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Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Moving Up Through uNL in 2011

01-01-2011 , 07:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by verneer

For example, here is a hand I played this morning:

UTG + 1 is playing 34/16 over 32 hands. BTN is playing 13/7 over 57 hands.

Full Tilt Poker $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players

Hero (CO): $10.00
BTN: $13.54
SB: $10.17
BB: $11.87
UTG: $23.76
UTG+1: $12.83
UTG+2: $4.12
MP1: $4.05
MP2: $6.40

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is CO with K K
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $0.20, 3 folds, Hero raises to $0.90, BTN calls $0.90, 2 folds, UTG+1 calls $0.70

Flop: ($2.85) 5 7 Q (3 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $1, BTN calls $1, UTG+1 calls $1

So what range of hands will they have preflop to continue given my 3-bet? How will those hands play the flop (there is a fair bit of guessing involved - who will you be able to narrow down more accurately?).

Given the preflop and flop action, How many turn cards are bad for you? What's the worst possible card that can come? Why is that? Which ones are great? What, if anything, will make you fold your hand on the turn?
Obviously the looser passive player has a much wider range here, given that he has a much higher VPIP and is presumably calling a decent amount of 3bets. The tight player cold-calling a 3bet looks fairly strong, although he may well be setmining assuming he is getting good implied odds as he will probably expect the fish to come along a lot of the time. I'd say his range is 22-QQ almost always, maybe some AK/AQ in there as well? He may decide to slowplay AA as well, although probably not.

On the flop, you obviously bet for value. I'm curious as to your betsize - you bet just over 1/3 pot on a drawy board with an overpair - why is that?

I think the smaller betsize probably widens their flop calling range. The looser player will probably peel with a very wide range - any pair, any draw, maybe even some backdoor draws. The tighter player would probably flat with AQ, and I would expect him to peel with, say, 99-JJ. Despite the drawy board he would be fairly likely to flat with sets as well, to encourage the UTG+1 to come along.

Bad turn cards: any Q would help a decent portion of villains' ranges. Any heart would be bad as you're either now behind or unlikely to get paid off. I would be a little wary on any 9, T or J as the button may have turned a set. Also obviously any A, for the same reasons as hearts. I'd say the Ah is probably the worst card in the deck for you. Again, this is a fair portion of the deck, which is why I'm curious as to your reasons for betting so small on the flop.

Great turn cards: K (ldo), offsuit 2-4, maybe a club that might give someone a backdoor draw and make them call another turn bet? An 8 or 9 is probably a safe card, as even though it completes the straight I don't really expect either player to have 64 or 86 very often at all.

On a safe turn card I would probably bet-fold. If either player ships over our turn bet we may well be in bad shape, as I would never expect either player to play Qx or a draw that way.

How was that?

Also, in terms of charities (mucho respect for doing that btw) you should DEFINITELY look at Kiva.

Quote:
Kiva empowers individuals to lend to an entrepreneur across the globe. By combining microfinance with the internet, Kiva is creating a global community of people connected through lending.

Kiva was born of the following beliefs:

* People are by nature generous, and will help others if given the opportunity to do so in a transparent, accountable way.
* The poor are highly motivated and can be very successful when given an opportunity.
* By connecting people we can create relationships beyond financial transactions, and build a global community expressing support and encouragement of one another.

Kiva promotes:

* Dignity: Kiva encourages partnership relationships as opposed to benefactor relationships. Partnership relationships are characterized by mutual dignity and respect.
* Accountability: Loans encourage more accountability than donations where repayment is not expected.
* Transparency: The Kiva website is an open platform where communication can flow freely around the world.

As of November 2009, Kiva has facilitated over $100 million in loans.

GL this year Verneer.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 07:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by verneer
Begin with the End in Mind
"Failing to plan is planning to fail.

I think the question that I ask my students more than any other is "What's your plan?" I ask them this in terms of their bankroll, their emotional state, or a specific hand we are discussing.

Just having a plan will put you ahead of many poker players, if you want to take it one step further, you need to have a plan with an exit strategy. Basically - at what point do you realize that you will not succeed with your plan and cut your loses? Going into a situation with an exit plan really allows you to curb your loses.

For example, I discuss having a tilt plan with my students that tend to tilt. The metaphor I use is that of a circuit breaker.



Basically, what needs to happen in a session for you to quit? Losing 3 BI's? Getting sucked out in a big pot? Seeing someone bluff you? After you quit, how long do you need to stay away from the tables before you can sit down and play again? In your follow-up session, what needs to happen for you to quit again?

You need to know the answer to these questions before you open up the first table. If you don't, you are not planning as well as you could and have not exit strategy. Believe me - these are not the type of questions that you will be able to answer once you start tilting or are stuck big.

Secondly, let's say you open pocket aces and see a flop. Do you have an exit strategy for the specific hand? Under what conditions will you fold your hand? What would be considered a great flop set for you? A poor flop setup? Given the flop, what is the best possible turn card? The worst possible turn card?

For example, here is a hand I played this morning:

UTG + 1 is playing 34/16 over 32 hands. BTN is playing 13/7 over 57 hands.

Full Tilt Poker $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players

Hero (CO): $10.00
BTN: $13.54
SB: $10.17
BB: $11.87
UTG: $23.76
UTG+1: $12.83
UTG+2: $4.12
MP1: $4.05
MP2: $6.40

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is CO with K K
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $0.20, 3 folds, Hero raises to $0.90, BTN calls $0.90, 2 folds, UTG+1 calls $0.70

Flop: ($2.85) 5 7 Q (3 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $1, BTN calls $1, UTG+1 calls $1

So what range of hands will they have preflop to continue given my 3-bet? How will those hands play the flop (there is a fair bit of guessing involved - who will you be able to narrow down more accurately?).

