I like how you played the hand, now call.

The turn and river are both ugly dilemmas

I would of shoved the turn could have 64 or a set and now he could of filled up on the river.

The turn is questionable.
Who thinks shoving (or raising) ott is the right play?
At this point it wd b $1400ish more to V.

Remember V is the straddler and limped around pre w him checking his option preflop.
He ch/calls $30 otf, and Ch/raises turn $80to$310.
He cd have any random 4, or 46. Does he ch/raise w sets which prob isn't in his range because he is type of player that may raise pre on his straddler after 5 limps to him. So doubt if it sets, mayb random 2 pair; but does he ch/raise 2 pair on this wet board???
Not sure raising the turn is +ev.
If I do shove (or raise) ott, I still don't think he folds a random 4, and snaps on 46. Not folding on any random 4 isn't bad because I then free roll diamonds, but snapping on 46 I'm dead to 9 outs + 2 more outs for a chop.
Tricky spot.

I think it's just a smooth call here. Too many combos that aren't good for you in a limped pot like this. Hopefully he's dumb enough to do this with 2 pair or a 5 that doesn't pair with the board.

How much history do you have with V? Can we assume he's only calling a shove with a boat or nut straight?

Personally, I see you winning this hand less than 10% of the time on this board. It's a split pot at best.

Hey man, it's Jeremy. I wanted to thank you again for telling me about the poker tools you use and letting me know about this thread. I have taken your advice on tipping and getting value on the river. I look forward to following along on your post and seeing you at the tables. Thanks again.

After going into a lengthy tank, and cutting out 22 green chips totaling $550 a few times, I finally put them in the middle. I have had a lot of history w this V, and know this action V loves to fire when he has a big hand. On the contrary, he also fires when he thinks he has a big hand and not caring if someone could be holding better. What I'm trying to say, it's not his nature to slow down even if ther r many hands that can beat him. Basically, #knowurplayer is the whole reason I called here.
Chop it up; A4=K4

Welcome to the thread @IndianaGuy.
No problem, I enjoyed our talk and respect a fella who has the passion of poker running their blood.
I don't mention this thread too often around players in the poker room. Some players in the room have caught on by word of mouth, which is fine, but i try to keep a low profile and don't want the rec players knowing too much about my poker skills. I figured I wd tell you because u was asking a lot of questions pertaining to poker, and thought u cd get answers to many of your questions just by following this thread. The peeps here on 2+2 are super smart and u can learn a lot from them. We discuss hands a lot of times, and their wsidom and knowledge is a gd tool to better adapt at the tables.
The tipping I was telling u, well I learned from 2+2. I was tipping pretty ridiculously in my past as well, and didn't realize how that adds up over the course of the year...especially if playing regularly. $1-$2 tips was their advice, and I started doing that for the past year. I'm now on track to make more this year than last year. Mayb cutting down on the tips has a lot to do w that .
Feel free to chime in anytime, and continue to play every hand the best u can possibly play it. Dont ever tilt, and stay within the roll.
Best of luck at the tables, Rayz

MY 10 POKER GOALS FOR 2015.

1). -Be up 6 stacks of high society by the end of 2015 playing 1/2nl up to 10/20nl. $60,000.
2). -No Losing Months. (*April lost -$2,528).
3). -Log an average of 25/hrs a week.
4). -Come in top 3 in the WSOP League Finale. Getting top 3 will win me a Las Vegas tourney package. (WSOP Packages are: $11k, $4k, $1,500. Finale is April 11, 2015). (*ended up getting 5th in Finale )
5). -Log 1,000+ hours at Horseshoe Southern Indiana's poker room. This feat will take me from platinum to diamond card. (1,000hr requirement in a year to get diamond).
6). -Log 200 hrs in Jan and get the $400 promotional bonus HSI is offering. (HSI rake back promotion for Jan rewards a player $2 x hrs logged. 200+hrs requirement). (*Logged 202 hrs in Jan)
7). -Have a $10k winning month. (*January +$10,151 Overall)
8). -Have a $5k winning session playing 2/5nl or higher.
9). -Have a $2k winning session playing 1/2nl. (*+$2,236 on June 26th at HSI. +$2,709 on July 10 at HSI
10). -Play a 24hr session (*May 18/19th at HCO+$1,059)

All 2015 goals will b posted in blue. If I complete a goal, I will move it from blue to green. If a goal fails, I will move it from blue to red.

