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Old 11-18-2012, 03:48 PM   #351
IveGotUrOuts
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Can you maybe explain your play in hand 1 pre, flop and turn?
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:35 PM   #352
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

pre is fine in terms of reisoing the fish with what looks nutted so villains wont play back at us while we get to play the pot in position with a decent hand vs a spazzy fish so decent cold4bet for value against fish and bluff vs the others. on the flop we dont rly need to bet small to get folds as a fish probly plays fit or fold here and he s not evr folding better anyway. turn is spew imo
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:48 PM   #353
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Brilliant that you can judge a hand (which took place at a stake 8x higher than you have ever played in a more complex gametype) as spew without knowing anything about the history or the villain.
Also I expect regs at 200nl probably recognize that he is going to be light here vs a monster fish.
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:52 PM   #354
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

h1 seems totally fine imo
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Old 11-18-2012, 06:06 PM   #355
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Quote:
Originally Posted by blakkman08 View Post
on the flop we dont rly need to bet small to get folds as a fish probly plays fit or fold here and he s not evr folding better anyway. turn is spew imo
wat

Great thread, keep it up Stasia!
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:40 PM   #356
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Queen6Suited View Post
Brilliant that you can judge a hand (which took place at a stake 8x higher than you have ever played in a more complex gametype) as spew without knowing anything about the history or the villain.
Also I expect regs at 200nl probably recognize that he is going to be light here vs a monster fish.
y u gotta get personal?

fwiw i just took my best shot at analyzing a spot with the knowledge i have of a game thats pretty well known to me and thats very much played at the same level it is played at any stakes given the situation (random/reg opens, random/reg flats, spazzy fish 3bsqueezes - we isocold4b semilight for value v fish, as a bluff v regs, that are unlikely to play back light - feel free to enlighten me where thats wrong).

i think flop sizing is perfectly fine with the reads we re presented (fish) ie he ll just flat if he s drawing/ hs sdv, will fold if he doesnt. i think he never ever folds the turn and i think we cant bet for value with AThigh so imo turn s spew. again instead of being a ****** why dont u add some points to make the discussion more interesting and less annoying
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Old 11-19-2012, 09:35 AM   #357
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Really nice blog, read it all great read! subbed and keep it up
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Old 11-19-2012, 10:09 AM   #358
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

blakkman: because your assumptions and knowledge are off. that is why there is no use for a 50nl reg to give advice on a 1knl hand for example
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Old 11-19-2012, 10:44 AM   #359
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Too much hate for blakkman itt, he's commenting on a hand vs a fish, so regardless of stakes a fish playing 40/5 at 50nl is the same as a fish that plays 40/5 at 200nl.
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Old 11-19-2012, 10:46 AM   #360
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Call flop 3bet with 77 and not close imo
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Old 11-19-2012, 11:02 AM   #361
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Quote:
Originally Posted by chiego View Post
blakkman: because your assumptions and knowledge are off. that is why there is no use for a 50nl reg to give advice on a 1knl hand for example
its so easy to throw stuff like this out there but somehow rly hard for you people to actually write out even one sentence of thought through analysis.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Queen6Suited View Post
Also I expect regs at 200nl probably recognize that he is going to be light here vs a monster fish.
this reply lacks depth on a bunch of levels. firstly, even if they realize it they cant play back at us cuz of the fish that will fk them over, second of all expecting 200nl regs to be some kind of superhumans playing a totally different game is just ridic.


OP postd this hand becasue OP wants to generate discussion about it. I engaged in said discussion and you guys havent even contributed one single piece of useful argumentation here.
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Old 11-19-2012, 11:41 AM   #362
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Quote:
Originally Posted by IveGotUrOuts View Post
Can you maybe explain your play in hand 1 pre, flop and turn?
Quote:
Originally Posted by blakkman08 View Post
pre is fine in terms of reisoing the fish with what looks nutted so villains wont play back at us while we get to play the pot in position with a decent hand vs a spazzy fish so decent cold4bet for value against fish and bluff vs the others. on the flop we dont rly need to bet small to get folds as a fish probly plays fit or fold here and he s not evr folding better anyway. turn is spew imo
Quote:
Originally Posted by blakkman08 View Post
y u gotta get personal?

fwiw i just took my best shot at analyzing a spot with the knowledge i have of a game thats pretty well known to me and thats very much played at the same level it is played at any stakes given the situation (random/reg opens, random/reg flats, spazzy fish 3bsqueezes - we isocold4b semilight for value v fish, as a bluff v regs, that are unlikely to play back light - feel free to enlighten me where thats wrong).

i think flop sizing is perfectly fine with the reads we re presented (fish) ie he ll just flat if he s drawing/ hs sdv, will fold if he doesnt. i think he never ever folds the turn and i think we cant bet for value with AThigh so imo turn s spew. again instead of being a ****** why dont u add some points to make the discussion more interesting and less annoying
Generally speaking I don't see any other way to play the hand after fish calling smallish-bet on flop, except shoving turn. I think I get called by worse (for example, when he's not hitting his 8 outs on turn, he almost always snaps my shove on turn), and I DO see him folding a big chunk of his range on turn.

