because i am not very good and need to firstly learn how to beat the $2.50 game... then i'll move to the the $8 or possibly try to play the $7 turbo 9 man or something....
not sure where i'll be going yet maybe mtt's... but basically feel extremely safe at $2.50 180 man with nearly 1000 buy ins which is what i feel any bankroll should be...

I recon I can average $100 a day once I can play 20 tables at a time...

I've just backed Ashun Wu in the BMW Masters, 250/1 £40 each way... This chap has a lovely golf swing and very nice putting stroke too. Currently lying at +1 8 shots back but only 3 shots back of 4th place, the each way bet pays 62.5/1 for a top 4 finish (dead heat rules apply)...

have only read the OP,

Im assuming cause youre talking in £'s you are from the UK. If so Im assuming by "professional golf coach" you're PGA qualified? Its what I planned to for a long time.

If so with your life situation(by this I mean no real responsibilities, gf/wife/kids) why dont you land a coaching job in one of the gold mines? Germany/dubai would be a main example, one of my friends works 9 months/year just coaching at an academy, gets 100k euro for his troubles, after a year of this, you could easily save your bankroll whilst gaining life experience and not just degening.

Your right I am UK and also am PGA qualified; I qualified 2 years ago.

I'd love to work in Dubai or anywhere in the middle east.. I nearly got a job in Saudi which was paying very well, got to last 3. But its so tough to get the job there literally 100-200 people apply for any position that becomes available and not that many do, but whenever they I do I apply...
I've just been out in Malaysia for the last year which was pretty cool, but pay was terrible as was paying the golf club 40% then my boss 40% so my cut for actually doing the lesson was ****! But I absolutely loved it out there and I love teaching golf to its great fun!
I think I'd be better working for myself and I see poker and golf betting as a means to achieve this.. Once I am sufficiently rolled I intend on opening my own academy and teaching who I want to teach for pleasure and not cos I need the money.... Hopefully in a few years time I'll be able to achieve this.

The best regs beat the $2.50 180-mans at a 20-30% ROI. Even at 25%, this means you are making about 62 cents per game.

This means you would have to play 161 games per day to have an expected return of $100/day. Even 20-tabling, this will take you about 8-10 hours.

From your previous comments about how you struggled to multi-table, I highly doubt you are anywhere near one of the best regs.

From your explanation of this hand, I doubt whether or not you are even a profitable player yet.

You said that you used to be a losing player. What have you done to improve your game?

I have been studying poker for about 5 years and have played nearly 10,000 $2.50 180-mans in my lifetime and I only beat them at an ROI of 16%.

Assuming your actual ROI is not as good as mine (but assuming you are profitable), lets use the assumption that your ROI is 10% when 20-tabling. This means you would have to play 400 of them per day to make $100 per day - (Impossible if you want to sleep)


SLOW DOWN. I have a maths and stats degree and this makes me cry.

Your argument about needing £10k to start your golf betting because you only bet on long shots which therefore have higher ROIs when you bet on them is ridiculous.

How many golf tournaments are there per year to bet on that enables you to overcome such high variance?

If you can pick 10/1 shots which actually have a 20% chance of winning a tournament, you would have far more success repeatedly betting on these guys with a 100% EVROI and low variance, rather than backing 500/1 shots which have a 1% chance of winning, where the EVROI is 400% (not 500 as you said) but variance is so high that it may never be met until at least 100 (but more realistically 1000) golf tournaments have been played.

People can grind high variance poker tournaments because they can play thousands per week. You cannot force more golf tournaments to be held, in order to overcome the variance which is causing your gambling addiction.

If you truly have a positive EVROI at golf betting with variance which can realistically be met (which I doubt is possible due to a lack of golf tournaments), it does not matter if you have £10k or £10, you can implement a betting strategy which will gradually win, and you up your stakes when you make more money. To say that you need to win at poker to fund your golf betting is a problem.

May I also ask what knowledge you have that outweighs the knowledge of bookmakers? They have highly sophisticated statistical models, which in all honesty outweigh the fact that you think some new 17 year old from Belarus has a nice swing. I have quite an indepth knowledge about betting markets and betting companies and the only people I see who can beat the bookies long term are people who have created their own models or found an error in bookmakers models. (E.g. there was a football trader who realised that all bookies shortened the odds of football teams that were winning by 1 goal far too sharply towards the end of matches. He made tens of thousands of pounds betting on teams to score last minute equalisers over a few years until bookmakers realised their mistakes).

Furthermore, betting companies restrict the limits of customers who win a lot of money quickly, thus making it nearly impossible to be a sports better professionally.

You sound like an addict, which is unhealthy. You would do well to listen to the advice of me and other people in this thread.

If you want to learn poker and start crushing the $2.50 180-mans, good on you, but don't do it because you NEEEED money for your golf betting addiction.

Do it properly by discussing strategy with good regs and reading all good 180-man threads on this site. Post your hands and ask questions. Post your results and get feedback. Don't just start spouting bulls*** saying that you can easily win $100/day with absolutely no evidence to back up such a claim. It makes you look foolish.

Tens of thousands of people make a living from grinding poker and having a positive EVROI over hundreds of thousands of tournaments. A handful of people make a living from grinding sports betting with a positive EVROI over thousands of bets. None make a living purely from betting on something so specific as golf tournaments. It sounds like you have had a few lucky wins and it has got to your head.

Start thinking logically and have the golf betting as a hobby. This will enable you to have a go at poker for the sake of becoming a sustainably profitable poker player. That is the dream.