__________________________________________________ __________

July Stats...Bankroll pic coming when the banks open Monday.
*No tourneys played in the month of July

July Cash Stats



July Cash Graph



Year to Date Cash Stats (all limits combined)



Year to Date Tourney Stats



Year to Date Overall (cash/tourney combined) Graph



Year to Date totals (cash tourney combined):
+$30,736 = +$31,161 cash -$425 tourneys
On pace for $52,690. Gonna have to go hard and run like a thief robbing diamonds from the jewelry store to have a chance at this $60k goal.
Never give up. Gonna fight. #karatekid

Thanks for keeping me inspired and motivated!!

raise pre behind the limpers in that spot, and BOL on hitting your goal for the year, i think youll catch some heat and get there

[QUOTE=ButterflySymmetry;47714994]This hand from a moment ago...

Sb: $10 straddler, 60 yr old lag, $3k stack, loves the action.
Me: $1800 stack

2/5/10nl winner straddle in sb.
3 limps to me in HJ, and call w A♦️4♦️. Cut off calls, button folds, straddler checks his option in sb.


5 way to the flop A♥️3♠️5♦️. Checks to me, and I bet $30 into the pot of $50. Sb calls, mp calls.

Pot $140. 3 players to the turn. 2♦️
Sb checks, mp checks, I bet $85 w 2nd nuts and nut flush re draw. Sb blind ch/raises to $310, mp folds, I call.
Thought about re-raising thinking we both may have a 4 and I can free roll diamonds. I was a little concerned about the 46 nuts though.

Pot $760. HU heading to the river 5♣️.
Sb blind leads out $550, and I tank for a bit.

Any thoughts/feedback/critique about this hand.
Do I call or fold river?
?????

Its an obvious shove on the river. You forgot to realise that even if he did have 46 He would "vomit" when you shove. He has a tonne more 4x hands than he does 46 and now you have fold equity.
Obvious flat turn even with your draw and think about what he puts you on...perfect spot to shove river. Shove any pair or 6. And possibly a 4 depending on his bet size

@any2cwrds2008 I actually thought about shoving river for a 30 seconds or so, but I felt it was -ev.
When he leads out $550 otr river after boards pairs, I just didn't think I cd get him to fold for $900 more. His bet on this board show some strength and I felt he wasn't bluffing, so he either had a straight or full. The only hand I can mayb get him to fold is a naked 4, but he is def calling w 46 and fulls. This player may even call w the 4, so no need to risk losing $900 more here.
Against this particular player it was just too risky, and long term losing play in my opinion.
I do like your thinking and almost went for it, but when it came down to it and I thought otherwise. Now in hindisight I wish I wd hv knowing he had K4.

After taking the weekend off, looking forward to getting back at it tomorrow. Hopefully we can start August off in the black.

I can understand why you do not want to shove. This is like 95% of the poker populations thought process here exactly. It is standard. You could probably find this "standard thought process" in a book somewhere Poker is a difficult game and I do believe its best played abc for most of the time unless you can get specific reads on opponents range. I like this spot the most as he can have ALL 4x combos. Next to none fullhouse combos due to his turn raise! He would have to be 20 beers deep to raise the turn with 2 pairs or a set and not even see the str8 there. Most players will bluff complete air rather than 2pairs/sets on that turn. So I still like to shove river as he can have 4x more so than 46 combos and I would never put him on a fullhouse EVER. When you shove river based on the above information I think it is def not -ev and is quite the opposite. In a bubble I think your call is also fine. It is the standard play. Vs a fish/Nit/Reg I think raising the river is def the best play. The only player type I would prefer a flat is vs a LAG pro.

I find that your last sentence "Now in hindisight I wish I wd hv knowing he had K4." reveals somewhere you can learn from. If you know you would shove if you knew he had K4 then you could also start assuming he could have many more 4x combos thus you could start shoving more
Cheers(Luv your thread) Maybe you could add some more chipporn?

