTG+2): $234.69 (117.3 bb)
MP1: $215.55 (107.8 bb)
MP2: $211.13 (105.6 bb)
MP3: $203 (101.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with Q

UTG+1 folds, Hero raises to $5, 4 folds, BTN raises to $13, 2 folds, Hero calls $8

Flop: ($29) 5

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $8.27, Hero raises to $27, BTN calls $18.73

Turn: ($83) J

(2 players)
Hero bets $57, BTN calls $57

River: ($197) T

(2 players)
Hero bets $137.69 and is all-in, BTN calls $105 and is all-in

Spoiler:

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Vs reg who'd lost like 3 stacks within the last orbit and was tilting super hard haha

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935065

UTG+1: $206.98 (103.5 bb)
UTG+2: $417.84 (208.9 bb)
MP1: $203 (101.5 bb)
MP2: $200 (100 bb)
MP3: $227.85 (113.9 bb)
Hero (CO): $200 (100 bb)
BTN: $439.91 (220 bb)
SB: $443.25 (221.6 bb)
BB: $293.31 (146.7 bb)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A

UTG+1 calls $2, UTG+2 raises to $6, MP1 folds, MP2 raises to $22, MP3 folds, Hero raises to $52, 5 folds, MP2 calls $30

Flop: ($115) T

(2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero bets $30.31, MP2 calls $30.31

Turn: ($175.62) A

(2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero checks

River: ($175.62) 3

(2 players)
MP2 bets $95.08, Hero raises to $117.69 and is all-in, MP2 folds

Spoiler:

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Vs two regs. Had to think I was toast on the turn???

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935066

MP2: $206.98 (103.5 bb)
MP3: $421.84 (210.9 bb)
CO: $200 (100 bb)
BTN: $255.17 (127.6 bb)
SB: $228.85 (114.4 bb)
Hero (BB): $200 (100 bb)
UTG+1: $238.66 (119.3 bb)
UTG+2: $200 (100 bb)
MP1: $293.31 (146.7 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q

UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 raises to $6, 4 folds, BTN calls $6, SB folds, Hero raises to $27, UTG+2 calls $21, BTN calls $21

Flop: ($82) J

(3 players)
Hero bets $20, UTG+2 calls $20, BTN calls $20

Turn: ($142) 6

(3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+2 bets $45.95, BTN calls $45.95, Hero folds

River: ($233.90) 4

(2 players)
UTG+2 bets $107.05 and is all-in, BTN calls $107.05

Spoiler:

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07-17-2018 , 01:48 PM

#459

hurtNCYDE

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,358

Not really any interesting hands worth posting, but what was pretty awesome was that I had quads twice and a straight flush in 1k hands

Vs complete unknown

Poker Stars, $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 8 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935084

BTN: $54.99 (55 bb)
SB: $56.75 (56.8 bb)
BB: $111.16 (111.2 bb)
Hero (UTG+2): $100 (100 bb)
MP1: $181.05 (181.1 bb)
MP2: $103.68 (103.7 bb)
MP3: $120.59 (120.6 bb)
CO: $109.82 (109.8 bb)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with K

Hero raises to $2.50, 6 folds, BB raises to $6, Hero calls $3.50

Flop: ($12.50) K

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $6, BB calls $6

Turn: ($24.50) 3

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $15.50, BB calls $15.50

River: ($55.50) K

(2 players)
BB bets $83.66 and is all-in, Hero calls $72.50 and is all-in

Spoiler:

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standard fish

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935085

SB: $265.18 (132.6 bb)
BB: $246.32 (123.2 bb)
UTG: $214.23 (107.1 bb)
MP: $205 (102.5 bb)
Hero (CO): $217.85 (108.9 bb)
BTN: $80 (40 bb)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 5

UTG calls $2, MP folds, Hero raises to $7, 3 folds, UTG calls $5

Flop: ($17) 5

(2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $12, UTG calls $12

Turn: ($41) 5

(2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $10, UTG calls $10

River: ($61) J

(2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $44, UTG folds

Spoiler:

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Vs super agro fish. Can't believe he didn't bluff river

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 8 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935086