Given the preflop and flop action, How many turn cards are bad for you? What's the worst possible card that can come? Why is that? Which ones are great? What, if anything, will make you fold your hand on the turn?

So ... make sure you plan well and start incorporating some basic exit strategies along with your planning.
UTG will probably be calling 3bets with alot of S/C / Suited Broadways/ 88+

BTN cold calling range is weighted towards JJ+/AK/AQ/Maybe slowplayed AA.

As played - I'd be betting $2 on the flop - Barrelling most decent turns.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 09:36 PM
Curious verneer but how is your book coming along? Are you going to be adding the material from this into your book? or is it postponed?
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:05 PM
gl

grunch

Quote:
do u have specific videos for players in rush fr? i've only watched sng vids on cr so far but would love to check out a few of your videos or even someone elses that u think would help me with rush nl5 fr. thx in advance.
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/12...unners-949263/
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:13 PM
Day 1 Summary: + 5 BI's @ 10NL, gotta work out some kinks at this limit though. Still:

1. Nice to kick off with a win.
2. Nice to finish the day off with the graph hitting new highs.



I'm hoping the large sample will smooth out some of these big peaks and valleys seen today
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyncho
On the flop, you obviously bet for value. I'm curious as to your betsize - you bet just over 1/3 pot on a drawy board with an overpair - why is that?

I think the smaller betsize probably widens their flop calling range.
Any other reasons? How much would you bet and why? What would you do if your bigger bet size got shoved on? (overall, very good analysis)

Quote:
Also, in terms of charities (mucho respect for doing that btw) you should DEFINITELY look at Kiva.
My mother-in-law got Katy and I a $100 gift card for Kiva for our anniversary - it's definitely a charity we've contributed to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mxyzptlk3
Curious verneer but how is your book coming along? Are you going to be adding the material from this into your book? or is it postponed?
It's coming along. Don't expect it next week though. Some of the material that I develop in the next few weeks will definitely make it to the text.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:22 PM
how many tables do you play?stacked or tile
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:31 PM
Great thread, Verneer! I will be looking forward to your progress and videos... But I have enough trouble playing 10NL Rush without worrying about losing my manies to you now too :P
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by penteado89
how many tables do you play?stacked or tile
4-tables of Rush tiled.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by verneer
4-tables of Rush tiled.
vpip?
pfr?
steal%?
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouird
vpip?
pfr?
steal%?
16/12, 32% steal. Now everyone will exploit me
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:48 PM
lol, sorry for outting you sir hehe
i wont post your sn, although i know its been outted already.



at a reg fr table, would you consider those states to be nitty?
i dont play rush, and just started playing FR after a 3 year hiatus (coming from 6max).

and i know im playing rather tight (but only playing 2nl right now to get my bearings).
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouird
lol, sorry for outting you sir hehe
i wont post your sn, although i know its been outted already.



at a reg fr table, would you consider those states to be nitty?
i dont play rush, and just started playing FR after a 3 year hiatus (coming from 6max).

and i know im playing rather tight (but only playing 2nl right now to get my bearings).
No ... nitty has a VPIP of 13 and below. Real nits play something like 11/10 or even tighter. Still ... I think for anyone that doesn't know how to navigate a lot of marginal spots postflop, playing a VPIP of over 14 is a bad idea at FR.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:53 PM
even at non-rush tables?
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:53 PM
Iv got 16/13 on you.
Played against you once or twice today.
Nice thread here il follow it the whole way as i am after just moving to 10nl myself

Heres my first 4k of hands at 10nl rush.Bit of a difference verneer between me and you hahaha
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 10:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouird
even at non-rush tables?
Yeah ... how are they different from Rush ones?
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 11:08 PM
no idea tbh
ive found that there are more nut peddlers in rush games (its been some time since ive been at those tables, and never FR).
and when i was playing them, i found myself making more mistakes, and sooooooooper spewy. (thus why im not playing them now lol).
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 11:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by verneer
Yeah ... how are they different from Rush ones?
I don't have huge volume at Rush tables, however my take on it from my exp is that as a generalization people play at either end of the spectrum. They're either nitting it up, folding all but premiums, or they're loosening up tying to take advantage of the nits, 3beting from BB a lot more etc.

Would seem to me that it probably all evens up in the wash. On certain tables your steal % would soar and on others your going to get 3bet by the BTN/SB/BB a hell of a lot, often with junk.

I would imagine the best strategy would be to play your normal game where you're comfortable, rather than getting into too many marginal situations. Perhaps 3bet and 4bet ranges are more important for adjustment than initial VPIP/PFR. No idea though really
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-01-2011 , 11:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by verneer
Any other reasons? How much would you bet and why? What would you do if your bigger bet size got shoved on? (overall, very good analysis)
I would probably bet something like $1.75-$2 to maximise value, plus the fact that a good percentage of turn cards either give us a second best hand or kill our action, so I want to build the pot now. If my flop bet gets shoved on I'm leaning towards a call - multiway I think a lot of players at these stakes would like to slowplay their big hands to encourage more action. If you get shoved by the button and UTG+1 calls, or button raises and UTG+1 shoves, it becomes much closer and I would lean towards a fold.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-02-2011 , 12:32 AM
How long you suspect this goal could take?
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-02-2011 , 12:48 AM
Verneer, you are awesome.
I swear your last thread gave me at least 100 hours of studying.

Great roi lol
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-02-2011 , 12:56 AM
GL Verneer Looking forward to the vids.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-02-2011 , 05:44 AM
Verneer you're a legend mate.

GL, I'll be following intently.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-02-2011 , 07:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by peterc1992
How long you suspect this goal could take?
A few months. Depends on how I run.
Moving Up Through uNL in 2011 Quote
01-02-2011 , 08:15 AM
When you switch to 6max?
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