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You're at the table in your local casino You're at the table in your local casino

07-29-2011 , 07:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreenMile
Have you really ever felt like a fish was uncomfortable or that his entertainment was lessened because a question went unanswered? I've never even seen a fish angry at another player's silence.
Yes, and I have.

Quote:
And yeah, don't iso the fish either. Also don't c/r them. Also, try to let them win all the money so they feel comfortable.

Some of the stuff in here is absurd.
Now you're just being overdramatic. Advocating a friendly attitude should not turn into a slippery slope of never taking aggressive actions.
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07-29-2011 , 08:51 PM
Hmm, I am not sure about this. I get asked this question once in a while (usually when the flush completes and I bet). Sometimes a young aggro guy asks what I have. I usually tell the truth. Then they ask "show me if I fold". Then I say "no" and act offended that they asked me. This has gotten me a few calls before. But I do not have enough opportunities to test this.
You're at the table in your local casino Quote
07-29-2011 , 11:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by randomrules
"Hell, I may not show you if you call."
Either silence or this IMO.
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07-30-2011 , 03:02 AM
Say nothing,

If anything, when you say ok I will show, you only give him more incentive to fold.
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07-30-2011 , 09:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by randomrules
"Hell, I may not show you if you call."
lol. That's clever.

I'd say nothing as the standard. You certainly never ever say yes. You're giving them incentive to fold. That's just terrible. Never do that.
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07-30-2011 , 10:55 AM
Play mum poker. I prefer maximum.
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07-30-2011 , 04:27 PM
if there are two hearts on the board, say "I got the hearts"
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07-30-2011 , 06:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibuprofen
Fish play poker for entertainment purposes. They do not want to have a mental battle with someone who is clearly better than them. Inferiority is not a fun feeling.

As a shark (I hope everyone here views themselves as one) I feel it is my responsibility to protect my fish like a pimp protects his hoes. When I see some Phil Ivey wannabe treating low stakes like the WSOP I make it a point to take position and give them my undivided attention. Just like if there is a reg isolating MY fish I need to expunge the parasite from the table to protect my bottom line.

I have come across other players who share my philosophy. Do you guys ever consider the ramifications of your silence when analyzing the benefits?
This is ridiculous and way overboard. I don't think that a fish is any more likely to be intimidated/pissed/non-entertained by someone who doesn't talk in the middle of a big hand than they are to be pissed/annoyed by someone who clearly thinks they are a shark but feigns congeniality, which in my experience inevitably comes off as fake and condescending.
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07-30-2011 , 06:27 PM
+1 more that will sit in silence until after the hand.

Once the hand is over though, I'm usually willing to chat with fish. I''ll pretty much never say what I had (lying or truthful) but I'll say something like "Good fold" or some other vague type of comment to try to make them feel whatever way I feel is most beneficial to me.

Poker is a game of psychology (Well, it's a war really). You should be trying to gain any edge you can. Many people (including myself) feel that someone is more likely to give away extra info if they're talking. I will often try to get someone talking OTR when it's HU and I'm facing a bet or raise but I am much less likely to talk when the situation is reversed.
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08-01-2011 , 08:31 AM
I was recently in a similar situation, but it went the other way. Villian and I were going at it. I had 10/10 in the pocket and the board was 9c2h7d 4c 9d. Once the river hit, Villian went all in with about $65. I was 95% sure he was bluffing. I mean what else could he have. Sure he could have had A/A in the pocket, but no pre-flop raises. Sure he could have had another 9, but he didn't play as if he had hit top pair on the flop.

Long story short - he goes all in and I tank, really trying to figure this out. After about 1-2 minutes, Villian is getting annoyed that I'm tanking, and says "I'll show you either way". I immedately moved my chips in, taking down the pot with 2 pair. The fact that he told me he would show me has cards confirmed for me that he had nothing. It was a rookie mistake and I'm sure he said it just to get the action moving again, but I knew instantly that he had nothing. Keep that in mind becasue it can work against you.

