What value hands raise apart from sets?

Lots of subtle trolls.

We can have all the sets here and various 2 pair though so raise them up and balance it with some draws.

Your opponents must be printing with cbets when you call BB

The board is 653 rainbow dude, unless you're calling utg raises with 74, 53, 63, 42 then there aren't many value hands on such a board texture.

Legit not trolling :/

Do you mind explaining what's so bad about it as a peel



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What?? We have all sets and 65, those are value hands. Utg doesn't have the hands you mentioned either so we're not concerned about them

Calling off a quarter of your stack 100bb deep with a weak suited connector. Can you explain how that's good?

That's not many value hands compared to most boards.

Well vs a four bet range it becomes a far better peel than JTs KQs etc

If anything when looking at peels vs a four bet range the worst peels are the "best suited connectors"








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Now we can only question if you're trolling because that is not how you figure out which hands to bluff on what flops.

flop raise with 87cc is super super standard. We have straights, sets, 2 pairs the full monty really. You might have misread the hand or something

Also calling 4b with 76s is fine unless you have a reason not to call

More value hands, more bluffs. Fewer value hands, fewer bluffs. He raised with 87 suited which is fine, but knowing rapid he probably raises about 50 other bluff combos because he has fancy play syndrome.

They're all poor calls against the average micro reg. 5bet shove or fold. Mostly fold because you ain't getting bluffed enough at these stakes.

Straights?? Board is 653, you call with 74 and 42 pre??

Two pairs?? 65 suited is 2 measly combos. You call with 63 and 53 pre??

I don't see why you're arguing this. 65s and the 9 combos of sets are more than enough to raise 78s.

btw, in a hurry right now, later will read the discussion lol. From what I see, you guys did a really good job on explaining spinmerightround stuff.

Played really well today!

Some hands

H1: vs reg that is 3-betting quite light and hates to fold. Went with an explo sizing OTR, so good to valueown these stations

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): 104.84 BB
SB: 109.02 BB
BB: 126.84 BB
UTG: 152.58 BB
MP: 98.5 BB
CO: 178.18 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 7 A

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.32 BB, fold, BB raises to 9.4 BB, Hero calls 7.08 BB

Flop: (19.3 BB, 2 players) 2 5 8
BB bets 7 BB, Hero calls 7 BB

Turn: (33.3 BB, 2 players) A
BB checks, Hero checks

River: (33.3 BB, 2 players) 4
BB checks, Hero bets 23.74 BB, BB calls 23.74 BB




H2: vs competent regular. I used to believe it was an explo fold OTR, I think that it's quite a GTO fold, right? Vs someone who is thinking about ranges it's really hard to find so many bluffs OTR, right? He was also on the more conservative side too.

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 54.38 BB
SB: 119.54 BB
BB: 103 BB
UTG: 115.94 BB
MP: 100.86 BB
Hero (CO): 100 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A A

fold, MP raises to 3 BB, Hero raises to 9 BB, fold, fold, fold, MP calls 6 BB

Flop: (19.5 BB, 2 players) 5 4 J
MP checks, Hero bets 6.12 BB, MP raises to 19 BB, Hero calls 12.88 BB

Turn: (57.5 BB, 2 players) 3
MP bets 28 BB, Hero calls 28 BB

River: (113.5 BB, 2 players) T
MP bets 44.86 BB and is all-in, fold

MP wins 109.5 BB


H3: vs reg that made a triple barrel-jam in a 3-bet pot vs me once with an airball hand, I usually fold the river in those spots, but this time I decided not to explo fold, specially with the K blocker and b vs b. I thought he could be able to spew some. Also he probably uses a bigger sizing OTT with his sets. Good call? This guy hates to fold vs me and opens >50% in the SB

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 172.98 BB
SB: 123.68 BB
Hero (BB): 102.5 BB
UTG: 230.22 BB
MP: 98.18 BB
CO: 93.3 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 4 K

fold, fold, fold, fold, SB raises to 3 BB, Hero calls 2 BB

Flop: (6 BB, 2 players) T 6 K
SB bets 3.08 BB, Hero calls 3.08 BB

Turn: (12.16 BB, 2 players) 7
SB bets 7.74 BB, Hero calls 7.74 BB

River: (27.64 BB, 2 players) 7
SB checks, Hero bets 19.7 BB, SB raises to 109.86 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 68.98 BB and is all-in




H4: Hero call!! I'm improving in the weakest area of my game!

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 132.4 BB
Hero (SB): 106.26 BB
BB: 130.3 BB
UTG: 26.02 BB
MP: 106.2 BB
CO: 105.42 BB

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 4 A

fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, BB calls 2 BB

Flop: (6 BB, 2 players) A Q 8
Hero bets 1.88 BB, BB raises to 6 BB, Hero calls 4.12 BB

Turn: (18 BB, 2 players) 2
Hero checks, BB bets 9 BB, Hero calls 9 BB

River: (36 BB, 2 players) 5
Hero checks, BB bets 21 BB, Hero calls 21 BB



H5: going super thin vs whale

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 106.34 BB
SB: 99 BB
Hero (BB): 104.44 BB
UTG: 56.04 BB
MP: 100 BB
CO: 280.8 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has T T

fold, MP raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, fold, Hero calls 2 BB

Flop: (6.5 BB, 2 players) 6 4 2
Hero checks, MP checks

Turn: (6.5 BB, 2 players) 7
Hero bets 4.64 BB, MP calls 4.64 BB

River: (15.78 BB, 2 players) 3
Hero bets 11.26 BB, MP calls 11.26 BB

Snowie's raising strat for lulz (raising to $9.71), note 87cc raised 100%







We really should be past counting pure "value" and "bluff" combos in flop xr spots

Snowie raises a lot of hands. Eg. 6x hands are raised almost 100% of the time. Interesting.

Okay lets say you don't raise 87s here what does your raising range look like on this flop?

I'd call with everything I wanted to continue with and only raise as an exploitative play against particular opponents who I know fold too much/don't fold enough.

I assume you're xfing this then? There is no way you think xcing this is better than xring. Xcing this is gona lead to a lower winrate and a way more ugly red line

Raising 87s on flop is fine but flatting the 3bet oop is awful. You invested 30bb and having to xf most turns, its just weak and crap play. In this spot you need to grow some balls and jam flop, you are 37% against over pairs and if he's a nit like you say he should fold a lot of the time anyway. You are not shy about jamming complete air but when you have 37% your too scared.

Flatting 76s is pretty bad for 100bb. what are you expecting post flop in a 4bet pot when you flop a pair? Just go broke? You rarely outflop his 4bet range, so your just fishing, because you can't afford to peel anything with 100bb stacks most of the time.

I'd xc if the bet wasn't too big or there were good implied odds. I'd xr against players who cbet too much air. It's all opponent dependent. I never said xr is bad, I just said that a xr on that flop reps very few value hands in the eyes of your opponent, so he's going to think you're full of **** a lot of the time.

who 3-bets overpairs OTF UTG vs BB for that sizing? When I get called I'm going always vs sets.
jamming is the worst option, I'm continuing with my range as a call to get value off villains' bluffs

Can you rank here which of those boards do you think I get more credibility for a strong range? UTG vs BB vs his sizing.

AK2r
27Tr
5QTsss
AQ3r
897ss
345ss
A27ss

But your using a hand in your bluff catching range, with good equity but still behind his bluffs and can't continue if villain bets turns. Seems **** to me. Even 3betting sets on that flop IP is bad from villain so I think he most likely thinks your a whale and doing something stupid as usual, so his range consists of bluffs, which makes jamming even more attractive. As played it did seem he had air himself.

Ranking them, probably this order (best to worst): 897ss, 5QTsss, 27Tr, A27ss (depends if the ace is part of the double suit), 345ss, AQ3r, AK2r. 27Tr, A27ss and 345ss all seem quite similar though. The worst ones for raising are those AK and AQ rainbow boards