Fair enough, when I was considering/looking at these things it was ~4 years ago and the profession seemed to be on the decline due to the recession etc.

GL and will be following

Bazza I couldn't disagree with you more about several things....
The thing you got my back up most about is the thing you said about how can I have more knowledge than the bookmakers etc etc... I know for a fact I have made bets and seen bets that have odds that are just plain incorrect... My perfect example being ladbrokes pricing up the first round leader market when the tournament was in singapore, the first 2 rounds were played on alternate course 1 being 3-4 shots easier! So of course the leader was going to come from the easier course, however ladbrokes hadn't factored this is whatsoever and there were several players massively overpriced in this market...
Also some of my picks of the young guns hasn't worked out... I backed Webb Simpson heavily I remember a few years ago before he had won his first event, I had backed him at 300/1... a couple of years later he has 4-5 wins and a us open!
Also you say you cannot make a living from just betting on golf... again I disagree with this too - I think your better off specialising in your chosen subject whether that be horseracing, greyhounds, whatever, mine is golf....

I can't be bothered to go on anymore at you but you say all these things and you just know nothing about me... so i've had enough of talking to you.

I apologise if I came across as abrupt and rude in my first post, but there are two points which I need clarification on in order to understand a lot of the things you have posted in this thread.

1. How many golf tournaments are there in a year to bet on? Surely there are not enough to overcome the variance of betting on 500/1 shots even if they really do have a 1% chance of winning a tournament.

2. Even if I accept you know things that bookmakers do not and can therefore find 'good value', I know that betting companies label customers based on how much they win. When they see you winning a lot, they will give you stricter and stricter betting limits and they will analyse your betting patterns to discover why you are beating them. This enables them to correct their odds in future, thus disabling you from being able to consistently beat them again. I feel like you haven't considered this fact.

Good luck though

This is either 1) 1big level 2) youre a walter mittey 3) or you are greatly exaggerating your golf winnings.

2. Even if I accept you know things that bookmakers do not and can therefore find 'good value', I know that betting companies label customers based on how much they win. When they see you winning a lot, they will give you stricter and stricter betting limits and they will analyse your betting patterns to discover why you are beating them. This enables them to correct their odds in future, thus disabling you from being able to consistently beat them again. I feel like you haven't considered this fact.

Good luck though

This is very true and I have actually been restricted from 3 or 4 bookies in brighton due to the kaymer win (the £38k one) and the sunghoon kang bet i won in hastings got me restricted for £20 max bet on me in hastings and eastbourne... however i've been out of the country for a year and haven't been to these bookies for 2 years or nearly that so I would imagine I will get away with it for a while... cannot do it online cos the website usually restricts the golf bet to max 20k win sometimes less. I don't like betfair so much for 2 reasons and potentially 3 reasons; my best bets are outright each way (its the each way part of the bet that represents the huge value) and first round leader each way (again the each way part is where the value is at)... and also although its never affected me cos i've never had a huge win on betfair if you use betfair primarily you will get hit by the premium charge..
So to let you know which I don't know why I have to but anyway, I have considered this obviously and i will drive to all the different bookies in south east... once i am restricted from all i can just pay 1% to a friend for them to place the bets, then once he/she is restricted find another friend to do the same, not hard....

Listen, I was planning on posting my bets once I have placed them on here to keep a betting/poker diary with P&L and all.. Please judge me after a year or so before saying I don't know anything and haven't considered things, without blowing my own trumpet I am pretty ****ing good at it, just give me a bit of time and don't start saying I know nothing when I go my first 3 months without a winner, sometimes I win 3 or 4 in a month sometimes nothing for 3 months, thats how it goes.
As I say I will always post my golf bets and feel free to get on aswell if you wish, usually the bookies cut their price though if I have a large bet on a long odds player... but there's loads of bookies make sure you get the best price with oddschecker.com

there is around 80-90 tournaments a year on both european and us tour, probably 70 of those i would be able to find value possibly more

Upload HH bro

whats HH? Hand History?

Yeah, you can get some advice on hands and improve so this isn't isn't just a blog about a guy playing the smallest stakes available online

nice thanks mate, i came into a few sticky spots today, i'll post my next one where i'm not sure what the correct play would of been, thanks...

Just managed a 3rd place finish in the $2.20 6 Max Turbo shipped in $696

Bankroll now $2902 very chuffed!

Agree with the whole of this post and well done for taking the time to write it, it was very kind and spot on.

I believed in u right from the start.

please say this is a level!

Why do you keep going on about levels, and walter mitty's etc etc.... It's simple I'm not the best player by any stretch of the imagination but I'm rolling up my sleeves and giving it a shot, and so far so good $900 up...
Gonna have a day of MTT's $5.50 and under, hopefully will have a good day

You aren't posting any hand histories, asking for advice or taking any advice given to you. You also experience a "rush" gambling. I think these are all really ominous signs but hey good luck to you. I hope you hit your million.

OP is an absolute genius, who I know for a 100% certain fact is beating the bookies. Well done, ignore the nay-sayers and negative thinkers, like Bazza.

thanks mate.. how do you know that?

just playing a few $2.50's and getting absolutely stuffed, QQ losing to K10, AA losing to 2 pair, horrid horrid run... $110 down so far today, but I do understand the 180 man is like that and i will go through spells of getting stuffed...

Pretty interesting topic, though my understanding of Golf and Golf Betting is close to -1 on the scale from 0 to 10 .

Good luck with that.

ok man im kind of warming to you and ill give you the benefit of the doubt, so i tell you what, give me a juicy outsider to do every wednesday and if i bet and win ill ship you 10% on fulltilt