MP2: $89 (44.5 bb)
MP3: $329.67 (164.8 bb)
CO: $205 (102.5 bb)
BTN: $300.79 (150.4 bb)
SB: $409.69 (204.8 bb)
BB: $446 (223 bb)
Hero (UTG+2): $200 (100 bb)
MP1: $283.23 (141.6 bb)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with K

Hero raises to $5, 2 folds, MP3 calls $5, 4 folds

Flop: ($13) T

(2 players)
Hero bets $4, MP3 calls $4

Turn: ($21) 5

(2 players)
Hero bets $14, MP3 calls $14

River: ($49) J

(2 players)
Hero checks, MP3 checks

Spoiler:

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07-18-2018 , 10:01 PM

#460

hurtNCYDE

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,358

Vs big winning reg. Obviously pre and flop are bad, but I don't hate his play on the turn and river tbh. Regs definitely don't defend enough of their range vs aggression like this.

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 7 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935092

Hero (SB): $204 (102 bb)
BB: $51.16 (25.6 bb)
MP1: $100 (50 bb)
MP2: $376.03 (188 bb)
MP3: $381.12 (190.6 bb)
CO: $200 (100 bb)
BTN: $294.41 (147.2 bb)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K

4 folds, BTN raises to $5, Hero raises to $22, BB folds, BTN calls $17

Flop: ($46) 5

(2 players)
Hero bets $22.16, BTN calls $22.16

Turn: ($90.32) K

(2 players)
Hero bets $31.64, BTN raises to $63.28, Hero calls $31.64

River: ($216.88) T

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $139.18, Hero calls $96.56 and is all-in

Spoiler:

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Opener is a weak reg and cold caller is a loose reg. Might look very spewy but I had the blocker

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935093

MP: $109.85 (54.9 bb)
CO: $207.40 (103.7 bb)
BTN: $197 (98.5 bb)
Hero (SB): $201 (100.5 bb)
BB: $204.40 (102.2 bb)
UTG: $219.05 (109.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A

UTG raises to $4.40, 3 folds, Hero raises to $20, BB calls $18, UTG calls $15.60

Flop: ($60) 7

(3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks

Turn: ($60) K

(3 players)
Hero bets $52.58, BB calls $52.58, UTG folds

River: ($165.16) 2

(2 players)
Hero bets $128.42 and is all-in, BB calls $128.42

Spoiler:

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07-18-2018 , 11:41 PM

#461

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

Struggle to see how J8dd is a big winning reg tbh,

07-19-2018 , 09:25 AM

#462

Bagpuss

adept

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 1,153

guessing it's vs dnd?

07-19-2018 , 09:39 AM

#463

Slugant

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 7,133

surely he can pick way better hands than Jd8d

07-19-2018 , 10:09 AM

#464

hurtNCYDE

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,358

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bagpuss

guessing it's vs dnd?

Crusher6 m8

07-19-2018 , 01:07 PM

#465

Rapidesh123

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 8,674

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Struggle to see how J8dd is a big winning reg tbh,

Pre is somewhat ok, flop is atrocious, turn is such a spazz but it can be +ev, otr what are you folding? Vs a fish we should just call turn and fold a lot OTR because minraises are super nutted, but vs a reg we cant expect his turn minraise to be as nutted. I would be surprised if you had a folding range OTR, so his jam is burning 50bb in there.

He could be a good player, but even good players still are capable of making bad plays saying his play was good is just overestimating him for no reason. Gotta learn with a good player when he plays well, not when he is randomly tilting.

07-19-2018 , 11:29 PM

#466

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

Yeh I'd snaptag the guy as a Muppet tbh

07-20-2018 , 05:51 AM

#467

d7o1d1s0

Coach NLHE

Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,459

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bagpuss

guessing it's vs dnd?

lmao, the god of 400fr

07-20-2018 , 06:16 AM

#468

Bagpuss

adept

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 1,153

Quote:

Originally Posted by hurtNCYDE

Crusher6 m8

ah yeah that makes sense, I've long suspected he's a bot because of some the outrageous bluffs he pulls.

07-20-2018 , 08:57 PM

#469

hurtNCYDE

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,358

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bagpuss

ah yeah that makes sense, I've long suspected he's a bot because of some the outrageous bluffs he pulls.

