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Old 09-08-2012, 02:51 PM   #76
tmckendry
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Played a slightly losing 1 hour session this morning. Few hands of interest..

Hand 1;

Villain is 80/4 over 50ish hands, agfrq of ~40.

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

Hero (BTN): $14.17
SB: $6.73
BB: $56.97
UTG: $12.05
CO: $29.47

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has A 7 2 A

fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.40, fold, BB calls $0.30

Flop: ($0.90, 2 players) 4 8 9
BB bets $0.50, Hero calls $0.50

Turn: ($1.90, 2 players) K
BB bets $0.50, Hero calls $0.50

River: ($2.90, 2 players) 6
BB bets $0.50, Hero calls $0.50

BB shows A 8 3 4 (Two Pair, Eights and Fours)
BB wins $3.64

Pretty sure river is a sigh fold or pot raise. Any merit for pot raising vs a 80/4 this river? His hand looks so face up as 2p to me..

Hand 2;

This is the biggest b/f I've ever made. Villain is 24/13 with 20% open in CO and 69% foldt3b, 40 agg Fr over 300 hands

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

Hero (BTN): $18.19
SB: $10.83
BB: $11.75
UTG: $14.35
CO: $11.64

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has T A A K

fold, CO raises to $0.40, Hero raises to $1.40, fold, BB calls $1.30, CO calls $1.00

Flop: ($4.30, 3 players) 8 4 K
BB checks, CO checks, Hero bets $2.50, fold, CO raises to $10.24 and is all-in, fold

CO wins $8.68

I have the blocker to KK, and I have the nut spade blocker. If I range KK, K8BB, 88MM, 8765

Omaha Hi Simulation ?
1,595,720 trials (Exhaustive)
board: Ks8s5d
Hand Equity Wins Ties
KK**, K8$B$B, 88$M$M, 85$M$M 77.89% 1,242,349 1,026
AsAdKcTd 22.11% 352,345 1,026

It's -EV if I put him on this range.

If I put a bit more draws in his range, it becomes neutral EV, -EV after rake;

Omaha Hi Simulation ?
3,091,400 trials (Exhaustive)
board: Ks8s5d
Hand Equity Wins Ties
KK**, K8$B$B, 88$M$M, 85$M$M, 867* 69.38% 2,144,282 1,026
AsAdKcTd 30.62% 946,092 1,026

... Yeah, I've been snapping these off left and right vs tightish passivish players and always running into KK**/88** or pair+NFD. If his agg freq was over 50, I'd cawl.
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Old 09-09-2012, 07:11 PM   #77
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Played 2 session today, 1k hands combined. Going for a 4 session day + concert.



Happy about the red-line. Unhappy with a few hands...

Hand1;

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BB: $5.00
UTG: $6.91
MP: $12.90
Hero (CO): $10.13
BTN: $9.05
SB: $8.59

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has A K K 2

fold, MP raises to $0.30, Hero raises to $1.10, BTN calls $1.10, fold, fold, MP calls $0.80

Flop: ($3.50, 3 players) 6 Q 4
MP checks, Hero bets $2.00, BTN calls $2.00, fold

Turn: ($7.50, 2 players) 5
Hero checks, BTN bets $3.80, Hero raises to $7.03 and is all-in, BTN calls $2.15 and is all-in

River: ($19.40, 2 players) 2

Hero shows A K K 2 (One Pair, Kings) (Pre 60%, Flop 21%, Turn 13%)
BTN shows Q 5 6 7 (Two Pair, Queens and Sixes) (Pre 40%, Flop 79%, Turn 88%)
BTN wins $18.11

Villain is 80/4 agg fr of 35

SNAP FOLD ON THE TURN.. sigh such spew.

Hand 2:

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BTN: $10.84
SB: $10.68
BB: $31.17
Hero (UTG): $9.80
MP: $30.35
CO: $9.40

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has Q J A 9

Hero raises to $0.40, fold, fold, fold, SB calls $0.30, BB raises to $1.60, Hero calls $1.20, SB calls $1.20

Flop: ($4.80, 3 players) K T 3
SB checks, BB bets $4.80, Hero raises to $8.20 and is all-in, fold, BB calls $3.40

Turn: ($21.20, 2 players) 3

River: ($21.20, 2 players) 2

BB shows A 6 A Q (Flush, Ace High) (Pre 71%, Flop 80%, Turn 93%)
Hero shows Q J A 9 (One Pair, Threes) (Pre 29%, Flop 20%, Turn 7%)
BB wins $19.79

Easy fold on the flop.. <30% vs AA**.

Hand 3;

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 4 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

Hero (UTG): $10.06
BTN: $9.48
SB: $4.96
BB: $10.10

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has J 3 4 A

Hero raises to $0.30, BTN calls $0.30, SB calls $0.20, BB calls $0.20

Flop: ($1.20, 4 players) 2 J 4
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $1.20, BTN calls $1.20, fold, fold

Turn: ($3.60, 2 players) K
Hero bets $3.00, BTN calls $3.00

River: ($9.60, 2 players) 9
Hero checks, BTN bets $4.98 and is all-in, Hero calls $4.98

Hero shows J 3 4 A (Two Pair, Jacks and Fours) (Pre 43%, Flop 68%, Turn 78%)
BTN shows 9 7 A Q (One Pair, Nines) (Pre 57%, Flop 32%, Turn 23%)
Hero wins $18.26

Hands 1/2 were both played terrible. I seem to spew a ridiculous amount in 3b pots. IMO hand 2 is a fold preflop, and a fold on the flop, MAYBE peel the flop and fold on any turn I dont improve. Anyways both were huge spew and cost me ~1.5BIs.