If I were you, I might have smirked at the villian and said something along the lines of "it only costs you $xx to find out". If you are sitting on the nuts, ignoring table chat and staring at the pot don't work for me. I'll play games with you. I'm I'm bluffing, stone cold stare at the pot.
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08-01-2011 , 10:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kboy420
If I were you, I might have smirked at the villian and said something along the lines of "it only costs you $xx to find out". If you are sitting on the nuts, ignoring table chat and staring at the pot don't work for me. I'll play games with you. I'm I'm bluffing, stone cold stare at the pot.
These are very obvious tells that most recreational players have. You're burning money.
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08-01-2011 , 10:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by trob888
These are very obvious tells that most recreational players have. You're burning money.
Most people playing at 1/2 ARE recreational players.
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08-01-2011 , 11:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kboy420
Most people playing at 1/2 ARE recreational players.
Yea so what you're doing is even more dumb.
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08-01-2011 , 12:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacmanjt
dont talk
+1
You're at the table in your local casino Quote
08-01-2011 , 02:47 PM
I recommend saying nothing unless you are very confident with your table talk, and feel like the positive value you gain through your manipulative skills outweighs the negative value of carelessly leaking information to an unknown. Even the worst players can have keen instincts, so don't feel invincible vs. them in this regard.

yesterday I ship QQ PF from the SB after an open and a million calls, and a fishy caller lady was tanking.(PF raiser had folded). she did'nt ask if I would show, but i volunteered:
"I'm not showing you when you fold, you know I never show"", and she snap called that moment.
I had a read on her, and know that she hates the idea of being bluffed.
I also know that she views me as aggressive, which equates to crazy in her book, because she is uber-passive. you need this kind of info to think about using table talk in a hand.
what i said wasn't random, but was 100% pre meditated.
moral of the story: table talk should be a tool.
know how to use a tool before you use it or you might get hurt.
most of the time vs. unknowns I don't say anything during a hand, because I don't have the info to formulate a plan.
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08-01-2011 , 02:48 PM
some of the best **** i do to get a raise into my bet if i have the nuts is look at every opponent left to act. look them in the eye while they're thinking about making a decision. make eye contact with them if they are looking at you so you know they see you and instantly make a "oh ****" face and kinda curl your lips like "please don't raise". this works especially well against the table bully or juice head or the one that doesn't want to be pushed around.

then u sit there for a little and shove. so much fun.
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08-01-2011 , 02:51 PM
I recommend saying nothing unless you are very confident with your table talk, and feel like the positive value you gain through your manipulative skills outweighs the negative value of carelessly leaking information to an unknown.

yesterday I ship QQ PF from the SB after an open and a million calls, and a fishy caller lady was tanking.(PF raiser had folded). she did'nt ask if I would show, but i volunteered:
"I'm not showing you when you fold, you know I never show"", and she snap called that moment.
I had a read on her, and know that she hates the idea of being bluffed.
I also know that she views me as aggressive, which equates to crazy in her book, because she is uber-passive. you need this kind of info to think about using table talk in a hand.
what i said wasn't random, but was 100% pre meditated.
moral of the story: table talk should be a tool.
know how to use a tool before you use it or you might get hurt.
most of the time vs. unknowns I don't say anything during a hand, because I don't have the info to formulate a plan to manipulate them yet.
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08-01-2011 , 02:52 PM
I'm starting to like the response of "only if you do."
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08-01-2011 , 04:11 PM
I am just surprised this thread is still going.
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08-01-2011 , 07:01 PM
I have a strange way of dealing with this - - - because I don't like sitting silently and I don't like ignoring people. Personality flaw of wanting to be nice to people I guess.

I have a saying and I use it quite often. "When I bet you should fold." In this situation I can then say "I always answer this question the same way. remember what I told you? When I bet you should fold."
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08-02-2011 , 03:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibuprofen
I disagree with many of the replies. Saying nothing is only optimal against a good player. Against a fish or at any 1/2 table I always show. You are hurting future profits if you act like you're on HSP.

Fish appreciate a friendly dynamic and will show you their cards throughout the night, even if you don't ask. Some of them will even check down the nuts with you. Besides, what are you afraid of? It's not like fish are capable of properly exploiting the information you give them.
Problem is, he wants to see the cards, and if he knows he'll get to see them, that's more reason to fold. If you are too friendly and comfortable, he'll interpret strength.
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