Main point here is him flatting OOP pre-flop to small bet, which almost always means he doesn't have JJ+, AQ+...
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Old 11-19-2012, 11:42 AM   #363
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rahm93 View Post
Great thread, keep it up Stasia!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salvetutti View Post
Really nice blog, read it all great read! subbed and keep it up
TyTy guys, positive feedback is almost always good :}
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Old 11-19-2012, 11:45 AM   #364
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Blonde View Post
Call flop 3bet with 77 and not close imo
Not sure I got it right... You go for a check-raise on flop, and flat his 3bet. What is the plan on turn, when almost any card is a scare card..?

Anyone else have some insights on the 77 VS KK hand..?
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Old 11-19-2012, 11:53 AM   #365
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

I think flat calling the 3bet could be good/better, and i don't agree that almost every card is a scare card, the only massive draws he has are 9Tss really, he won't be getting in Axss here 300bb deep, nor will he get in 56ss i don't imagine. I think flatting 3bet is probably superior.
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Old 11-19-2012, 12:05 PM   #366
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Quote:
Originally Posted by stasia4242 View Post
Not sure I got it right... You go for a check-raise on flop, and flat his 3bet. What is the plan on turn, when almost any card is a scare card..?

Anyone else have some insights on the 77 VS KK hand..?
Yea. What do you mean by 'scare card'. This is a fairly arbitrary term, it's not like he's 3bing flop with all spade combos but at least you balance for the times you x/r 9Tcc/A4ss/56ssetc. It's not a cooler once you 4bet flop, you're literally isolating your hand against 88/KK almost always, also when you just flat you give him a chance to bluff hands like AsQx/9s9x/9Tcc/JThh etc
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Old 11-19-2012, 01:53 PM   #367
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Blakkman it's just your overall posting manner which seems to exude confidence in your game when you play so ridiculously low, and haven't even played cash for a long time, and fail to understand a lot of strategy that is required for playing higher.
This combined with your horrendous destruction of basic spelling and grammar just tilt me horribly for some reason.

Last edited by Queen6Suited; 11-19-2012 at 01:55 PM. Reason: and the fact that you coach somehow.
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Old 11-19-2012, 02:23 PM   #368
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glanza_Mike View Post
I think flat calling the 3bet could be good/better, and i don't agree that almost every card is a scare card, the only massive draws he has are 9Tss really, he won't be getting in Axss here 300bb deep, nor will he get in 56ss i don't imagine. I think flatting 3bet is probably superior.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Blonde View Post
Yea. What do you mean by 'scare card'. This is a fairly arbitrary term, it's not like he's 3bing flop with all spade combos but at least you balance for the times you x/r 9Tcc/A4ss/56ssetc. It's not a cooler once you 4bet flop, you're literally isolating your hand against 88/KK almost always, also when you just flat you give him a chance to bluff hands like AsQx/9s9x/9Tcc/JThh etc
Ok, I'm kinda inclined to accept the flat to his 3bet line, and re-evaluate turn based on the turn card, sizing etc.

Tx Guys!
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Old 11-19-2012, 02:25 PM   #369
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Two hands from today vs a very good Israeli deep-tables-reg..

Hand 1:

PokerStars - $2 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

SB: $384.33
BB: $205.00
UTG: $468.74
MP: $360.97
CO: $592.40
Hero (BTN): $430.68

SB posts SB $1.00, BB posts BB $2.00, SB posts ante $0.40, BB posts ante $0.40, UTG posts ante $0.40, MP posts ante $0.40, CO posts ante $0.40, Hero posts ante $0.40

Pre Flop: ($5.40) Hero has A K

fold, fold, CO raises to $6.00, Hero raises to $19.00, fold, fold, CO calls $13.00

Flop: ($43.40, 2 players) 4 Q A
CO checks, Hero bets $28.11, CO raises to $68.00, Hero calls $39.89

Turn: ($179.40, 2 players) K
CO checks, Hero checks

River: ($179.40, 2 players) 5
CO checks, Hero bets $98.25, CO raises to $505.00 and is all-in, Hero ???

--------------------------------------

Hand 2:

PokerStars - $2 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG: $512.37
MP: $653.08
CO: $219.19
Hero (BTN): $315.80
SB: $535.35
BB: $473.91

SB posts SB $1.00, BB posts BB $2.00, UTG posts ante $0.40, MP posts ante $0.40, CO posts ante $0.40, Hero posts ante $0.40, SB posts ante $0.40, BB posts ante $0.40

Pre Flop: ($5.40) Hero has A 3

UTG raises to $6.00, fold, fold, Hero calls $6.00, SB calls $5.00, BB calls $4.00

Flop: ($26.40, 4 players) 3 K 9
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $15.88, SB raises to $48.95, fold, fold, Hero calls $33.07

Turn: ($124.30, 2 players) 6
SB bets $74.00, Hero raises to $260.45 and is all-in


Thoughts???
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Old 11-19-2012, 02:27 PM   #370
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

yeh h2 looks reasonable

ive not got a clue what is going on in h1 i'll be honest, but my instinct is he's probably way too unbalanced towards value hands
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Old 11-19-2012, 05:40 PM   #371
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

h2 looks fine, have no idea wtf is going on in h1.
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Old 11-19-2012, 07:25 PM   #372
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Why are we checking turn in hand 1? To avoid getting c/r?
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Old 11-19-2012, 07:31 PM   #373
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

isnt it incredibly unlikely we ever get called by villain in hand 1 given the action? AQ is pretty much the only hand that *could* checkcall river but we would have to bet bluffs on the river which we cant rly hav in that spot. i m pretty sure with AJ hero wouldnt bet either turn or river and given our turn check and the stack depth we are holding the best hand in our range while villain can credibly ret all better hands. even AQ could possibly turn itself into a bluff here. i think we should probably fold hand1 but i m not entirely sure about the river bet in the first place.
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Old 11-19-2012, 07:40 PM   #374
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

wtf I mean. Hand 1 the only value hands he has that beat us are JT and 44. And I dont see him raising flop w/ 44. And if he did he wouldnt check the turn.

JT could be, but hes gonna call some % of the time Im guessing

Id call hand 1

Hand 2 I really dont like ur call on the flop to the cr.
After I do call the Cr im just flating the turn. I mean ur either up against stuff that has you beat (K9,99,33) or ur agaisnt JT, QT, JQ, etc so I dont like the shove, it looks like meh wathever I have a pair+fr Im all in and hope for the best

I think its better to call and he will sometimes give up bluffing, sometimes you will have a flush /2 pair and he will still continue bluffing, and you can hero call sometimes I guess depending on villian

Last edited by chillskill; 11-19-2012 at 07:46 PM.
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Old 11-19-2012, 08:22 PM   #375
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Re: Being a 1000NL reg by the end of 2012 [STASIA42]

Hey buddy,
I subscribed to a thread on 2+2 for the first time. Amazing job. First of all, I haven't played 2-4 in more than 1 year and haven't play much poker in last 4 months at all, but I have some suggestions to make. You can take it if you like it, you don't have to if you don't, but here they are:
PokerStars - €2 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BTN: €227.79
Hero (SB): €342.01
BB: €284.12
UTG: €250.80
CO: €196.32

Hero posts SB €1.00, BB posts BB €2.00

Pre Flop: (€3.00) Hero has K A

UTG raises to €6.00, CO calls €6.00, BTN calls €6.00, Hero raises to €28.39, fold, UTG calls €22.39, CO calls €22.39, BTN calls €22.39

Flop: (€115.56, 4 players) Q K A
Hero checks, UTG checks, CO bets €24.00, fold, Hero raises to €313.62 and is all-in, fold, fold

Hero wins €161.41

Not sure what to do here, prob have best hand, don't really see how to extract equity from it if I cbet flop except from running into JT here and there.


Lead flop here. You get called once by many pair+straight draw that fold on the turn, but you get some value. Then you can check raise turn on a blank, because they mostly fire there from my past experiences. If they raise you on the flop, I would muck or call once and decide depending on a player.

From today's hands, I agree with hand 2 completely. His range for flop c-raise-call turn raise is probably sets only(4 combos possible), and he obviously doesn't have it a lot. Even if you are called you have equity and seeing how much more weak hands he has, you are definitely going to get more folds than you need to make it Breakeven play.

Hand 1 is a call, because AQ is in his Value range. Additionally, once you check turn back and bet river he thinks you mostly have weak 1 pair hand he can get you off, so it is a snap against a thinking player and a fish... P.S. Would you mind explaining you turn check, because the way you play the hand it is obvious that you have to call river shove...

Last hand and probably the only "newer" hand that I don't agree with you is this:
CO: $224.30
BTN: $249.56
SB: $306.82
Hero (BB): $214.48
UTG: $625.21
MP: $426.80

SB posts SB $1.00, Hero posts BB $2.00

Pre Flop: ($3.00) Hero has 2 A

fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to $4.00, SB calls $3.00, Hero raises to $20.00, fold, SB calls $16.00

Flop: ($44.00, 2 players) 2 4 6
SB checks, Hero bets $23.47, SB calls $23.47

Turn: ($90.94, 2 players) A
SB checks, Hero bets $47.59, SB calls $47.59

River: ($186.12, 2 players) 4
SB checks, Hero bets $123.42 and is all-in, SB calls $123.42

Hero shows 2 A (Two Pair, Aces and Fours) (Pre 56%, Flop 24%, Turn 91%)
SB shows 4 6 (Full House, Fours full of Sixes) (Pre 44%, Flop 76%, Turn 9%)
SB wins $430.16

Never turn you top pair in a bluff here, if you do you have to Overbet, but stack sizes don't allow you to do that. If you check back you are good sometimes because passive fish can call you with 45 and 56 on the turn only to fold on the river. And, I hate this line for value as well if that's what you had in mind...

Take care and good luck, we might play against each other in May I guess
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