Fold river or call and laugh?

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 169.5 BB
SB: 121.7 BB
BB: 113.1 BB
UTG: 125.7 BB
MP: 102.4 BB
Hero (CO): 100 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K K

fold, fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, BTN calls 3 BB, fold, fold

Flop: (7.5 BB, 2 players) 5 8 4
Hero bets 4 BB, BTN calls 4 BB

Turn: (15.5 BB, 2 players) J
Hero bets 7.5 BB, BTN calls 7.5 BB

River: (30.5 BB, 2 players) 8
Hero checks, BTN bets 8.7 BB, Hero calls 8.7 BB

Was sure he was going to have JJ but nope just a turned set and me been a fish had to call to confirm especially as his bet should only get called by a hand that beats him. Just another stack in a 3bet pot zzzzzzzzz


PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 118.9 BB
SB: 107.2 BB
Hero (BB): 109.4 BB
UTG: 103.5 BB
MP: 100 BB
CO: 108.9 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q Q

fold, MP raises to 2 BB, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 8 BB, MP calls 6 BB

Flop: (16.5 BB, 2 players) 3 7 6
Hero bets 8.5 BB, MP calls 8.5 BB

Turn: (33.5 BB, 2 players) T
Hero bets 17 BB, MP calls 17 BB

River: (67.5 BB, 2 players) 9
Hero checks, MP bets 66.5 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 66.5 BB



Only another 25 points to go so about another 500 hands so hopefully I can only lose 3 or 4 more stacks in getting to that point.

Full fish mode now

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 129 BB
Hero (SB): 173.9 BB
BB: 117 BB
UTG: 120.3 BB
MP: 117.2 BB
CO: 100 BB

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 9 Q

fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to 2 BB, Hero raises to 8.5 BB, fold, BTN calls 6.5 BB

Flop: (18 BB, 2 players) Q A 7
Hero bets 8.6 BB, BTN calls 8.6 BB

Turn: (35.2 BB, 2 players) T
Hero bets 16.8 BB, BTN calls 16.8 BB

River: (68.8 BB, 2 players) K
Hero bets 140 BB and is all-in, BTN calls 95.1 BB and is all-in



Funny that I were actually ahead on the turn. Obviously I never have Jx there because the villain snapped. I can only imagine what that feeling is to draw to a winning hand or not see the hand you expect to see when you call.

Again I know this looks bad but if I post this hand from the villains perspective would the advice be to fold at any point in this hand? I mean you have to fold them rivers unless you are playing against me in which case I never have a hand that wins at showdown.

20 points to go and only 1 stack down so far.

Its like they can see my cards. Fair play villain played it perfect. On the plus side my luck is improving as Im surprised a Queen didnt roll off.

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): 100 BB
SB: 112.5 BB
BB: 176.8 BB
UTG: 115.5 BB
MP: 325.4 BB
CO: 98.9 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q Q

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.5 BB, SB calls 2 BB, fold

Flop: (6 BB, 2 players) 6 T J
SB checks, Hero bets 3 BB, SB calls 3 BB

Turn: (12 BB, 2 players) K
SB bets 7.5 BB, Hero calls 7.5 BB

River: (27 BB, 2 players) 5
SB checks, Hero checks

Cold 4bettor is big fish and I think I have him crushed. Legendary flat though by the BTN. Again perfect play V my holding.

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 111.8 BB
Hero (SB): 99 BB
BB: 164.3 BB
UTG: 116.4 BB
MP: 100 BB
CO: 170.5 BB

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K K

fold, fold, CO raises to 2.5 BB, BTN calls 2.5 BB, Hero raises to 12 BB, BB raises to 35 BB, fold, BTN raises to 111.8 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 87 BB and is all-in, fold

Flop: (235.5 BB, 2 players) 6 8 T

Turn: (235.5 BB, 2 players) J

River: (235.5 BB, 2 players) 6



17 points to go 2.3 buy ins down.

