What was your plan if he shoved on the flop? I would prefer to make this play with a hand that has less equity vs his shoving and calling range, a rundown containing a 7 or something. You have top pair plus the second nut over pair, and it’s not as if the 3bettor hand is face up as aces, but you’re oop so I honestly don’t know what the best play is. I’d probably start with a c/c. C/r and fold is problematic since we can have the best hand and when we don’t we have equity, but I also think when we check pot to get it AI we’re getting it in bad vs his stack off range.

If he shoves we have to fold- roughly a pot sized bet left so we need ~33% vs. his range, I think we don't have that vs. pretty much any hand he would shove except a queen and FD which isn't the largest part. Check/calling is the best option, folding is completely out of the question vs. that bet size.

Kinda a lame spot because I don't have enough T7 here, think I have to call river. Could alter my ranges on previous streets to have more T7? Don't think so though, I think this just a cooler (even vs. large sizings). In villain's spot I'm jamming 9 high straight here

Ignition - $2 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha Hi - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (SB): 135.3 BB
BB: 320.79 BB (VPIP: 62.69, PFR: 34.33, 3Bet Preflop: 15.15, Hands: 67)
UTG: 31.48 BB (VPIP: 23.94, PFR: 11.27, 3Bet Preflop: 8.57, Hands: 72)
CO: 98.5 BB (VPIP: 26.09, PFR: 21.74, 3Bet Preflop: 22.22, Hands: 23)
BTN: 101.5 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 50.00, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 3)

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A 9 6 7

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, BB raises to 9 BB, Hero calls 6 BB

Flop: (18 BB, 2 players) 8 6 9
Hero checks, BB bets 14 BB, Hero calls 14 BB

Turn: (46 BB, 2 players) 5
Hero checks, BB bets 33 BB, Hero calls 33 BB

River: (112 BB, 2 players) 3
Hero checks, BB bets 112 BB, Hero calls 79.3 BB and is all-in

Played fine/standard imo. He could easily have the same hand as you or be barreling off, since, like you said, you rarely have 7T when you take this line.

I've seen countless posts on 2+2 in a hand history simply describing villain as "loose" without understanding wtf hero should do about it. Similarly, I've heard players claiming that you should tighten up vs. a loose player plenty of times times throughout my poker career, as well as others swearing by the opposite conjecture. But neither is necessarily true. Phrases such as "too loose" or "tighten up" are way too general to draw concrete conclusions.

The key step that these players are missing is to break it down, and then it's actually very simple to solve for the appropriate adjustments from here. If they are "too loose" by calling too wide behind you, then you want to play tighter and start folding the bottom of your opening range. If they are "too loose" by playing too many hands in front of you, then you want play looser by widening your defending range. Note that the same concept would apply in a HU 3-bet situation- if they're calling "too loose", you tighten your 3-bet range. If they're 3-betting "too loose", you loosen your defend range. And of course, the solution is the same in a postflop situation.

An important note here is that there are frequently multiple factors and it's up to hero to use their judgement to make a decision. For example, let's say you're playing $1/2 live against the archetypal loose-passive rec. They call too loose, but also 3-bet too tight. Your solver-approved adjustments would start to clash here. But then you also have to factor in how prone they are to making postflop mistakes, whether they are eating a sandwich, etc.

Hmmm I see what you're saying but not sure I agree about tightening up in spots. I think it really depends on just how "too loose" they're playing and if they're doing so passively or aggressively. A player playing way too loose pre generally has a lot of glaring leaks postflop too so I would generally loosen my opening standards regardless of position because I want to play as many pots with them as I can. Also, wrt three betting in a heads up spot, if they're calling 3bets too wide, another valid counter-strategy rather than tightening up could be to 3bet as much or even more, but 3bet a more "smooth" range, ie reraise more AT and KJ type hands and fewer 47s type hands.

Regarding the player skill, I briefly mentioned it in the last paragraph but didn't expand. I agree that in most live settings I'm happy opening ~100% on BTN vs two loose-passive recreationals in the blinds for that reason.

Good point on the widening your 3-bet value range, I missed that and also agree completely

Mike Caro said that the further the villan strays from optimum (whether too loose or too tight), the more hands you can play profitably.

This, but don't go nuts on the CO or SB, if you open 72o in the SB and BB calls pre too much, even with postflop mistakes by him will be hard for you to make a profit, specially with a high rake in live poker.

Also KJo and A9s as a 3-bet are more valuable than 67s/A5s, high card value is often stronger than playability vs these players.

