Ran some tests here

pot = 50

IP EV with overbets and lots of sizings: 32.95
IP EV with 25% only and checks: 31.94
IP EV with 25% sizing range cbet: 31.8

by not having an overbet sizing in there we lost 2.3% of the pot on average with our range, it's not huge, but in reality I can see people making more mistakes vs overbets than small bets in there, not sure if it's worth studying the equilibrium for that specific texture only, because it can be only applied CO/BTN vs BB(people are supposed to slowplay AK pre vs MP/UTG) and that knowledge can't be extrapolated to AQx boards neither.

Hello Rapidesh I just started reading this epic thread (only page 16 atm lol). I was wondering, can you post your lifetime cash game graph since the beginning of this challenge? Just curios to see your results since you put tons of volume. I am myself playing but am at nl2cents right now.

about 42% rfi yeah, monker doesn't open A2o and A3o. It doesn't open hands like 53s, but it opens T6s. any decent reg will prob be a bit higher than monker ranges because of the exploitative opens vs weaker ppl in the blinds.

Show me a human who can calibrate a cb range of checks/33%/ob that can mimic pio and generate the ev it shows for that strategy mix

As soon as you show me someone who does the same while responding to all three mixed freq strats as bb.

Counter argument is that by simplifying flop strat you reduce human error and will realise much closer to the EV pio would realise at equilibrium (100% accuracy in the case of range 25% cbet). In a lot of cases people will sacrifice more than 2.3% of pot share by trying and failing to implement a mixed strat.

If you break the EV differential down by board texture (you can use the 184 sample flop textures that PIO provides to do this) then you will see that there are certain textures where we sacrifice a lot by range cbetting, and other textures where we sacrifice very little. A good way to get ahead of the curve pretty quickly is by learning which is which and trying to implement mixes where it generates low hanging fruit EV.

Just because you can simplify flopstrat by rangecbetting small, doesn't necessarily make the whole gametree that much simpler to play. You could even argue that rangebetting small OTF requires higher frequency of multiple sizings on later streets which makes the game a lot harder for humans to play.

Yeah very true. I did consider basically writing exactly what you’ve said when I first posted, but didn’t want to go to far down the rabbit hole. Suffices to say I agree. In my opinion turn strat is quite a bit more intuitive than flop strat at least, with many hands being frequency mixes on turns that are pure strats on flops, so it’s a bit easier to just get by on intuition.

this is actually a pretty interesting discussion. imo it's much easier for villains to play turns after flop 2/3 which ultimately makes me prefer 1/3 mostly on flops, at least in my pool

Sick strat posts, thanks! As a more conservative person I will always choose simplification over potential EV, if there's one thing that poker taught me during all the time I played this game is that I'm not as good as I think I am and that I can turn into a massive whale out of nowhere lol, so simple = better, bad players will still make mistakes vs simple strategies and better players won't be able to exploit us as much, we will have way less opportunities to mess things up.


13 days without nicotine! Played my first session today and didn't even feel like smoking, it was way easier than I thought. Obv I had support from friends/family/weed, will never go back to that garbage! Going to play mostly 50z this month, will take it easy and focus on not getting stressed, I heard that after 21 days our brains reprogram themselves with this addiction stuff, so won't go nuts until then.

Some hands

H1: someone pointed out that this guy was the worst reg of 50z lol, I thought there were worse guys out there, but I think I might have been wrong about that haha, he snapped the 4-bet and snapped the flop

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 194.5 BB
SB: 100 BB
BB: 167.7 BB
UTG: 206.08 BB
Hero (MP): 121.92 BB
CO: 108.52 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q Q

fold, Hero raises to 2.32 BB, fold, fold, SB raises to 7.96 BB, fold, Hero raises to 22 BB, SB calls 14.04 BB

Flop: (45 BB, 2 players) 5 8 7
SB bets 78 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 78 BB

Turn: (201 BB, 2 players) T

River: (201 BB, 2 players) 7




H2: tight is right!

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 148.12 BB
SB: 299.24 BB
BB: 104.22 BB
UTG: 263.18 BB
MP: 181.92 BB
Hero (CO): 100.58 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A K

UTG calls 1 BB, MP raises to 6 BB, fold, fold, fold, fold, UTG calls 5 BB

Flop: (13.5 BB, 2 players) 5 J 3
UTG checks, MP bets 6.42 BB, UTG calls 6.42 BB

Turn: (26.34 BB, 2 players) 6
UTG checks, MP checks

River: (26.34 BB, 2 players) 8
UTG bets 15 BB, MP calls 15 BB



H3: vaaaaaaaaaaamo!!!

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): 104.5 BB
SB: 201.42 BB
BB: 142.44 BB
UTG: 182 BB
MP: 102.12 BB
CO: 101 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q T

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.32 BB, fold, BB calls 1.32 BB

Flop: (5.14 BB, 2 players) 7 A 8
BB checks, Hero bets 1.22 BB, BB calls 1.22 BB

Turn: (7.58 BB, 2 players) J
BB bets 3.96 BB, Hero raises to 15.3 BB, BB calls 11.34 BB

River: (38.18 BB, 2 players) 5
BB checks, Hero bets 85.66 BB and is all-in, fold

Hero wins 36.28 BB


H4:

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 48.5 BB
SB: 248.8 BB
BB: 104 BB
Hero (UTG): 106.18 BB
MP: 101.5 BB
CO: 108.04 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q Q

Hero raises to 2.32 BB, MP raises to 8.46 BB, fold, BTN raises to 29.2 BB, fold, fold, fold, fold

BTN wins 20.74 BB


H5: so good to station these guys! haha vamo

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 149.4 BB
SB: 100 BB
Hero (BB): 126.74 BB
UTG: 87 BB
MP: 24.86 BB
CO: 94.92 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q Q

fold, fold, fold, fold, SB raises to 3.1 BB, Hero raises to 9.3 BB, SB calls 6.2 BB

Flop: (18.6 BB, 2 players) 4 A 5
SB checks, Hero bets 4.42 BB, SB calls 4.42 BB

Turn: (27.44 BB, 2 players) 3
SB checks, Hero checks

River: (27.44 BB, 2 players) 6
SB bets 19.54 BB, Hero calls 19.54 BB

Ur avatar is not rapidesh

I’m honestly surprised you didn’t fold h1

Delete dis

How does h1 indicate he might be the worst reg in the pool?

Extremely small 3b sizing OOP and call vs 4b (despite getting good pot odds) in a player pool were 4bet bluffs in these positions are basically non-existant?

Im not saying his play is good, but its exactly something id expect from an avarage 50z reg

His play with his hand is fine pre and even postflop it's decent.

The thing is that this guy is defending vs 4-bets so much that it was obvious that I should be 4-betting JJ/AQ+ for value in those positions vs him. By snapping that I think he is just super tilted and defending close 100% of his range OOP in a spot where population underbluffs which is insane.

It is a game where you should play your range and not your actual hand. I highly doubt that you want to use such a small 3bet sizing OOP with your range.

3.5x from the SB it's fine, it would be bad if he did that from the bb imo

why shouldn't different parts of our range use different sizing tho?

Imo the highest EV line in a high rake pool like 50z is it to use one bigger sizing with your whole range. The benefits of such a strategy are: you are negating the positional advantage of the IP player by lowering the SPR (at least to some degree), increasing preflop fold equity and playing less pots OOP in a high rake structure. Also by having just one sizing you are avoiding the need to balance your sizings which makes the strategy more simple.

However, you should go with the strategy that suits you best and is the most profitable vs your pool.

I've decided that I will start putting some reasonable volume from now on and will play some 100z when it's soft. Still won't force volume like crazy, don't wanna stress out much. 21 days clean! Gonna try to study a bit more of pio too

Some hands

H1: vaaaamo! Not sure if this is any good but gotta do it

PokerStars - $1 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 91.9 BB
SB: 242.49 BB
BB: 100 BB
UTG: 136.06 BB
MP: 100 BB
Hero (CO): 133.83 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 5 5

fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.32 BB, fold, SB raises to 8 BB, fold, Hero calls 5.68 BB

Flop: (17 BB, 2 players) T 4 J
SB checks, Hero checks

Turn: (17 BB, 2 players) J
SB bets 9 BB, Hero calls 9 BB

River: (35 BB, 2 players) 7
SB bets 15 BB, Hero raises to 116.83 BB and is all-in, fold

Hero wins 62.5 BB


H2: I like this, gotta turn a lot of crap into bluff in there unless I'm barreling any2 OTT

PokerStars - $1 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 45.42 BB
SB: 141.15 BB
BB: 858.64 BB
Hero (UTG): 111.24 BB
MP: 125.41 BB
CO: 110.39 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A T

Hero raises to 2.32 BB, fold, fold, fold, fold, BB calls 1.32 BB

Flop: (5.14 BB, 2 players) 6 2 J
BB checks, Hero bets 1.22 BB, BB calls 1.22 BB

Turn: (7.58 BB, 2 players) K
BB checks, Hero bets 5.4 BB, BB calls 5.4 BB

River: (18.38 BB, 2 players) T
BB checks, Hero bets 13.1 BB, fold

Hero wins 17.46 BB


H3: vaaaaamo! So good to see bluffs working, specially at 100z

PokerStars - $1 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 155.29 BB
SB: 100.5 BB
Hero (BB): 104.53 BB
UTG: 270.9 BB
MP: 148.45 BB
CO: 223.1 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 4 3

fold, fold, fold, fold, SB raises to 3 BB, Hero calls 2 BB

Flop: (6 BB, 2 players) 6 7 8
SB checks, Hero bets 2.85 BB, SB calls 2.85 BB

Turn: (11.7 BB, 2 players) Q
SB checks, Hero bets 8.34 BB, SB calls 8.34 BB

River: (28.38 BB, 2 players) K
SB checks, Hero bets 37.2 BB, fold

Hero wins 26.96 BB


H4: vs unknown shaping to be a tight fish, good fold? He snap raised, I know I could chop some in there, but not vs the snap imo

PokerStars - $1 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 159.83 BB
SB: 205.16 BB
Hero (BB): 116.12 BB
UTG: 244.25 BB
MP: 104.62 BB
CO: 63.06 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A 3

fold, fold, CO raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, Hero calls 2 BB

Flop: (6.5 BB, 2 players) A K 8
Hero checks, CO checks

Turn: (6.5 BB, 2 players) 4
Hero checks, CO checks

River: (6.5 BB, 2 players) 8
Hero bets 4.64 BB, CO raises to 9.28 BB, fold

CO wins 14.99 BB


H5: vs whale with a note saying "overbluff", never folding, right? So annoying to see that lol

PokerStars - $1 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 96.07 BB
SB: 102.23 BB
BB: 136.72 BB
UTG: 112.93 BB
MP: 142.72 BB
Hero (CO): 100 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 9 K

fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.32 BB, fold, fold, BB calls 1.32 BB

Flop: (5.14 BB, 2 players) 9 4 4
BB bets 2.39 BB, Hero calls 2.39 BB

Turn: (9.92 BB, 2 players) Q
BB bets 6.66 BB, Hero calls 6.66 BB

River: (23.24 BB, 2 players) A
BB bets 20.53 BB, Hero calls 20.53 BB



H6: snap called the river vs this muppet, I used to be so afraid OTR and this is such an easy call vs whales

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): 101.5 BB
SB: 98.34 BB
BB: 100 BB
UTG: 202.3 BB
MP: 100 BB
CO: 48.6 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 6 K

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.32 BB, SB raises to 6.5 BB, fold, Hero calls 4.18 BB

Flop: (14 BB, 2 players) K 5 3
SB bets 6.66 BB, Hero calls 6.66 BB

Turn: (27.32 BB, 2 players) A
SB bets 16.88 BB, Hero calls 16.88 BB

River: (61.08 BB, 2 players) 8
SB bets 68.3 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 68.3 BB



H7: nope

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 212.12 BB
SB: 42.7 BB
BB: 101.5 BB
UTG: 148.34 BB
MP: 254.02 BB
Hero (CO): 141.78 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 8 7

fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.32 BB, fold, fold, BB raises to 7.46 BB, Hero calls 5.14 BB

Flop: (15.42 BB, 2 players) A 7 6
BB bets 4.84 BB, Hero calls 4.84 BB

Turn: (25.1 BB, 2 players) 3
BB checks, Hero checks

River: (25.1 BB, 2 players) Q
BB bets 7 BB, Hero raises to 35.38 BB, fold

Hero wins 37.14 BB


H8: Vs nit 18 vpip nit, I can see merits of folding OTF, but the small sizing could induce some thinner value raises, OTT I just can't see what I beat vs him. Good fold?

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 110.6 BB
SB: 158.52 BB
Hero (BB): 120.26 BB
UTG: 51.3 BB
MP: 306.56 BB
CO: 73.26 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K K

UTG raises to 3 BB, MP calls 3 BB, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 15 BB, UTG calls 12 BB, MP calls 12 BB

Flop: (45.5 BB, 3 players) 8 2 9
Hero bets 10.8 BB, fold, MP raises to 43.22 BB, Hero calls 32.42 BB

Turn: (131.94 BB, 2 players) J
Hero checks, MP bets 63.98 BB, fold

MP wins 127.94 BB

H9: vaaaaaaaaaamo!

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): 100 BB
SB: 99 BB
BB: 345.04 BB
UTG: 104.22 BB
MP: 408.6 BB
CO: 165.7 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q A

fold, fold, CO raises to 3 BB, Hero raises to 9 BB, fold, fold, CO calls 6 BB

Flop: (19.5 BB, 2 players) 9 8 8
CO checks, Hero bets 4.64 BB, CO raises to 19 BB, Hero raises to 91 BB and is all-in, CO calls 72 BB

Turn: (201.5 BB, 2 players) 9

River: (201.5 BB, 2 players) J




H10: a lot of people will fold here and the jam is printing so much, specially vs this guy

PokerStars - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 106.34 BB
SB: 166.4 BB
BB: 535 BB
UTG: 100 BB
Hero (MP): 134.32 BB
CO: 137.88 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K A

fold, Hero raises to 2.32 BB, fold, BTN calls 2.32 BB, fold, fold

Flop: (6.14 BB, 2 players) K Q 5
Hero bets 1.46 BB, BTN raises to 5.84 BB, Hero calls 4.38 BB

Turn: (17.82 BB, 2 players) 9
Hero checks, BTN bets 8.46 BB, Hero calls 8.46 BB

River: (34.74 BB, 2 players) 6
Hero checks, BTN bets 16.5 BB, Hero raises to 117.7 BB and is all-in, fold

Hero wins 64.36 BB

Bad time to start putting in volume cuz zoom just got alot tougher with regular table regs transferring to zoom.

I'm not afraid of reg table regs, imo those who choose reg tables over zoom do it because they can't beat zoom or aren't confident enough in their skills to play it.

Sure that some few competent regs opt for higher winrate and lower swings, but they are the minority. I always enjoyed zoom because it's democratic, there is no scripting/table selecting/ jesus seat.

The only thing that scares me is that stars is going through a lot of creative ideas to increase the rake/reduce skill/reduce edge of regs. I'm afraid in the future they will increase the rake even more. If rake goes up by 1bb/100 in the games I play it will become significantly harder to beat it.

Lol. Some few competent regs. How dare they care about $ over dick swinging. I even hear some of them play other sites