You should report him. You don't buy a ticket, you can't win the raffle, son.

Vs reg with super high 3bet. Honestly wasn't happy otr because I'm getting stacked by AA here ~70% of the time I would guess.

Poker Stars, $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 7 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935117

SB: $402 (100.5 bb)
BB: $589.39 (147.3 bb)
MP1: $691.90 (173 bb)
MP2: $553.24 (138.3 bb)
MP3: $815.30 (203.8 bb)
Hero (CO): $400 (100 bb)
BTN: $400 (100 bb)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K

MP1 folds, MP2 raises to $12, MP3 raises to $36, Hero calls $36, 3 folds, MP2 calls $24

Flop: ($114) A

(3 players)
MP2 checks, MP3 bets $44.40, Hero calls $44.40, MP2 folds

Turn: ($202.80) 4

(2 players)
MP3 bets $79.92, Hero calls $79.92

River: ($362.64) 2

(2 players)
MP3 bets $568.23, Hero calls $239.68 and is all-in

Spoiler:

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Don't really know what the GTO line would be here vs a whale that's caught some heat on the table. This seems a bit grey but it's probably the only way I stack the mid part of his range so I guess it must be okay.

Poker Stars, $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935120

UTG+1: $409.96 (102.5 bb)
UTG+2: $535.85 (134 bb)
MP1: $826.44 (206.6 bb)
MP2: $400 (100 bb)
MP3: $267.91 (67 bb)
CO: $1,867.09 (466.8 bb)
BTN: $544.48 (136.1 bb)
SB: $488.44 (122.1 bb)
Hero (BB): $435.64 (108.9 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q

5 folds, CO raises to $12, 2 folds, Hero raises to $50, CO calls $38

Flop: ($102) 5

(2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $49.50, Hero raises to $385.64 and is all-in, CO calls $336.14

Turn: ($873.28) 8

(2 players, 1 is all-in)
River: ($873.28) 3

(2 players, 1 is all-in)

Spoiler:

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Going to cut out 400nl for a few days. This is probably a huge mental game leak I have, but I've been running good there and I can just feel the doomswitch coming

07-21-2018 , 09:38 PM

#470

hurtNCYDE

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,358

This game couldn't be easier sometimes...

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 8 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935129

Hero (CO): $240 (120 bb)
BTN: $203 (101.5 bb)
SB: $381.71 (190.9 bb)
BB: $186.20 (93.1 bb)
UTG+2: $276.71 (138.4 bb)
MP1: $243.02 (121.5 bb)
MP2: $281.72 (140.9 bb)
MP3: $200 (100 bb)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 4

4 folds, Hero raises to $5, 2 folds, BB raises to $16, Hero calls $11

Flop: ($33) 4

(2 players)
BB bets $170.20 and is all-in, Hero calls $170.20

Turn: ($373.40) Q

(2 players, 1 is all-in)
River: ($373.40) Q

(2 players, 1 is all-in)

Spoiler:

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Vs new reg I had no info on.

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 4 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935130

CO: $101.84 (50.9 bb)
Hero (BTN): $319.57 (159.8 bb)
SB: $228.41 (114.2 bb)
BB: $204.25 (102.1 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BTN with Q

CO folds, Hero raises to $4.40, SB folds, BB calls $2.40

Flop: ($9.80) 9

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $2.51, BB calls $2.51

Turn: ($14.82) 8

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $10.98, BB calls $10.98

River: ($36.78) A

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $49.39, BB calls $49.39

Spoiler:

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Vs same guy about 30 mins later. Would think because he caught me last time he'd think I'd be much more likely to have value this time. Pain.

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935131

UTG: $95.83 (47.9 bb)
MP: $392.16 (196.1 bb)
CO: $244.13 (122.1 bb)
Hero (BTN): $204 (102 bb)
SB: $255.11 (127.6 bb)
BB: $272.91 (136.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BTN with 9

3 folds, Hero raises to $4.40, SB folds, BB calls $2.40

Flop: ($9.80) 6

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $2.93, BB calls $2.93

Turn: ($15.66) Q

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $26.68, BB calls $26.68

River: ($69.02) A

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $169.99 and is all-in, BB calls $169.99

Spoiler:

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07-22-2018 , 02:30 AM

#471

Rapidesh123

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 8,674

Wow, sick overbets, haha! Good to see fr people going for the vaaaamo!