Next hand I encourage everyone to play 3bet pots against me lolz

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 102.3 BB
Hero (SB): 123.5 BB
BB: 106 BB
UTG: 159.5 BB
MP: 116.8 BB
CO: 448.5 BB

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A K

fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to 3 BB, Hero raises to 11 BB, fold, BTN calls 8 BB

Flop: (23 BB, 2 players) 6 Q 3
Hero bets 11 BB, BTN calls 11 BB

Turn: (45 BB, 2 players) J
Hero bets 21.5 BB, BTN calls 21.5 BB

River: (88 BB, 2 players) 7
Hero bets 80 BB and is all-in, BTN calls 58.8 BB and is all-in



14 points to go 3.3 buy ins down.

Hows it possible to run this good?

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 147.8 BB
Hero (SB): 99 BB
BB: 108.5 BB
UTG: 198.7 BB
MP: 105.1 BB
CO: 103.2 BB

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has J K

fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, BB raises to 9 BB, Hero calls 6 BB

Flop: (18 BB, 2 players) A K 7
Hero checks, BB bets 5.7 BB, Hero calls 5.7 BB

Turn: (29.4 BB, 2 players) J
Hero checks, BB bets 9.3 BB, Hero calls 9.3 BB

River: (48 BB, 2 players) 9
Hero checks, BB bets 15.1 BB, Hero calls 15.1 BB



6 points to go 3.6 buy ins down. This is fun.

And made it ended up dropping 4.6 buy ins since the point mentioned last one was just standard KK V AK where villain rivered a straight all in pre.

So results for the month look like this:-



Funny looking at it and seeing almost identical stats but one of them is 33 buy ins down. Funny as well finishing the month $20 down and becoming a rakeback "pro"

So my balance is back up to £496 which is a bit frustrating as when I moved up it were at about £630 before rakeback.

Going to move back down to NL5 as I see no reason to play NL10 as I clear do not have the skill to play at that level and need to do a lot of work on my game. Its probably best if I have a few days off as there is some obvious tilt in there now but to be honest its gone past tilt and is more disbelief now.

Things that I need to work on:-

3bet pots is the obvious one although Im not sure where to start I seem to be doing the opposite of what I need to in them ie. stopping betting when villain is weak and bluffing in to strength. People are 3betting so wide but seem to hit so many flops against me that I have no idea where I stand in them.

Folding to raises - Ive won about 2 pots or something daft when I have called peoples raises which is just such a small percentage of the times that I have been raised but I just can't believe that people are hitting that well. Yet time and time again they show up with the hand that I expect them to. Ultimatley its frustrating folding a pot with so much money invested but I have to somehow convince myself that in the long run it is printing money.

Meh there obviously loads more for me to work on as you don't drop 30 buy ins at a level just from bad luck in my opinion and although I don't feel like I have played that bad simply folding to their raises likely saves me half of those buy ins.

I'm in a similar situation as yourself. Coming back to poker after several years away and relearning the fundamentals and modern theory of poker. I'm currently doing it at $2NL even though I have the BR to play higher.

You mentioned the "From the ground up" on Run it Once. I'm currently reading the book version of that course by Peter Clarke ("The Grinders Manual") and it is really helping me. I'd definitely encourage you to follow and study the course. Peter also has his own site CarrotsCorner and YT channel and Twitch channel. On the Twitch and YT channel, he reviews students hands and even records some of his coaching sessions with them. I've learned a lot from that too.

GL

Not sure the thinking in this hand. What is villain thinking on the turn? The river is just more run bad and is literally 1 of the only 2 cards in the deck he calls a shove with.

PokerStars - $0.05 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 359.8 BB
Hero (SB): 138.6 BB
BB: 96.6 BB
UTG: 182 BB
MP: 100.8 BB
CO: 67.4 BB

Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has K A

fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to 2.4 BB, Hero raises to 9.6 BB, fold, BTN calls 7.2 BB

Flop: (20.2 BB, 2 players) 9 5 3
Hero checks, BTN bets 6.4 BB, Hero calls 6.4 BB

Turn: (33 BB, 2 players) 8
Hero checks, BTN bets 10.4 BB, Hero raises to 29.2 BB, BTN calls 18.8 BB

River: (91.4 BB, 2 players) 7
Hero bets 93.4 BB and is all-in, BTN calls 93.4 BB



Once again same old story in a 3bet pot I have air and bluff off my stack. The times I have a hand its just an insta fold from villains.

All this makes me think that I need to be raising a lot lighter for value as people once they see a flop seem really reluctant to fold against me as can be seen with a lot of the hands above and I guess rather than be bluffing my stack off with air repeatedly I may as well give stacks up when I have a hand.

Problem with this hand is villain at these stakes never give you credit for checking a flush draw on the flop.

But yes, in general you’re better off just making money from their light call downs rather than bluffs.

I don’t actually hate villains bluffcatch as he blocks the 76s and he has a club.

At this point Im at a total loss as to where I stand playing poker. All I know is if I keep pots small then I do really well but as soon as I get in to a 3bet pot Im just getting destroyed. I seem to have been running bad for quite a while now and the hand below is just born out of frustration, I mean what hand raises this flop? Then when I see what the villain called with pre and how well they flopped just pure tilts me especially when I am running so bad in 3bet pots.

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 104 BB
SB: 98 BB
Hero (BB): 117.7 BB
UTG: 118.5 BB
MP: 53 BB
CO: 211.4 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A Q

fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to 2.5 BB, fold, Hero raises to 9.5 BB, BTN calls 7 BB

Flop: (19.5 BB, 2 players) 3 7 A
Hero bets 8 BB, BTN raises to 42.6 BB, Hero calls 34.6 BB

Turn: (104.7 BB, 2 players) T
Hero checks, BTN bets 51.9 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 51.9 BB

River: (208.5 BB, 2 players) 4



I know we can say I should fold to the flop raise but when all you seem to be doing is folding in 3bet pots it soon starts to add up and then when you finally do connect with a flop you face a raise on a board like that its easy to talk yourself in to stacking off.

Like how do you combat this?

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 101.5 BB
Hero (SB): 117.3 BB
BB: 102.7 BB
UTG: 134.7 BB
MP: 118.4 BB
CO: 131.8 BB

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q Q

fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to 3 BB, Hero raises to 10 BB, BB calls 9 BB, BTN calls 7 BB

Flop: (30 BB, 3 players) 9 4 Q
Hero bets 14.3 BB, fold, BTN calls 14.3 BB

Turn: (58.6 BB, 2 players) 5
Hero bets 28 BB, BTN calls 28 BB

River: (114.6 BB, 2 players) K
Hero bets 65 BB and is all-in, BTN calls 49.2 BB and is all-in



I should just fold every single time I see a flop in a 3bet pot.

And another one, as soon as the over card hits I may as well just fold as its inevitable the villain just got there.

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 70.5 BB
SB: 105.5 BB
BB: 100 BB
UTG: 69.5 BB
Hero (MP): 130.8 BB
CO: 100 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has T J

fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, SB raises to 10 BB, fold, Hero calls 7 BB

Flop: (21 BB, 2 players) 5 2 J
SB bets 7 BB, Hero calls 7 BB

Turn: (35 BB, 2 players) Q
SB bets 16.7 BB, Hero calls 16.7 BB

River: (68.4 BB, 2 players) 3
SB checks, Hero checks

I mean come on is this a piss take?