Hi guys, life update

I'm lit Aesah, you can call me Hanshu

And holy fk man this thread sucks now. Aesah hasn't really been updating on how things are going because it's embarrassing. I mean, it really isn't that embarrassing to fail; to fail is to human, but yeah, to be irrationally emotional is to human too SO THERE. To clarify, the two of us feel too much anxiety about what [friends, family,strangers] will think about any posts I make from the heart and not "herp derp hey guys I'm doing this now, it's actually pretty cool, k thx bye now". Man Aesah you've been a real trashcan blogger haven't you

So yeah my mood has mostly been trashcan recently, but I'm finally starting to muster the energy to make big strides in improving it. Like revisiting this thread for example, a part of my life that (almost) never failed to bring me joy.

Anyway, while I'm here and actually posting on 2+2, I had a couple major life events that I think have drastically shaped my mood that I haven't shared yet but would like to in the future. Sorry for the teaser (btw wtf how do you guys feel about teasers, I feel like they have to make sense somehow but they feel so troll). Anyway for me, saying I'm going to do something lessens the size of the anxiety wall I have to overcome to actually do that. It's usually still a big wall though, so historically I am horrendous at keeping my promises. Anyway, hope you guys will get to hear about those soon and I think it would be very liberating for myself to share them

Let's try to not suck this time at reviving this thread, ok?

So my first impression was that this is true but not at odds with what I said. I interpreted it to essentially mean if villain playing 20% badly-loose, we can play 10% badly-loose profitably even if it's not the MOST profitable.

But after thinking about it more I don't think this is true at all, because again the terms are too general. For a simple counterexample, lets say you are playing HU against TrollBot who is playing the exact same GTO big blind strategy as you, except on the button he decides to be "too tight" and only open half the number of hands he normally would. For an even more obvious example, let's say we're playing 5bb effectively and our opponent deviates by only opening aces. I'm pretty sure we don't play more hands profitably here.

Agreed on both. You're gonna run into the situation a lot more where you're trying to stack off with top pair and having the kicker matters (or the kicker is the one making the top pair).

Also I feel like I haven't thanked the fans properly at all recently, seriously I appreciate so much for everyone who posts in this thread, seeing new guys, as well as guys who have posted 5, 10, or even more times in here, i don't really feel like coming up with any fancy way to say this but yeah it means a ton to me

^ ok sobered up a bit, lol

*reads what I wrote* passing the buck to the inebriation, I see, very smooth play there, HANSHU, one would assume nothing in your life is ever your fault

(By the way, did you guys know that the phrase may have originated from poker?)

Anyway, the most recent life event that crushed me was that I reapplied to Riot Games and was rejected. This had been in the works since December 2018, and I suppose I didn't want to post about it since yeah, blah blah failure = embarrassing, etc. At any rate, I ended up doing the exact opposite of the interview advice I gave a couple years back. In retrospect, I have no idea why I didn't prepare more, tbh I was kinda in an exhausting/interesting travel situation which is why I'm glad I'm finally "settled" again. I just didn't have a lot of confidence in "being myself", for good reason I suppose.

Either way, it was distressing, my final interview panel had 10 total people with 7 of whom I would say I know pretty well and were rooting for me going into it. Some of my friends outside the Riot circle expressed shock that I wasn't hired in this scenario, but the way I look at it is that there are a ton of people on that panel that I trust, and it was obvious in their eyes I was near my rock bottom and, while it's true I loved most of my time at Riot, it was also the "easy way out" for me. (btw, I think I am a very lucky person and my rock bottom is not too low to what most others have experienced). So yeah, I was disappointed, but it's also been a wake up call as well.

I just want everything to be OK again, and I think trying to be a bit more honest to myself (I'm expecting I'll call upon Hanshu- a nickname a friend bestowed upon my blazed alter ego- in the future soon, he's better at that), making concrete progress in this thread, will help a lot.

Hanshu had written quite a few posts intended for this thread, but they were never posted. RIP. What have I been afraid of? So sad, so stupid in retrospect. Ah well. Gotta work for the upswing.

I think at least for the short term I will be focusing on poker again, a mixture of live 5/5 or 5/10 NLHE, 5/5/10 PLO, 1/2 PLO online, and who knows, probably not but I could even dip back in some NLHE online too

Wanted to elaborate a bit more on what I perceive to be my failures here. So right, I didn't have a lot of confidence, I was afraid to go for the more "out there" creative answers that I fearlessly delivered the first time around, I also know many people personally on the panel and tried to cater to them, for a specific example on the topic of leadership, I know one of the people interviewing me- who I actually disagreed (respectfully) with on so many workplace philosophies- believed strongly in "leading by example", and I just fk'ing went for it and spouted some **** I thought he would like. I honestly couldn't even believe the words that were coming out of my mouth, I felt like a fk'ing yes-man at that moment. OK I KNOW I'M RANTING ABOUT THIS AGAIN, BUT **** DUDE EVEN HELLO KITTY ISLAND ADVENTURE HAS AN OPTION TO TOGGLE THE PROFANITY FILTER OFF. It just isn't as... expressive, to use fk, you know? It was a miserable feeling. I hope I never do that ever again.