I'm nowhere near as good as you guys (ATC and BS) but given the description of the V,

1. is he ever folding a 4 here? (taking out 46)
2. would he take the same line with 2 pair, set, or boat? (does he really only have one gear)
3. Isn't the best case scenario here a chop? How many times is V EVER going to call with worse?

1. yes/sometimes if not folding he will vomit call
2.NO
3.No.Villain wont call with worse vs the str8 but can fold a str8. That is the point

You make money by getting him to fold chops. You'd start by accurately breaking his hands down into combos of the 3 river hand categories (4x,46,FH).

Hand - 4X
This guy called this flop with K4s which is basically a naked gutshot since it's an A-high board a King on future streets is unlikely to be good and he has no BDFD. With that information we can estimate that he would call with every 4x combo dealt to him.

Combos available - 129

Discounts
42s,42o (flopped straight) - 9 combos - I'm not giving him any flopped straights based on flop action - 100% discounted
Combos total - 120

Hand - 46
If he's calling all gutters, he's definitely calling all OESDs.

Combos available - 12
Discounts
None - if he plays 4X like this, he definitely plays 46 like this - 0% discounted
Combos total - 12

Hand - FH
These are tricky. He'd have to play some really strange lines to end up with a river FH.

Combos available - 24
Discounts
AA - (1) 100% discounted PRE and flop
55 - (1) 100% discounted PRE and flop
33 - (3) 100% discounted PRE and flop
22 - (3) We know he calls gutters but I don't think he plays turn like that every time with 222 - 33% discounted (2)

A5s (1) 100% discounted PRE and flop
A5o (3) 100% discounted PRE and flop
53s (1) 100% discounted PRE and flop
53o (5) 100% discounted PRE and flop
52s (2) Gutter draw + pair on flop. Turn 2 pair could think it's best and overplay vs. our Ax - 10% discounted (1.9)
52o (4) Gutter draw + pair on flop. Turn 2 pair could think it's best and overplay vs. our Ax - 10% discounted (3.6)

Combos total - 7.5

Fold Equity Calcs

FH - 0% folds
He calls -$900 * 7.5 = -$6750

64 - 0% folds
He calls -$900 * 12 = -$10800

4x - ??% folds
We need to make up $17550 that we lost shoving into FH's and 46's. We win $1310 each time he folds.
We need to win $1310 13.4 times to make a shove BE/P.

He has 120 combos so ?? = 11.1%

Will he fold 4x 13.4 times out of 120 chances for $900 more?
The math gets better if he ever folds 46, or gets here somehow with air.
The math gets worse if he made it here with more FH combos and fewer 4x combos.

High variance play for sure! We need a read on villain that he isn't super stationy in big pots.

Current Bankroll Pic heading into August



+$30,736

Today: +$197 on 3hrs 19mins, which brings year to date totals, +$30,933

Day 7 of the Pool

nice hole in the ground you throw money into

Fill that pool with 1$ chips and dive in like scrooge

I have played there several times while passing through to Indy. I love the tables and would be happy if they were at all of the casinos. Of course you get the rigged stories, but just like online it is just because of the amount of hands. 2 to 3x the amount of hands, not tipping, no dealer errors, no 5 minute tanks. No confusion on who won and no slow rolling. Certainly makes the game more efficient.

Most players in Indy prefer the Knights of Columbus game. There will always be the type of player that is wary of electronic poker.

Just want to say, great thread. Just read the whole thing over about 3-4 days.

Best to you.

Pool is coming along nicely, I'm sure the family will get a lot of enjoyment out of it. Cool vlogs. 30k YTD is pretty solid, keep it up!

@Daxos @Pure_Aggression thank ya kindly.

Not sure why I'm saying this because every time i mention on here that i been running pretty gd, it's usually followed up w a losing sesh the next day. It seems to happen too often, but i don't believe in this jinx and gonna take my chances on tomorrow.
So far 3 for 3 in August. +$197 on 8/3 (3hrs 19mins), +$228 on 8/4 (5hrs44mins), and today +$34 playing 1/2 on 1hr 21mins and +$342 playing 1/2/5 on 3hrs 26mins. Totaling +$801 w a$57.8 hourly in August so far.
Poker is a sick game though, I cd easily lose all my monthly profits tomorrow. Although, I'm gonna do my best to keep booking winning sessions, and stay hungry at this 6 stacks of high society goal. This is the year to separate the gap between me and the next guy. Even though I am behind the pace on this goal, I am not giving up and still motivated to give it my all.