PokerStars - $0.10 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 100 BB
SB: 232.8 BB
Hero (BB): 136.7 BB
UTG: 109.2 BB
MP: 366.5 BB
CO: 102.4 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A A

UTG calls 1 BB, MP raises to 5 BB, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 14.5 BB, fold, MP calls 9.5 BB

Flop: (30.5 BB, 2 players) Q 4 8
Hero bets 14.6 BB, MP calls 14.6 BB

Turn: (59.7 BB, 2 players) 7
Hero bets 28.5 BB, MP calls 28.5 BB

River: (116.7 BB, 2 players) 4
Hero bets 79.1 BB and is all-in, MP calls 79.1 BB

I actually don't think that I have ever run this bad before, some of the stuff Im seeing is ridiculous but to cap it all its the 3bet pots that are obliterating my bankroll. Some of the calls that people are making just seem totally out of line so unless i have a stat that I don't know about that is screaming call against me when I 3bet with any 2 cards then I really don't know what is going on.

How can you drop nearly 40 buy ins playing almost exactly the same as you do on the next level down?



What do I do at this point? Stop 3betting and fold to every 3bet? Don't change anything and hope that it swings back the other way?

So had some good news in a perverse kind of way. Logged in to Stars and they have dropped my rakeback offer to 10% and needing to gain 1625 points for a $32 reward which gives me very little incentive to play so rather than try to move up I will likely stay at NL5 for the month and just try and work on different aspects of my game.

Weird that Stars would do that after I had donated money to the poker community this last month but I guess there must be some reasoning behind it. Hopefully this means they will now flip the switch again after doing such a good job at the back end of the month.

Just having a browse around and it looks like this would be a good time to move to GGpoker. Anyone any recomendations about that? How the games play, the rakeback, the software, etc.

It looks like Stars have reconsidered their rakeback policy. Many players have had their challenges reduced from 40% to 10%.

Is GGPoker any good? Seems you can't use a hud on there apart from their built in one which maybe isnt a bad thing. What are the games like, is it true the player pool is bigger than Stars?

Yeah GG has 250k players peak time compared to PS 50k from my limited experience. Rush and cash rake is comparable to PS but reg games rake is much higher on GG (check primedope).
GG slightly softer competition too so worth a consideration. I also enjoy the “equalising” nature of no external HUDs. Software smooth too apart from hard to bumhunt reg tables as no lobby filters.

Thank you.

Transfered my roll over to GG. First impressions are that the table set up, animation, ect will take me a little time to get used to and there are some features that seem annoying that can't be turned off but again not too much of a problem. I actually love that the HUD is really basic which means I should not be able to talk myself in to levelling wars because of small sample sizes and will hopefully mean I can play a pretty solid game.

The tiling and cascade set up is a little annoying as I have a super widescreen monitor and I am used to having the tables to the left side which is going to mean I have to set it up each session but if i move to reg tables the tiled set up on a lot of tables is going to be pretty sweet.

From a tilt point of view the fact that I can't check my balance or PT4 every other hand to see if I am up or down is going to be a very good thing indeed and that plays a part in my tilt. All in all impressed so far and going to get some hands in and see what happens.

Prefer GG so far.....

nice results from an old school guy I am getting back into it too.... wanna share any stock strategy? I have been trying to get started there too and watching all warrior trading free stuff, not sure where to find screeners or other good tools? I have a lot of free time but a small trading account. I like the strategy of small cap day trading, but have had VERY mixed results

Best free place on the internet to learn about stocks:- https://qullamaggie.com/

This is a link to the discord that is used to discuss his works:- https://discord.com/invite/wdrMPESAq4

The guy has made more money than the likes of Minervini and loves to give back, its mainly breakout trading which is the type of trading I mainly do although lately because of the market I have been mainly trading indexes or just sitting on my hands.

Software wise to start with Trading View will surfice but once you get more in to it then TC2000 is the way to go but I would wait to see how serious you want to take it first.

cool thanks a bunch I will definitely check these out!! If you ever want to discuss hands and or strategy, I am playing similar stakes and messing with GTO wizard some.... What I have found works good at the low stakes is overfolding and in position against capped ranges going bonkers with bluffs. I think I still have Skype just shoot me a PM and we could go over some hands once in a while... I always like discussing hands and am pretty much on my own reviewing. Best of luck

Welcome back. I remember you from years ago