Similarly, I've been feeling the same way posting in this thread. I feel like I just want to give a "safe" update, like hey I'm alive, here's vaguely what I'm doing, here's some soulless poker hands. I haven't felt confidence to just say how I really feel, but I guess now perhaps the floodgates are breaking.

Welcome back, Aesah. Glad to have you posting as you again, and not just some PLO I don't understand.

Sorry things didn't work out with Riot.

Thanks. I do feel liberation getting some of these thoughts down on paper, but there is still a long way to go

The biggest leak in my poker game, all the way into 2019, is still how easily I am tilted. When a few things don't go my way, my brain just like is so fixated on those things and stops being able to poker good. I've become decent at recognizing it and packing up my session, but that cuts short too many sessions for my liking. I'm still struggling with finding a solution to this, which mainly involves #1) improving my C-game, and/or #2) figuring out some way to trick variance into signing a peace treaty with me. I always figure that "more volume" is the best solution to #2, but then I run into the issue where I'm tilted and NOW WHAT? In the past, I've viewed it as an opportunity to practice #1, but that hasn't worked out well for me.

So my goal for my next week in poker, is to try to implement playing MUCH tighter when I'm tilted. Think this is a pretty critical step for my progression here.

~~~~

To be fair, let's also share something I think I'm good at. LIVE poker A game, specifically LIVE. In the past few years, I've surrounded myself with poker friends who think you should never 3-bet 83o in live midstakes (probably because most good players think that, sigh), and I had let them convince me of that. But now I gotta believe in myself, and I think they are completely wrong.

There is so much information out there, I mean just for example, how many times have you met up with a friend and they IMMEDIATELY know something is off, or vice versa (for me the latter is actually kinda rare because I suck at that). How many times do you think OtB_RedBaron/etc. squeezed out a +EV solver-disapproved hero play against another top player purely based on a timing tell, literally a piece of information so microscopic it can be conveyed with a single number. Now imagine yourself, a serious student of poker with thousands of hours of experience, making a hero play against a recreational player who cares more about who wins the boxing match on TV when you are sitting 5 feet away from him. I mean it's not THAT uncommon for some flustered recreational nit to LITERALLY sigh like "ah I don't want to play this hand but Piosolver Norman Chad said I should open it" then raise the button, now think of all the other equivalent spots that exist everywhere.

So yeah, I owe everyone who told me not to ever 3-bet 83o a big fk you It's fine though, because even though I've missed out on quite a few well-deserved fk yous (e.g., everyone who led me to believe that bovada 1/2 was <50% fish), I owe them so many more that I failed to give too (sorry about that. Thanks everyone ).

~~~~~

Talking to my good friend Rinky (who also has a PGC) and they suggest therapy, I feel like this thread is my therapy (for the record, I definitely think some nice actual therapy would help a lot, but it's also an investment with some variance as I've been disappointed before)

At a meetup where I didn't know anyone beforehand, something I haven't done in awhile. Been feeling like I really badly need to start hammering down the walls of my comfort zone

What's your normal limit?
How many hands at this limit and what winrate?
How far do you think you've progressed since you created this thread?
Are you still FT poker or working again?

Stop playing PLO?

I love this thread. Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts.

The loose-player philosophy could make for an entire book. I'm a poker noob, but I think starting hands have built in values that change in proportion to the action in front. Conceptual gto, not giving a f-k about what our opponents do has merit, I think the main answer is to increase our sizing with the top of our range, and decrease sizing with the bottom, and not change hand selection at all. I'm curious if this is terrible sounding .

Playing tighter (or at least not playing looser or more recklessly) when stuck big or on tilt is such a crucial skill I didn’t learn until way too late into my poker career.

No, this is correct. Few will agree with you.

Welcome to the forums.

Right now I'm not sure but I think I'm going to focus on 1/2 PLO online (despite my rant yesterday about my best skills being specific to live poker- I want to challenge myself/keep it fresh/not use up too much of my limited social energy in casinos too). If I end up playing live more, I would probably make 5/5/10 PLO at Commerce my primary game.
I have about ~30k hands in my Ignition database. More hands on Global but no tracking software allowed there
Good question. Personally, I think I had a ton of growth earlier in the thread, but the majority of the past 2 years has been regression. Humans (well, at least this one) are fragile creatures.

However, I can take that experience and slingshot my progression even faster once I manage to turn around, and I do feel like my orbit is finally starting to bend towards the right direction again.

Poker-wise, I generally always devote a decent amount of time no matter what to improving my game, but being in a life downswing = low confidence = bad poker play sometimes.
Again unsure, but I think I want to focus on poker full time in the near future.

Damn, you're actually too smart. I'll consider it

I mean this is like, 4 days away from this thread's 7-year anniversary (whoa... wtf?) and I'm just now attempting to implement that. I'm sure I came to that conclusion at some point that it would be good to do, but I definitely haven't been doing it.

So yeah. PROGRESSION!