Hand 3 I really liked how I played. Villain has agg freq of 60 and I dont think villain is ever value shoving queens up on the river, so I'm only beating a busted draw which is most of his range imo.

Things that need to be worked on:

1- my button play.
2- playing flops with an SPR <2 with marginal hands.
3- Semi-bluffing fish

1 - Confession; I'm losing money in the button. It's over ~20k hand sample. Thats roughly 3k hands on the button, and I'm losing. I play ~40/30/9. The stats look fine, but I play the button because its the button and I think I can leverage position. The truth is, I can't leverage position profitabily and just own myself. On the contrary, I'm quite good OOP. I am winning in the blinds.

I need to work on identifying the correct times to 3b light opens (dont do it if a fish limped or a 70/5 is in the blinds). I should stop doing it with hands like KsKTs8. Secondly, need to cbet the flop more on the button. cbet is under 60%, turn cbet under 40%. Can't leverage position if I'm not betting, right?


2- Hands 1/2 in this post and a slew of other unposted and posted hands I lose are in 3bet pots with <2 SPR. I flop any piece and snap jam. Basically pissing away money. Need to take my time and mostly fold. Need to eralize that getting it in with an SPR<2 with 35-40% with 0FE is not going to make much money for me after rake in the long run.

3- Basically im betting with btm 2 pair/low straight on the turn when the flop is checked through mostly better is calling and worse isn't folding, I have almost no SDV OOP, and I have to act first on the river. I do this occasionally as a steal attempt 3 handed when in the blinds and the fish is in position. I can continue doing this IP, but need to be more careful oop.
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:48 PM   #78
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Todays graph;



Winning 0.11BB/100 on the btn, and .38 & .39BB/100 in the blinds.. obv.

Best hand of the day;

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

MP: $3.50
CO: $9.49
BTN: $6.65
SB: $7.17
Hero (BB): $10.00
UTG: $13.27

SB posts SB $0.10, Hero posts BB $0.10, MP posts DB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.30) Hero has A A J J

fold, MP raises to $0.30, fold, BTN calls $0.30, SB calls $0.20, Hero raises to $1.50, MP calls $1.20, BTN calls $1.20, fold

Flop: ($4.80, 3 players) 2 7 3
Hero bets $3.50, fold, BTN raises to $5.15 and is all-in, Hero calls $1.65

Turn: ($15.10, 2 players) A

River: ($15.10, 2 players) 2

BTN shows K 3 K 8 (Flush, King High) (Pre 27%, Flop 95%, Turn 78%)
Hero shows A A J J (Full House, Aces full of Twos) (Pre 73%, Flop 5%, Turn 23%)
Hero wins $14.10

Second best;

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BB: $11.18
UTG: $9.76
MP: $10.00
CO: $10.97
BTN: $13.74
Hero (SB): $12.42

Hero posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has J 5 A J

fold, fold, CO raises to $0.30, fold, Hero calls $0.20, BB calls $0.20

Flop: ($0.90, 3 players) J 2 T
Hero bets $0.60, fold, CO calls $0.60

Turn: ($2.10, 2 players) 9
Hero bets $1.00, CO calls $1.00

River: ($4.10, 2 players) T
Hero checks, CO bets $1.50, Hero raises to $8.60, CO calls $7.10

CO shows 7 T Q T (Four of a Kind, Tens) (Pre 41%, Flop 10%, Turn 23%)
Hero shows J 5 A J (Full House, Jacks full of Tens) (Pre 59%, Flop 90%, Turn 78%)
CO wins $19.88

Gross. Take that down on every non-T river, lose stack on {T} river.



Only 2 spews over 1.3k hands-- Not bad. Would like to get this down to 1/1k hands, and eventually lower..


Read a nice article on playing in 3b pots; http://en.donkr.com/Articles/plo-fro...---part-11-683 The method of analysis in this article is awesome. I plan on utilizing the same approach in a few 3b pots tomorrow. I didn't even know some of the propokertool annotation like "!" to remove and ( ). Sweeeeet.

Going to Montreal next week to check out the live scene. Noiccccccce.
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Old 09-11-2012, 08:24 PM   #79
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Played bad and won.




Made tons of mistakes.. mostly bad calls, still won.
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Old 09-12-2012, 04:55 PM   #80
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Played a long session, played well and lost 4.5 BIs.

One interesting hand;

Villain is 58/30/18 with 24% 3b from the SB over 140 hands. 0% 4bet over 140 hands.

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BB: $14.76
UTG: $12.73
MP: $9.40
Hero (CO): $16.49
BTN: $18.63
SB: $12.72

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has 9 J T 8

fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.40, fold, fold, BB raises to $1.30, Hero raises to $3.00, BB raises to $9.10, Hero calls $6.10

Flop: ($18.30, 2 players) 4 Q 4
BB bets $5.66 and is all-in, fold

BB wins $17.08

Against AA** I have 43.5% equity, given a pot of $6.00 and $13.50 behind, a 6bjam is +EV. .435($19.50) - .565($13.50) = 8.48-7.64 = +$0.84, or 0EV after rake.

What about calling a 5b and folding any flop we complete miss? This is extremely -EV If villain is ever 5betting without AA**, because hes going to pick up a 180bb pot 22% of the time..

If his range is exactly AA** we need to call $6.10:$12.20 and villain has $5.56 behind. With $5.56 behind on the flop, we need to have 19.1% equity to continue which we achieve on 78% of flops.

This is where the math gets tricky and I get lost. I found out how to get average equity by eyeballing the HvR on propokertools or using PQL on propokertools.com. Our average equity when equity is over 19.1% is 52%.

Now we take average equity * final pot size - cost to call = .52 * $29.62 - $5.66 = $9.74
$9.74 is the average amount won when we call postflop.

We call 78% of the time, so we win, on average $7.60. It costs $6.10 to call pre flop, so calling and playing perfectly postflop is +EV of $1.50.

This makes some assumptions, first off, villain always has AA**. Any time villain doesnt have AA**, the calcs change. Were actually doing better vs AA** than top 4% of hands, (43.5% vs 41.9%), which makes getting it in pre .419*19.5 - .581*13.5 = $.33..

Secondly, we assume were playing perfectly postflop. On a flop like; Jc5c4c do we call vs AA**? I would. And on average, we have 22.4% equity. What about As5d6c ? Do we call on this flop? I'd fold, but against AA** we have 19.3% equity, so its a call. So, the further we play from perfectly postflop, the less +EV it becomes.

All these calcs dont seem to get me anywhere. I think that just calling the 3b and playing poker with an SPR of 7-8 in position vs a bad opponent with a widish range is more +EV than getting into these 4b/5b spots. Like way more +EV.
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Old 09-13-2012, 01:31 AM   #81
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Got owned today. really bad. Accfording to this graph its one of my worst days ever.



Surprisingly, felt like I played alright. Not great, but okay. Sure, made a few mistakes, but can't belive my allin EV was -7.5BIs.

Few hands..

Hand1:

Merge - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

Hero (BTN): $31.72
SB: $10.15
BB: $19.96
UTG: $10.00
MP: $7.86
CO: $2.88

SB posts SB $0.05, BB posts BB $0.10, UTG posts DB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.25) Hero has Q 5 A A

UTG checks, MP raises to $0.45, fold, fold, Hero raises to $1.60, fold, fold, UTG calls $1.50, MP calls $1.15

Flop: ($4.95, 2 players) K 9 2
UTG checks, MP bets $4.95, Hero raises to $19.80, UTG calls $8.40 and is all-in, MP calls $1.31 and is all-in

Turn: ($28.01, 2 players) 9

River: ($28.01, 2 players) 8

Hero shows Q 5 A A (Two Pair, Aces and Nines) (Pre 65%, Flop 9%, Turn 3%)
UTG shows K 5 Q K (Full House, Kings full of Nines) (Pre 15%, Flop 87%, Turn 97%)
MP shows A K 2 4 (Two Pair, Kings and Nines) (Pre 21%, Flop 5%, Turn 0%)
UTG wins $22.54
UTG wins $4.07

I was a bit lost here. The guy flatting my 3b is fishy, original raiser is aggro donk. Need 35% vs aggro donk to call if its HU...

Omaha Hi Simulation ?
600,000 trials (Randomized)
board: Kh2h9c
Hand Equity Wins Ties
AhAsQs5d 26.49% 158,747 342
24hh, K2**, K9**, 29**, 9Thh 73.51% 440,911 342

Yeah, tis a fold. Of course ran into worse case scenario...

Hand2:

Merge - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

SB: $38.80
BB: $7.96
UTG: $15.75
Hero (MP): $19.62
CO: $7.36
BTN: $8.70

SB posts SB $0.05, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero has 7 7 6 A

fold, Hero calls $0.10, fold, fold, SB raises to $0.40, BB calls $0.30, Hero calls $0.30

Flop: ($1.20, 3 players) 6 7 T
SB bets $0.80, BB calls $0.80, Hero raises to $3.40, SB calls $2.60, BB calls $2.60

Turn: ($11.40, 3 players) 9
SB checks, BB bets $2.50, Hero calls $2.50, SB raises to $12.90, BB calls $1.66 and is all-in, fold

River: ($22.22, 2 players) Q

SB shows K 8 8 3 (Flush, King High) (Pre 45%, Flop 15%, Turn 0%)
BB shows T 4 J A (Flush, Ace High) (Pre 55%, Flop 85%, Turn 100%)
BB wins $21.11

Yeah.. both players a fishy, one is aggro fish. Not sure if I should call or fold turn.. close imo.. lol @ turn card.. sigh.

Hand3:

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG: $10.24
MP: $23.57
Hero (CO): $10.36
BTN: $6.78
SB: $2.28
BB: $10.00

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has T 9 9 T

UTG calls $0.10, MP raises to $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, BTN calls $0.50, SB calls $0.40, fold, fold

Flop: ($2.20, 4 players) 6 8 7
SB bets $1.78 and is all-in, MP calls $1.78, Hero raises to $9.32, BTN calls $6.28 and is all-in, fold

Turn: ($18.32, 3 players) J

River: ($18.32, 3 players) 4

Hero shows T 9 9 T (Straight, Jack High) (Pre 42%, Flop 39%, Turn 56%)
BTN shows J A 8 8 (Flush, Jack High) (Pre 34%, Flop 61%, Turn 44%)
SB shows 5 5 2 K (Flush, Seven High) (Pre 24%, Flop 0%, Turn 0%)
BTN wins $8.70
BTN wins $8.40

Notice, 39% on the flop. pretty gross.


Yeah, still leaking money calling off my stack in 3b pots when SPR<2. Can't seem to give any of the donks credit when they donk.

Button is still my biggest losing position, would double my winrate if I open folded every button in the last 7k hands I've played.

Strange times...
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Old 09-14-2012, 02:33 PM   #82
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Played a couple short session yesterday, ran above allin EV again, allin EV was <10BB/100.

Still quite discouraged I can't win more $$$.



I played an interesting hand yesterday in which I learned the power of the button through rape. It's on my other database which I am too lazy to merge with my main database. Anyways, the hand went like this;

Hero has AhAsTd3c, 1 limper in MP, hero raises to $.50 in MP, BTN calls, limper calls.

Flop: Jh 7s 2h

Hero bets $1.50, btn calls, limper folds.

Turn ($4.50): 3c

Hero checks, villain bets $3, hero calls?

River ($10.50) 2d

Hero checks, villain bets $6, hero calls??

Villain shows As236s, scoops.

Whats interesting is he gets value from my bluffcatchers (assuming I have QQ-AA) if a 2, 3, or 6 hits the turn, and any time a 8-Q peels off I check, he bets, he wins. It's extremely hard to combat this. The only way I can combat this is by cbetting bigger to increase floating price, and to occasionally check the top of my range on the turn to c/r (this is something I do already vs aggro opps).

In contrast, I should start calling opens on the btn and floating more liberally. At present a lot of my btn flatting range is 77-QQ. These are actually the worst hands to flat with because they are "nutty". You can't float as liberally if you miss your set-- you have no equity. My main issue is if a hand is 3 or 4 ways, I have trouble floating because I fear a c/r from behind or a flat and I'm lost on when to steal. I need to get over this. Floating in 2/3-way pots with a plan and a piece = +EV.

No PLO next 2 days. NLH weekend. Will be listening to some Bart Hanson, viewing HH on LLSNL, and heading to casino tonight.
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Old 09-15-2012, 02:47 PM   #83
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Goddamn holdem rust.. Played bad, lost $291 over 8 hours. Triple barrel bluffed a fish on a good board run out; 64h2cc Kc Jc with AQhh, got called with 55. In all fairness, he was getting 4:1 on the river due to a straddled pot probably could overpot jammed turn :\..

Also called a donk into 2 players with a set on a 3-flush board from a nit. was getting 3.5:1, needed 50:1 to call.

I'm reminded of how profitable NLH is. Even after a week of not playing I am out of "the zone" and into "the zone" where decent players are. Consider each table has only 2-3 decent players and 4-5 donkeys and voila, $40-50/hr!

Going back tonight.
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Old 09-16-2012, 03:22 PM   #84
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Last night was much better. Super black english baller fish was sitting on $18k at a $1k cap game. He left with $1.5k, I won $1.5k in the following hand;

maniac raises to $25, black english baller fish 3bets to $75, hero 4bets to $225 with AhKc, black english baller fish calls.

Flop($450)

Ac 8c 7c

Hero bets $225, villains calls

Turn ($900) 5s

Hero bets $450, villains calls

River ($1800) ; 2d



Hero jams remaining $400, villain calls

Hero shows AK, villain shows A9. scooooop.


Hand2:

straddle on, fish limps in LP, hero completes with AQhh, BB completes, maniac raises straddle to $25, fish calls, hero raises to $150, maniac calls.

Flop($335)

9 9d 8 r

Hero checks, villain checks,

Turn($335): 4d

Hero checks, villain bet $275, hero calls

River($885) 6r

Hero checks, villain bets $360, hero calls

Villain says "your good" shows JTo, hero flips over AQs and the table gasps

Rawwwwwwr +$2.2k 7.5 hours.


PLO-aments recommence today. Gonna review 2-3 hands in the low stakes thread, watching "Crushing PLO25" by DJross, then play.
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Old 09-16-2012, 06:29 PM   #85
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

First session





Had a couple turn call river fold hands that should have been turn folds. Aside from that, played well, got owned.
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Old 09-17-2012, 04:28 PM   #86
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Played alright this morning, huge winning session.



OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG: $12.96
CO: $10.00
Hero (BTN): $25.17
SB: $45.93
BB: $17.04

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has 7 J 9 5

fold, CO calls $0.10, Hero raises to $0.40, fold, fold, CO calls $0.30

Flop: ($1.00, 2 players) 2 4 2
CO checks, Hero bets $0.60, CO calls $0.60

Turn: ($2.20, 2 players) T
CO checks, Hero checks

River: ($2.20, 2 players) K
CO bets $2.20, Hero raises to $6.00, fold

Spoiler:


OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

MP: $10.00
CO: $10.00
BTN: $7.63
SB: $22.67
BB: $3.38
Hero (UTG): $13.88

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has J 7 J 4

Hero calls $0.10, fold, fold, BTN calls $0.10, SB checks, BB checks

Flop: ($0.40, 4 players) J 7 8
SB bets $0.20, BB raises to $0.40, Hero calls $0.40, fold, SB calls $0.20

Turn: ($1.60, 3 players) 8
SB checks, BB bets $1.60, Hero calls $1.60, SB raises to $3.20, BB calls $1.28 and is all-in, Hero raises to $13.38 and is all-in, SB calls $10.18

River: ($31.24, 3 players) K

Spoiler:


OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BTN: $9.04
SB: $33.05
Hero (BB): $17.39
UTG: $5.16
MP: $1.65
CO: $10.79

SB posts SB $0.10, Hero posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has T J J 4

UTG calls $0.10, fold, CO raises to $0.40, BTN calls $0.40, SB calls $0.30, Hero calls $0.30, UTG calls $0.30

Flop: ($2.00, 5 players) 6 5 J
SB checks, Hero bets $2.00, fold, fold, BTN calls $2.00, fold

Turn: ($6.00, 2 players) 4
Hero bets $6.00, BTN raises to $6.64 and is all-in, Hero calls $0.64

River: ($19.28, 2 players) 2

Spoiler:


Montreal tmrw for some live pokers. Heard there is a NLH/PLO $1/3 mixed game !
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Old 09-20-2012, 12:48 PM   #87
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Played some $1/2 $500cap PLO in montreal. Game was playing super loose so basically nut peddled for 4 hours. Got into one huge hand. Have KJ9Tddss on the btn, double straddle, 3 limpers in front, I make it $60, 4 callers, Flop ($250) QdTd8c Villain ($400) donks $125, I jam, villain folds, I pick up $375 ^^

For online PLO.. This month I've logged 12.2k hand and profit is at $115.02 or 4.71BB/100. I've got 7.8k hands to go for the month, hope to raise WR to over 5BB/100, but that isn't going to be a focal point.

For the rest of today.. an hour of reviewing hands, figure out area(s) of improvement, and play 2-3 sessions.
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Old 09-20-2012, 04:13 PM   #88
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Played 2 sessions, one -$20, one +$25. +$25 session was HUDless and I can't seem to import it in PT3? lame.

Spent 2:26 housekeeping PT3.. maybe too much data?
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Old 09-21-2012, 01:00 PM   #89
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tmckendry View Post
Played 2 sessions, one -$20, one +$25. +$25 session was HUDless and I can't seem to import it in PT3? lame.

Spent 2:26 housekeeping PT3.. maybe too much data?
Seems perma-lost? Damn. Oh well, have -2BI bias in my PT3 sample.

Rockin' sess this morning, played my best PLO ever. No mistakes, rocking moves..



^_^
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Old 09-23-2012, 12:54 PM   #90
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Worst live NLH session is a couple months.. -$1200 in 5.5 hours. Breaking for the rest of the week to reach PLO volume goal..
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Old 09-23-2012, 03:17 PM   #91
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Bleh.. Meh session. One hand I was really lost..



OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

Hero (BTN): $10.89
SB: $15.71
BB: $13.08
UTG: $9.80
MP: $10.62
CO: $3.50

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10, CO posts DB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.30) Hero has A T Q 7

fold, MP calls $0.10, CO checks, Hero raises to $0.60, fold, fold, MP calls $0.50, fold

Flop: ($1.50, 2 players) A 7 4
MP checks, Hero bets $1.25, MP calls $1.25

Turn: ($4.00, 2 players) 5
MP checks, Hero bets $2.00, MP raises to $6.00, Hero calls $4.00

River: ($16.00, 2 players) 4
MP bets $2.77 and is all-in, fold

Spoiler:


Villain is 68/0 agg fac of 20.. so, super loose passive. It feels so gross folding getting 6:1 on the river. The real question is, do you check this behind vs a super loose passive type?

This hand was also pretty gross;

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

CO: $9.70
BTN: $9.04
SB: $22.28
BB: $19.01
UTG: $10.00
Hero (MP): $21.75

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has A K 7 A

fold, Hero raises to $0.40, fold, fold, SB calls $0.30, fold

Flop: ($0.90, 2 players) 9 6 A
SB checks, Hero bets $0.90, SB calls $0.90

Turn: ($2.70, 2 players) Q
SB checks, Hero bets $2.70, SB calls $2.70

River: ($8.10, 2 players) 4
SB bets $4.10, fold

Spoiler:


Hand3:

Check flop? Villain is 50/5, f2cb of 55%.. figure he's folding this flop 70%+.. When he raises, can I get away?

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

Hero (BTN): $10.00
SB: $11.33
BB: $5.92
UTG: $16.20
CO: $3.90

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has 4 9 9 A

fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.40, fold, BB calls $0.30

Flop: ($0.90, 2 players) 6 3 5
BB checks, Hero bets $0.60, BB raises to $2.50, Hero raises to $8.40, BB calls $3.02 and is all-in

Turn: ($11.94, 2 players) 5

River: ($11.94, 2 players) 4

Spoiler:
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Old 09-24-2012, 09:13 PM   #92
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Last 2 days have been atrocious. I've been playing below average and getting absolutely raped.




It seems like every river is the worst card possible and I continuously c/f rivers like a boss. Any time I decide to bluffcatch 50% pot sized bets with blockers I run into the backdoored nuts.

I've had to stop 2/6 of my last sessions after less than 90 minutes because I've felt too frustrated or angry to continue playing.

Thus far I've broken even on the month overall, a positive a couple BB/100 in expected allin EV.

Was going to get some good volume in tonight but too frustrated to continue playing. set>set, flush>flush, quads>topset etc
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Old 09-25-2012, 02:40 PM   #93
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

First winning session in 4 days. I'm a boss.


OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

SB: $7.66
BB: $11.86
UTG: $8.00
CO: $3.50
Hero (BTN): $11.14

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10, UTG posts DB $0.10, CO posts DB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.40) Hero has A 2 4 A

UTG raises to $0.20, CO raises to $0.30, Hero raises to $1.30, fold, BB calls $1.20, UTG calls $1.10, CO calls $1.00

Flop: ($5.30, 4 players) Q 6 T
BB checks, UTG checks, CO bets $2.20 and is all-in, Hero calls $2.20, BB calls $2.20, UTG calls $2.20

Turn: ($14.10, 4 players) 5
BB checks, UTG bets $4.50 and is all-in, Hero calls $4.50, fold

River: ($23.10, 3 players) J

Spoiler:


Flat pre... ? Shove flop... ? Ahh.. Think I played it alright. Flat pre maybe best.

Hand2-4:

Folding the river like a boss. 3x

Villain unknown.

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

CO: $10.00
BTN: $10.69
SB: $12.24
BB: $9.20
Hero (UTG): $18.84
MP: $9.70

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10, CO posts DB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.30) Hero has J J 9 A

Hero calls $0.10, fold, CO checks, BTN calls $0.10, SB checks, BB checks

Flop: ($0.50, 5 players) 2 A 8
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $0.40, fold, fold, SB calls $0.40, fold

Turn: ($1.30, 2 players) J
SB bets $1.30, Hero raises to $5.20, SB calls $3.90

River: ($11.70, 2 players) Q
SB bets $6.54 and is all-in, fold

Spoiler:


OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BTN: $7.56
SB: $8.36
BB: $8.40
UTG: $13.16
Hero (CO): $10.00

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has 7 4 5 8

UTG calls $0.10, Hero raises to $0.50, fold, fold, BB calls $0.40, UTG calls $0.40

Flop: ($1.60, 3 players) T 6 5
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($1.60, 3 players) 8
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $1.60, BB calls $1.60, UTG calls $1.60

River: ($6.40, 3 players) 7
BB bets $6.30 and is all-in, UTG raises to $11.06 and is all-in, fold

Spoiler:


OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

SB: $10.86
BB: $10.00
UTG: $8.60
MP: $17.27
CO: $8.51
Hero (BTN): $13.64

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has 8 A 5 8

fold, MP raises to $0.30, CO calls $0.30, Hero calls $0.30, fold, fold

Flop: ($1.10, 3 players) 9 7 K
MP bets $0.60, fold, Hero calls $0.60

Turn: ($2.30, 2 players) 4
MP bets $1.20, Hero calls $1.20

River: ($4.70, 2 players) Q
MP bets $3.50, fold

Spoiler:


Too much river folding?
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Old 09-26-2012, 09:28 PM   #94
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

God owned today, again. I really have to learn how to get my ass handed to me playing this game. Still not comfortable with losing.

It's not just running bad, I'm getting annihilated. My all-in EV line is negative almost every losing day. I don't feel like I'm making many big mistakes, but I must be. I can't have a continuously falling red line/yellow line and not be making obvious mistakes.


One thing I've been doing a lot of is folding the river vs passive players when they take a c/c c/c donk pot when the obvious draw hits. Or, cbet flop, check obvious draw hitting turn, fold to donk on river. Are players turning medium strength hands into bluffs on the river? Are they randomly betting? Some examples of river folds I made today;

This may be a problem.

River folds...

Hand 1

Villain here is unknown. Just sat down.

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BB: $4.42
UTG: $11.50
Hero (CO): $18.13
BTN: $6.20
SB: $20.78

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has A 8 5 6

UTG calls $0.10, Hero raises to $0.50, fold, fold, fold, UTG calls $0.40

Flop: ($1.20, 2 players) 7 4 8
UTG checks, Hero bets $0.70, UTG calls $0.70

Turn: ($2.60, 2 players) 7
UTG checks, Hero checks

River: ($2.60, 2 players) 3
UTG bets $1.30, fold

Spoiler:



I'm thinking on the flop hes got a widish range; pair+gutshot, pair+open ended, 2pair, set. Turn pairs the board and brings a FD, he checks, I.. check? River brings FD, he donks 1/2 pot? I beat a made hand being turned into a bluff or random spaz out.. Need to be good 27-28% (rake), worth calling?

Hand 2

Villain is 63/5 , 25 Ag Frq (loose passive)

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

SB: $2.79
Hero (BB): $17.97
UTG: $3.47
CO: $22.48
BTN: $7.98

SB posts SB $0.10, Hero posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has T 6 7 Q

UTG calls $0.10, CO calls $0.10, BTN calls $0.10, SB checks, Hero checks

Flop: ($0.50, 5 players) 5 Q 3
SB checks, Hero bets $0.50, UTG calls $0.50, fold, fold, fold

Turn: ($1.50, 2 players) 9
Hero checks, UTG checks

River: ($1.50, 2 players) 8
Hero bets $0.50, UTG raises to $2.87 and is all-in, fold

Spoiler:


Is he shoving worse flushes? Turning a made hand like 2pair into a ridiculous bluff, or am I always beat here? I think the bet/fold on the river is good vs a loose passive, but is it?

Hand 3

Villain is 94/40, 45 ag freq over 100 hands.

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 4 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BTN: $20.43
Hero (SB): $12.38
BB: $4.58
UTG: $14.66

Hero posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has T K J A

fold, BTN raises to $0.40, Hero raises to $1.30, fold, BTN calls $0.90

Flop: ($2.70, 2 players) 8 8 7
Hero bets $1.40, BTN calls $1.40

Turn: ($5.50, 2 players) 3
Hero checks, BTN checks

River: ($5.50, 2 players) 9
Hero bets $3.00, BTN raises to $14.50, fold

Spoiler:


Standard? I feel like he always flats lower straights and trips and never shoves...

Hand 5

Loose passive villain..

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG: $15.94
MP: $10.00
CO: $13.99
BTN: $21.36
SB: $21.74
Hero (BB): $10.00

SB posts SB $0.10, Hero posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has 3 7 8 T

UTG calls $0.10, MP calls $0.10, CO calls $0.10, fold, SB checks, Hero checks

Flop: ($0.50, 5 players) 5 6 2
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG bets $0.50, fold, fold, fold, Hero calls $0.50

Turn: ($1.50, 2 players) 4
Hero bets $1.50, UTG calls $1.50

River: ($4.50, 2 players) 6
Hero checks, UTG bets $2.50, fold

Spoiler:


It feels like these spots come up frequently. These are a few examples from earlier today.


I'm 2 BIs down for this month and my all-in EV is 1 BI below EV (I cant show in a graph because its split between 2 databases and I'm too lazy to merge).

This is over ~19k hands, which is a large sample. Conclusion = I still have LOTS to learn.

Unfortunately, whistler is in 1 month. I don't want to bus to vancouver 4 times a week.. I hope to god I can figure out PLO10 in October and be playing PLO25 in November.
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Old 09-26-2012, 10:21 PM   #95
LTT777
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Some interesting spots you got into today!

I think hand 1 is ok. Def a case to be made for bet/folding the turn and checking back/folding the river. I'd feel a lot more comfortable about my river fold if he c/c turn then donked riv.

Hand 2 not betting turn is a pretty big mistake I think. Again I'd feel so much more comfortable that I'm beat if he calls turn and raises river.

Hand 3 is a tough spot considering how aggro villain is. I think it looks fine tho. I might be tempted to check call that river and allow myself to look him up cheap, but I'm not sure thats good. I have trouble folding to guys that aggro and have a hard time piecing his hand together here. I would think he would bet a bare 8 and a boat on the turn, but who knows vs a 94/40.

Hand 4 looks good. Looks exactly like a set to me that boated up on the river. I think I'd be very comfortable with that fold.

I enjoy reading your thread and the hands you post are great. I definitely had to think about all of them pretty hard. Good luck to you!
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Old 09-26-2012, 11:25 PM   #96
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Quote:
Originally Posted by LTT777 View Post
Some interesting spots you got into today!

I think hand 1 is ok. Def a case to be made for bet/folding the turn and checking back/folding the river. I'd feel a lot more comfortable about my river fold if he c/c turn then donked riv.

Hand 2 not betting turn is a pretty big mistake I think. Again I'd feel so much more comfortable that I'm beat if he calls turn and raises river.

Hand 3 is a tough spot considering how aggro villain is. I think it looks fine tho. I might be tempted to check call that river and allow myself to look him up cheap, but I'm not sure thats good. I have trouble folding to guys that aggro and have a hard time piecing his hand together here. I would think he would bet a bare 8 and a boat on the turn, but who knows vs a 94/40.

Hand 4 looks good. Looks exactly like a set to me that boated up on the river. I think I'd be very comfortable with that fold.

I enjoy reading your thread and the hands you post are great. I definitely had to think about all of them pretty hard. Good luck to you!
Thx for responses. Got some similar feedback from a friend on skype.

Hand 1 I agree that betting the turn might be slightly better. Forcing him to call or fold turn should narrow his range given board texture. AP I dont know what his flop calling range is or if hes aggro enough to bluff rivers. betting turn works to get some thin value and avoid getting bluffed OTR.

Hand 2 I didn't realize I had 6 straight outs. I think betting is best, as a value/protection play. I can fold out btm 2 pair, get value from bare NFD, and don't need to fear getting raised by a worse hand from a passive player.

Hand 3 I think its close, I don't think I'm making a big mistake by b/f'ing b/c'ing, or c/c'ing. I think b/f'ing might be the best play by a small margin just because he's so loose and a lot of flop peeling hands that check the turn just spiked the river. Also, his Ag Freq is less than mine post-flop, so hes maniacal pre but less aggro post..

Hand 4 not much to discuss.


Thx for your analysis and positive feedback. I was starting to wonder if anyone was reading my posts after so many days without a reply.
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Old 09-27-2012, 04:55 AM   #97
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Hand 1: I'm bet folding that turn all day long.

Hand 2: Again continue betting turn, and with his stack size, calling it off. As played on the river folding is probably best.

Hand 3: I might consider double barreling, but thats a pretty bad turn card and we have no equity to speak of, so checking is fine. Seems weak but I'd prob c/f river. After we check the turn he's not folding often.

Hand 4: I would again b/f. He could have a set, but I think its more likely that he flopped 34 and called the turn to hopefully get a free showdown.

I haven't played much 6 max PLO lately so this might be off but I when I used to grind it I would exploit some of the weaker regs this way because whenever a scare card hit, they would just c/f. Now you're probably not getting exploited by the loose/passive players but competent and/or aggro players are gonna turn made hands into bluffs a lot more than they do in nlh.

Just from reading some of the hands you post on here I would say you should increase your double barrel frequency. There are a lot more good double barrel spots in PLO because you almost always have at least ok equity and there arent many blanks.