What are you betting for value in the last hand?
In the Q5 hand I dont like overbetting that much after a normal sizing OTT. If we had overbet turn we could have some jams otr, mostly straights for value though, AA blocks a lot of hands that would call the overbet, so its good for a small sizing.

Btw, I think his call is insane, sure, he blocks the nuts, but you have so few bluffs otr in that texture and he cant have the nuts, because he didnt have odds to call OTT, so you can jam JJ/QQ for value there

07-22-2018 , 02:57 PM

#472

Gabe16

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 493

Is balance a priority for you guys? I mean nl100+ players?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

07-22-2018 , 03:44 PM

#473

Mzbourg

banned

Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 6,670

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Of course, but with this SPR at this depth I don't see how the EV of calling is higher than the EV of folding.

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Rofl.

07-22-2018 , 03:49 PM

#474

EPTchips

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 520

& I though donos are capped to NL5z, congrats

07-23-2018 , 11:18 AM

#475

hurtNCYDE

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,358

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabe16

Is balance a priority for you guys? I mean nl100+ players?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Vs some in certain spots, yes. In general though, exploitative is the way to go until much higher limits.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mzbourg

Rofl.

Glad to see you're still alive, mate!

Quote:

Originally Posted by EPTchips

& I though donos are capped to NL5z, congrats

Plenty of spots in poker where the EV of two options with be very similar. No matter what stakes.

First pumped the turn thinking I had just stacked the most annoying nitfish ever.....

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 8 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935143

Hero (MP2): $216.96 (108.5 bb)
MP3: $144.24 (72.1 bb)
CO: $133.15 (66.6 bb)
BTN: $126.96 (63.5 bb)
SB: $203 (101.5 bb)
BB: $183.58 (91.8 bb)
UTG+2: $266.19 (133.1 bb)
MP1: $200 (100 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with Q

2 folds, Hero raises to $5, 4 folds, BB raises to $25, Hero calls $20

Flop: ($51) 9

(2 players)
BB bets $28, Hero raises to $173.19, BB calls $130.58 and is all-in

Turn: ($368.16) 9

(2 players, 1 is all-in)
River: ($368.16) K

(2 players, 1 is all-in)

Spoiler:

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Might seem way too loose but squeezer was a 23/19 lag and both cold callers were passive fishes.

Poker Stars, $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 8 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935144

MP1: $200.53 (100.3 bb)
MP2: $220.25 (110.1 bb)
MP3: $178.85 (89.4 bb)
CO: $119.12 (59.6 bb)
BTN: $287.15 (143.6 bb)
SB: $202.11 (101.1 bb)
Hero (BB): $200 (100 bb)
UTG+2: $200.95 (100.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with T

2 folds, MP2 raises to $5, MP3 calls $5, CO folds, BTN calls $5, SB raises to $31, Hero raises to $200 and is all-in, 2 folds, BTN calls $195, SB raises to $202.11 and is all-in, BTN calls $2.11

Flop: ($614.22) 4

(3 players, 2 are all-in)
Turn: ($614.22) 3

(3 players, 2 are all-in)
River: ($614.22) 9

(3 players, 2 are all-in)

Spoiler:

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Fish folded the bullets face up

Poker Stars, $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37935146

SB: $44.65 (44.7 bb)
Hero (BB): $100 (100 bb)
UTG: $97 (97 bb)
MP: $224.71 (224.7 bb)
CO: $53.31 (53.3 bb)
BTN: $113.18 (113.2 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J

2 folds, CO calls $1, 2 folds, Hero checks

Flop: ($2.50) 9

(2 players)
Hero checks, CO checks

Turn: ($2.50) 3

(2 players)
Hero bets $2.50, CO calls $2.50

River: ($7.50) A

(2 players)
Hero bets $5.55, CO raises to $11.10, Hero raises to $51.85, CO folds

Spoiler: