played like 2 hours of live PLO, dropped a little less than £700~

only so many times you can get it in good and lose, gets frustrating after a while. I think it's the same reason I don't pay mtts.When I play live i really want to stick to NLHE, as I feel my edge on the field is massive against almost everyone.

In PLO i constantly find myself in spots where I'm unsure what the highest EV play is, yet I still manage to get into these crazy +EV situations w/o any kind of deep understanding of how to play PLO well...just because of how terrible the fish are.

Today for a 1k pot i managed to get in AAQTds vs AK33... I would say i'm pretty hardened to the variance of poker, from starting on a short roll and playing live a lot, but PLO is just ridiculous....


Basically what I'm crying about is that I think I need a bigger roll to play the PLO games that I want to play in, but my current strategy for building a roll to play in the PLO game, is to gamble up a roll in said game lol


ffs!

Playing in Manchester atm as back home for mothers day. Some decent action. I sat down at the 1-2 game with £200 and average stack was prolly less than what I sat down with so was kinda like ffs could have played online instead of traveling all this way.

About an hour in a guy sat down on my direct right with £500 so I topped up to around £700 total to cover. This seemed to inspire action as within about an orbit average stack had risen to around £500!

Had two pretty sick hands vs the donky whale who had been jamming with gutshots for £200 and just hitting everything. He'd managed to get his stack up to £1k~ and I'd just moved to be IP when this hand happened.


UTG: £1k+
Hero (MP): £800

Pre Flop: (£3) Hero is MP with A Q
UTG raises to £45, Hero calls

Flop: (£93) Q T Q (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets £70, UTG raises £900 all-in, Hero calls £685

Turn: (£1603) A (2 players)
Both players all-in

River: (£1603) 2 (2 players)
Both players all in



sigh!!!


I reloaded £800 and then this hand happened. BB is same whale

SB: £400
BB: £1k+
Hero (UTG): £800
MP: £300
BU: £200

Pre Flop: (£3) Hero is UTG with A J
Hero raises to £10, 4 callers

Flop: (£50) J 4 3 (5 players)
BB bets £25, Hero calls, 3 folds

Turn: (£100) 6 (2 players)
BB bets £100, Hero calls

River: (£300) J (2 players)
BB bets £665 Hero calls £665 (all-in)



I tanked otr for like 2 minutes, then asked whale a load of questions about if he liked his hand, what he thought I had.

My decision here lies on if I think he is betting a Jx for value in this manner. He was a classic whale where limp calls, check calls post when he has something marginal or a draw, so when he bets out like this he can easily have two pair+ otf which defo makes this river decision no more than a bluff catch imo.

I asked him what he thought I had, and he said two pair, ie puts me on OP and is therefore more likely to be value betting all his Jx, so I should call.

Idk, lol-live-poker-reads! I think the call is marginal at best but this **** happens so much when you play 25 hands an hour that all edges pretty much have to be stretched imo. The other two regulars at the table who i considered to be semi decent were shocked that I didn't snap call...I don't know maybe I was nit rollin' but was stuck a decent amount in the game so wanted to think it through before making a decision :P

Gona play live some more tonight I think, was nice to get my money back from the whale and I finished the session up £510 which is nice i guess but it kinda felt break even after all the money changing hands.

gl all!

Gl op with the thread !!!
What book u said that u are reading ?

That was a nitroll obviously. You are a horrible human being. Almost as bad as not showing your cards when all-in on stars.

AJ huuuuuge nitroll! i put the money in so fast there haha

Lol yup defo nitroll esp vs whale

Nitroll but still pretty sick how you got stacked in that £1600 to a 1 outer.

How's the 1/2 at 235? Was on 1/1 there last night trying to build the br

Janda's


i guess too much online poker where that line is a set/2p+ otf almost always ( lead multiway ) combined with overbet makes my hand a bluff catcher, at least I thought so at the time. my read may be off but i have a feeling half the people saying it's a nitroll are being sarcastic, and the other half are being genuine!

1/2 is normally very good

1/1 is normally decent too i guess if your br won't support playing the 1/2



Played 2 days at 235 this weekend, ended up £1.1k so can't complain. Back to bham tomorrow for a night out / essay preparation and then hopefully when I get back to manchester there is a home game setup by a friend of mine in which I can hopefully attend. I've been told it plays quite big, but that "I'm sure you can afford it". This is prolly because I buyin to the 1-2 for £1k, but what these people might not realise is that for me to lose the 500bb I'd have to run horrible lol. This game sounds more like a deep 2/5 or a 5/10 100bb effective, which I'm prolly not rolled for tbh....#shotshotshots

Never been afraid to gamble it up on a short roll but this may be pushing it!

Meh we shall see! Might not even get an invite so no use stressing.

My friend who I've been semi coaching/giving advice to showed me his graph today at 25nl after I helped him fix his red-line. He was breaking even pretty much at 25nl after beating 10nl and moving up. I think I've helped him to understand more of the preflop fundamentals in making solid postflop reads and moves, that's helped him quite a bit, although obviously a lot of the credit for this nice graph is down to his own effort and determination! But I think I will steal a little bit of lime light for myself

nice, interesting thread
GL!

edit: I donated u my journeyman post. has to bring some rungood

That is for sure one of the graphs i would like to have in the game s i play..!!

I believe the help you gave your friend was critical since i saw a very nice improvement in your redline also the last graphs you posted.

Must comment though that he is running very very good...All in ev is almost
20bis down!

haha nah only 10 buyins!

Do you mind pm'ing me your friends name. I wouldn't mind trying to set up a PLO home game and I'm friends with most in the Manchester community.

pm me your skype

Ok so last night played in this home game at this baller apartment. Game was very good and a decent amount of money on the table. I had direct position on the biggest value at the table.

Unfortunately I ran like aids, always having the second best hand

Examples:

KQ on Qxxx9 villain has Q9
QJ on QxxQx villain has KQ
88c on K8Thhc 5c 2c where vs the whale I bet three streets then get raised OTR by t9cc

Total damage = £-1050


Pretty happy with my play in general tho, when playing live I occasionally lose focus and spew/leak money, which didn't happen that night, was just lots of coolers I was on the wrong end of.

Went 235 for 3 hours after the game died at 4am. Won £200 in a crazier game than the home game I'd just been at. There were three whales sat with a total of £8k, my m8 regular sat with £3k and another two regs sat with £2k ea


Tonight

There's been to my knowledge a game in liverpool which is known to be very crazy and very swingy. Lots of money on the table and chunks of it being thrown around. It's another private game but after chatting with a few of the people in the game I've managed to get myself a seat. The guy who 'got me in' said to bring £4k so should be good lol

Hopefully will/can report back with some crazy stories!

gl every

Get your shotgun with u just in case !!! :P

Ok just finished my session in the private game @ liverpool, and oh god was it sick in many cruel and amazing ways.

Players

Seat 1: Gambling addict/degen/donk with £2k stack
Seat 2: Game owner, nitty winning player
Seat 3: BE player in the game
Seat 4: BE player in the game
Seat 5: BE player who tilts from time to time
Seat 6: Mega fish £1k stack
Seat 7: Winning reg
Seat 8: Short stacker
Seat 9: Me! ( fish )
Seat 10: THE WHALE OF ALL WHALES!!! MOBY DICK, MAN THE HARPOONS HOLY ****

The game is incredible. Like, you have 0 fold equity, but you know when people refer to online poker back in 2007, where it was like printing money etc, this game is like that. If you have top pair or better you will get paid by worse EVERY TIME.

Randomly when there is a lul in the action, the whales/degens will be like " flip for £1k? kk! " and then boom huge chunks of money are just flying everywhere. This obviously makes for an insanely high EV situation, however as I found out not always a profitable one...

Tonight

My spirits with poker over past 2-3 weeks have been as high as they've ever been. I feel as I improved my redline, and worked with chillskill on my game, that online I was progressing past the majority of regs in terms of thought process and results for my stake, and live I legitimately feel that at almost every table I am the best player by a large margin. Arrogant? Yes, but don't mistake that for cockiness, I'm probably one of the most humble people at the table, and definitely one of the most self critical.

The last 2-3 days of poker have crushed my soul. The bad beats have come thick and fast, cooler after cooler, and all at the point where I've decided to play in higher stakes private games...**** MY LIFE. When i left the game today I felt utterly soul crushed and sick to my stomach, something I've not felt since I first began playing over a year ago when I was a clueless moron basically gambling.


Hands

#1

My first hand at the table. Open AK 2 callers in the blinds.

Flop(£30): K73
Checks to me, I bet £20, SB raises to £65, BB fold, I flat

Turn(£160): 8
SB goes all-in for £225, I call

River(£610): A



#2

Hero: £850
Seat 1(SB): £2k

Hero opens to £15 with KK, SB raises to £55, hero calls

Flop(£112): KJT
SB checks, Hero bets £80, SB raises to £250, Hero goes all-in, SB calls

Turn(£1702): Q:club

River(£1702): 2:spade



At the time, I had no reads on seat 1 so was just like sigh get it in, had I known anything about the villain, who is raising here with OESD, flush draw, aces, 2p, etc... super +EV jam from me, annoying cooler especially against this player whos range is wider than normal

#3

Hero(UTG): £2k+
Seat 10 (UTG+1): £700

I open to £15 with A3, Seat 10 calls, 3 other callers

Flop(£75): A37
I bet £50, Seat 10, raises to £165, 3 folds, I jam, Seat 10 calls

Turn(£1445): 4

River(£1445): T



Breather + discussion

So at this point I've not won a single hand at showdown, seat 1 is raising ATC to £25+ every time so I made some decent limp three bets, something I never do, but I limp 3bet around 4-5 times, each time collecting the £150-£300 in dead money from the regs cold calling the £30~ raise then folding to my £250 squeeze. Stacks were about at £1200-1500 so I'm basically 4betting them with hands like 22-66, QQ-AA, AK.

+side, OP has sick live poker redline
-side, OP is stuck £1k and running heavily under EV

I'm pretty much immune to bad beat tilt unlike some people because mainly I'm much more focused on if I made the correct play or not, than the results of my actions ( nerdy ik ), however, for these reasons after I played this next hand I basically snap quit the game because I wanted to further analyze it to see if what I did was good or not.


FEEDBACK WANTED ON THIS HAND PLSPLS!

Hero(BTN): £2k
Seat 10(SB): £1400

Hero squeezes UTG open and MP flat of £10, to £50 with AA Seat 10 flats, UTG and MP both flat

Flop(£203): J93
Checks to hero, I bet £100, seat 10 raises to £300 2 folds, I flat

Turn(£803): 9
Seat 10 bets £300, Hero ???


This spot usually is super standard, and I'm happy to play this spot all day vs a reg who is going to be doing this with a narrow range, by simply calling with the top x% of my defending range for this spot so I'm not over folding. However this is vs a mega whale, who in a hand previously raised me otf with ATo and called my jam. So here seat 10's range is not simply JJ/J9 + bluffs, here he can be over valuing hands such as Jx, QQ+. Here are the other pieces of information I was using to decide what to do.

1. Hand #3

2. A hand where he stacked off in a £1600 pot with AJ vs AK on Axxx vs's a reg's c/r ott

3. A hand in a 5-5 game I had played, where I was SB and he was BB, i 3bet pre w/ QQ which he flatted, then raised my cbet on a flop of 9xx and called my jam w/ TT



Using these pieces of information, I decided that he will have AJ/QQ/KK and play them in this way too by over-valuing them in typical whale fashion.

Conclusion:

Turn(£803): 9
Seat 10 bets £300, Hero goes all-in, Seat 10 tanks for over a minute and calls.

River(£2903):9




Ok so...ik it's a massive wall of text but I hope at least somebody managed to make it through it all. I'm pretty sure my play is right, but atm I'm still feeling a bit unhappy at losing so much in the game :/. Ended -£2040

Thought process seems solid all throughout, just ran into some coolers. The snap sitting out to analyze what you've been doing is a great idea, gonna try that out.

Hand 1 i like your flat otf because you under represent your hand and you make him bet a lot of his draws ott where you are going to shove any bet he makes.

Hand 2 is standard i guess and you beat so many hands

Hand 3 : i didnt realize he is the whale on the table until i noticed you analized all players above. So its prety std if its a player that will raise all ax here and call your shove.

Hand with AA vs JJ

I think that some times iv we face an aggro opponent he also has a gutter here and some combo of overs with bdfd. Why on earth would he would tank ? Nice play btw

Hand 3 is super standard man, wouldn't worry about it. Sometimes whales have the top of their range and there's nothing you can do about it.

I'd probably have 3-bet the flop small and called it off, think its slightly better as villains range likely has fluid equity on turns and I'm not sure how he'd play Q-A turns (with Jx).

Unlucky to run so bad in the biggest games you've played, but it happens. Gotta take them shots. Don't let it put you off.

AA fold flop vs almost everyone

PMd

He's not really asking if its a fold vs gen pop. Whales are a special case and if this guy is Moby Dick it's a snap GII.

I know he isn't...

When I say 'almost everyone' I don't mean your general live player. Without spelling it out I'll assume you get me

Hand 3 is a slowroll.

Wow, what a response. Either I'm wasting my run good on 2p2, or people find live hands more interesting than online 100nl! I personally prefer playing online for the most part because it requires more thought, although these very narrow spots live do occasionally crop up and cause you to think things through.


Thanks for all the comments guy, last night when I got back I felt like somebody had punched me in the stomach. I was completely gutted and a bit depressed, not so much about the financial loss because I can grind that back, but because for one of the first times in a live game I'd made a decision which I believed to be correct, but then was instantly proven wrong. Kinda knocked my confidence a lot, and him slow rolling didn't help matters...


Good to see that a lot of smart winning regulars are also on my side of the argument in the belief that in the long run we should be GII here vs this player, and it just sucks when he turns up with the top of his range because we will be drawing pretty much dead in a huge pot. Higher variance, yes, but higher EV? I also think yes, and so do a lot of you guys which i find comforting.


On a more positive note, my friend/apprentice who I've been helping to play online from 2nl is finally feeling comfortable enough to beat 25nl since I fixed his redline. He's still nitting it up but I'm giving him a shove out the door in terms of making him move up.

Here's his 25nl graph since I had a session with him and helped him with his blind defense. He was a winning player before, and has put in a lot of work but I still think I've helped him quite a bit




Anyway onwards and upwards, playing in another private game tonight this time in Manchester. Hopefully good action and higher stakes than would be offered at 235, so wish me luck guys and gl with your sessions!

glgl!