I know you've listened to the DPP episodes with Limon, so if you remember this conversation, you seem to be in the "the nuts is always out there" stage.
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Old 09-27-2012, 11:25 AM   #98
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cushlash View Post
Hand 1: I'm bet folding that turn all day long.

Hand 2: Again continue betting turn, and with his stack size, calling it off. As played on the river folding is probably best.

Hand 3: I might consider double barreling, but thats a pretty bad turn card and we have no equity to speak of, so checking is fine. Seems weak but I'd prob c/f river. After we check the turn he's not folding often.

Hand 4: I would again b/f. He could have a set, but I think its more likely that he flopped 34 and called the turn to hopefully get a free showdown.

I haven't played much 6 max PLO lately so this might be off but I when I used to grind it I would exploit some of the weaker regs this way because whenever a scare card hit, they would just c/f. Now you're probably not getting exploited by the loose/passive players but competent and/or aggro players are gonna turn made hands into bluffs a lot more than they do in nlh.

Just from reading some of the hands you post on here I would say you should increase your double barrel frequency. There are a lot more good double barrel spots in PLO because you almost always have at least ok equity and there arent many blanks.

I know you've listened to the DPP episodes with Limon, so if you remember this conversation, you seem to be in the "the nuts is always out there" stage.
I expect passive players that donk or raise the river to have the stone cold nuts... I see them check behind 3rd nut flushes / underfulls.

You are right, I need to double barrel more. flop cbet= 67%, turn cbet = 45%. That gap needs to be <10%.. This is important for several reasons. Namely that I am getting exploited by fishy regs that peel the flop with any piece. Also, I allow villains to realize equity on the river, and encourage flop calls if they know I check the turn often. It has the negative side effect of putting me in tough river spots.

Gonna shoot for 1k hands today. Sitting at 18.4k for the month.
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Old 09-27-2012, 01:26 PM   #99
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

First session.. 300 hands, +$2., ran way above all-in EV. The 2 biggest hands I win;

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BTN: $8.30
Hero (SB): $10.00
BB: $5.18
UTG: $17.76
CO: $8.42

Hero posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has 8 J 7 T

UTG calls $0.10, fold, BTN raises to $0.50, Hero raises to $1.70, BB calls $1.60, fold, BTN raises to $6.90, Hero raises to $10.00 and is all-in, BB calls $3.48 and is all-in, BTN calls $1.40 and is all-in

Flop: ($21.88, 3 players) 8 K 7

Turn: ($21.88, 3 players) 4

River: ($21.88, 3 players) 2

I think its close between 3betting and calling here. Villain is unknown, 50/33 over 5 hands. Once he 4bets with the dead money in, its a clear shove.

The biggest hand I win is a super small margin where I run gut.

Spoiler:



OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BTN: $11.75
SB: $7.89
Hero (BB): $10.40
UTG: $13.13
MP: $65.31
CO: $9.40

SB posts SB $0.10, Hero posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has Q A 4 A

fold, MP raises to $0.40, fold, BTN calls $0.40, SB calls $0.30, Hero raises to $2.00, MP calls $1.60, BTN calls $1.60, fold

Flop: ($6.40, 3 players) 8 3 5
Hero bets $6.40, fold, BTN raises to $9.75 and is all-in, Hero calls $2.00 and is all-in

Turn: ($23.20, 2 players) 8

River: ($23.20, 2 players) K

Spoiler:


This hand I think flatting pre is best, again I think its close. The aces are pretty dry, but if I 3b I can get 20% of my stack in pre.. original opener opens wide, fairly loose. btn calls wide and 3bets 5% on the button.. Felt like having an SPR ~1-1.5 and deciding which flops to commit on was an okay decision. This flop was good for dry aces IMO.


Biggest hand I lost;

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

MP: $11.52
CO: $9.80
Hero (BTN): $11.69
SB: $9.90
BB: $20.37
UTG: $22.33

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.20) Hero has 9 5 J T

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.40, SB calls $0.30, BB calls $0.30

Flop: ($1.20, 3 players) 3 9 T
SB checks, BB bets $1.20, Hero raises to $4.80, fold, BB calls $3.60

Turn: ($10.80, 2 players) A
BB checks, Hero bets $6.49 and is all-in, BB calls $6.49

River: ($23.78, 2 players) 4

Spoiler:


Villain here is 95/20, 60 aggro frequency.. basically a total donk. As you can see, the turn card is super disgusting. Basically the biggest hand I lose is a ridic cooler.

OnGame - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 4 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG: $12.06
Hero (BTN): $23.71
SB: $10.00
BB: $10.20

SB posts SB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.10) Hero has 2 6 7 8

fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.30, SB calls $0.20

Flop: ($0.60, 2 players) 7 6 5
SB checks, Hero bets $0.50, SB calls $0.50

Turn: ($1.60, 2 players) Q
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($1.60, 2 players) 7
SB bets $1.60, Hero raises to $5.00, SB raises to $9.20 and is all-in, Hero calls $4.20

Spoiler:


Second biggest hand I lose is again the same maniac as the first big losing hand. This one obv another cooler.

Yes, I'm whining. Where are my coolers?!
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Old 09-29-2012, 11:23 AM   #100
tmckendry
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Re: Crushing PLO (PLO5-->PLO200)

In the chronicles of online PLO--->NLH...

blockers mean nothing
turn ch/r = nuts
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