A little $5 bet w @LiveAction has provided an extra spark to play my very best this month. We both are 3 for 3 in Aug and the first one to have a losing sesh pays the other. It's just $5, but it provides so much more. It's an extra incentive not to lose, and stay focused. It's just a little something to keep me showing up at the felt playing my best. Poker is a job, and like any job it wears on me from time to time. Whatever i can do to get me to the Shoe' playing to my best of my abilities i'm all for it. Win or Lose, it's a $5 investment.
Btw, @LiveAction has a great mind and thinks of things outside the box. His passion to get better, and willingness to put in the work is aw-inspiring. Bol.

Random topics:
-came home today and saw they put the wrong Liner in our pool. After a hour of wavering back and forth...should i say something or should i not, i decided to mention it. I felt bad because i know it was a lot of work for them, but told them it's fine and to leave it as is.
-in the finals of the Club Championships. It's been the longest tennis tourney ever, and finals match isnt until middle of this month. This old man could use the break for his body to recover, but instead playing in another tennis tourney this weekend. A tennis tourney inside a tennis tourney. Gotta stay sharp.
-Coaching my 4 yr old Soccer team. First game 8/15, and shd b interesting.
-made it out of the doghouse last week, but went back in for a couple days after I posted "the haircut" on FB while momma was sleeping. Whem momma woke up, she was embarrassed by the pic, so I ended up deleting it. So far we gd again, and im on gd behavior.
-Big Bro 17 has been a gd season so far. Steve is my sleeper creeper.
-Always been a cubs fan, and hope they can get that wildcard.
-I was laughed at in the poker room because I said i could beat Ronda Rousey when asked by a dealer. I wd never lay my hands on a woman, but I really do think I could win. She is 5'6" 135lbs after all. Maybe we can get that fight at the Shoe' Colosseum. Nevermind, I am never hitting a woman ever! Lucky for her

Same thing tomo...Poker and trying not to lose my husky $5 bet

I have you at +2200 vs Rousey. Sorry man.

Somebody tell that fat lady to remain seated while I cue up the soulful sound of Lenny Kravitz cause, baby, it ain't over 'til it's over...not yet, anyway, but was an eleventh hour sweat today...

Guess y'all might have read about a $5 wager I've got going with @ButterflySymmetry?

"Hey...Let me tell it..."

Was ahead of the game about $300 and just returned to the table from scarfing down a steak wrap from JB's (highly recommended) when the wheels fell off my session (not recommended at all).

Q/Q (moppers) cost me a bit, followed immediately by flopping middle pair +nut flush +gutterball (17 outs) draw that ran out bricks. Ballparkish dumpback of $200 between those 2 hands. Followed that up with a stretch of card death, along with a couple steal attempts that backfired and found myself sitting at +$4 on my last hand.

It's 4:50pm, I'm under the gun and announce before cards are dealt that this will be my last hand.

Peep out my first card (A♦️). Catch card #2 and peep out (Q♦️). For as much as I hate Poker Bingo, the diamond straight flush is still live and, yes, it will complete the bingo...

I open for $12, somewhat concerned with how this one may end up. If I lose this pot, I'm down a minimum of $8 for the session and the butterfly drives off with my slightly used Lincoln.

Summarized version; everybody folds. I happily take down the blinds, toss the dealer a dollar and escape +$6 for the day. Not sure if I try running an oop bluff with A-high if I get callers and brick the flop, but I'm leaning toward thinking; yes, I would.

Opening $12 UTG in a tight 1/2 game should be able to rep an over pair. I think they'd have bought it and must have since they gave me a walk. Somewhat relieved for that, otherwise; I may have dumped $200 running a bluff in an attempt to not lose a $5 bet...lol...what? You don't think I'd do it?

Sucks to win and still feel like a loser, but I think the two hands that eroded my profits were unavoidable. At least I didn't have to pay the butterfly...yet. Although, it's gonna be a tough bet to win against this guy; He plays good, but he's lucky...