Yeah if you look at equity calculators 66 is like top 16%, A9 top 10%, while 74o is like top 86%. So while PFR wise you're a super nit, VPIP wise you're probably greater than the 15% benchmark TAG (saw this posted somewhere in the forums not sure if it's absolute). These extra hands help you smooth your curve according to earlier posts, which makes sense to me.

Yes, that makes some sense. I call this "mullet poker": all business up front but party in the back.

GcluelessmulletnoobG

Poker is a game. Games are supposed to be enjoyable. This sounds like the exact opposite of enjoyable. You're basically watching paint dry for 21/hour, which sounds great - until you actually try to watch paint dry and realize that it blows.

For my job a few years back i spent 7 months watching people watch other people do their job - not joking, effectively I watched the Watchmen, and add an obligatory lol-fed government. I was paid much more than 21/hour. It sounded awesome, until like the second week when I wanted to claw my eyes out. I could not image willingly do that for fun for years on end, but that's effectively what you have done.

I mean, some people think playing soccer is fun. Can we laugh at those people? Sure. But dont judge them for doing what they enjoy doing, imo.

JOTS - completely subjective mang. GG may ackshually having more fun than any 1 in the whole room. All I know is right now with a long term wr north of 50/hr I cant stand being in there for more than 3 hours dealing with the dooshyness of all those asshats...I personally think people that are rec players should find a new hobby and do something both fun and interesting....but some people absolutely love it - I guess that is what makes the werld an interesting place

+1

I love it too. Regardless of the style I try to play. Obviously it's more fun when you're winning.

if you play poker somewhere regularly, it should be somewhere that hanging out at (and i don’t mean firing in pits/at machines) isn’t the worst thing in the world imo. so if that’s true, i guess playing 0/0 and pretending to look at your cards (with free blinds for some reason) would also not be the worst thing in the world.

this is why dog track poker is the worst thing in the world imo

Please don't misunderstand what I was getting at, I'm by no means laughing at him or judging him. If anything, it's skewing more towards admiration than anything else. It takes an amazing amount of discipline to play the way gg does. A discipline I defiantly do not possess.

Vpiping 4 times an hr like G instead of 6 like a typical tag equating to enduring medal worthy boredom doesn't really make sense to me. Having to surrender my 16's at 21 tables that offered it never broke my heart...

He still gets to watch the ball game out of the corner of his eye, occassionally admire some nice boobs, etc. He can still talk sports, travel, food, etc. He still gets to see people gambling. Still gets to squeeze cards hoping for a big pair. Still gets to try to flop sets. Not getting to barrel three streets with a whiffed KT offsuit isn't exactly the same thing as isolation torture.

*notanendorsementofGsstyle

I see Im not the only guy who cant spell "definitely". I spelled it correctly this time but dont expect it to happen again.

Sometimes autocorrecting is worse than spelling the word wrong

Defiantly kind of makes sense still.

I see what you did there

I would guess I enjoy my time at the table more than anyone else, but that's just a guess based on what I see.

To bring it back to winrates: unless you're a wizard, winning poker for the rest of us is mostly super "boring" poker.

GbuteachtotheirownG

Sometimes winning poker is more excitement than a person wants: "Jeebus, do I really want to commit ten percent of my stack by four-bet bluffing A2s? No, but it's the right thing to do. Here goes. . . ."

GG - how deep do you get before you switch tables/leave? I have experimented with playing a 60-70 BB stack at 2/5 and 5/10 lately when I can get in a game. My "problem" is I've been running my stack to 130-200 BB and stall out for hours or punt some/all of it.

If your job or your life is busy and stressful ... sometimes just sitting at a table, people watching and bull****ting is relaxing and worth it. Even if you're not "playing a lot of hands". If you can relax and have a winrate > your other hobby, then it's worth playing. (Not that that doesn't even need to be > $0/hr.)

Probably a little too much of a strategy question versus winrates discussion for this thread. But very short answer: Can effectively rathole by moving to a shorter stacked table / where deeper stacks aren't difficult players, and otherwise if uncomfortable deep at the particular table can either (a) play extremely tight/nitty/passively and attempt to play small pots with everything but ~nuttish postflop hands or (b) leave. I wouldn't be too concerned about "stalling out for hours" as most of boring poker is simply treading water for hours on end until something really good happens.

G12.7bb/hrover62hoursin2019,winrates!G

So late for the new year, but to summarize 2018:

660.6 hours at $7.95/hr for a pretty "blah" result overall.

The funny thing is that only 124.9 hours of that was NLHE last year, the other 535.7 hours were all from $1/2 PLO home games. 2017 was a 232/390 split.

Sun-running at $85.93/hr over 44 hours in 2019 though

Angrist, did you do much better in NL vs PLO (or vice-versa) or was it all about the same?

Gcongratsonthewinningyear,imoG

Completely agree. If a guys is making money with a style he’s good at and enjoys, is that crushing? If I could squeeze out 2 more BB’s an hour but my enjoyablity drops or stress increases then i’d 100% forgo the additional $$’s.

I should also say that l’m at $252/hr at $2/5 for ALL of 2019 so i’m A super-baller and my opinion should count double everyone else’s.

GG:

In 2017
$7.40/hr in NLHE
$14.76/hr for PLO

In 2018
$2.39/hr in NLHE
$9.25/hr for PLO

But with only 125 hours that 2018 NLHE rate really doesn't mean anything. I lost about $1500 in the first 3 NLHE sessions of the year with stuff like AA < QT preflop, top-2 to TPTK that piled it in and rivered it, etc. So that's like -$100/hr for 15 hours, then +$20/hr for 110 hours or so. 2017 was probably more 'normal' but I don't remember details as I really didn't get to play it that often.

Overall my lifetime WR in PLO is about $2/hr higher than NLHE. But if I trim out the early stuff when I was just learning the game and making a lot of stupid mistakes it's more like $10-15/hr higher.

I've actually adopted a strategy that I think you'd love for PLO. SUPER tight. I never raise preflop unless I can get my whole stack in multi-way with a *really* big hand like AAKxss+. I'll call a decent number of $5-15 bets preflop, but won't call a $50 re-pot without position and a monster. I never lead out in EP post flop OTF. Sometimes OTT or OTR depending on the players. But mostly I'll check raise the nuts or big draws post. Get a lot of folds and some bitching from a couple of the regs, but still get paid off so whatever. This is probably an extreme strategy, but it's an adjustment to the insanity of the games that I play in and the level of knowledge we all have about each other. There are crazy stupid action players pushing it every other hand, and enough people know that I'm on the tighter side and that I have a big hand when I bet, so I get more value by letting them do it.


Twitch: Exactly. It's even more pronounced in a smaller pool like a home game circuit. You get to know all of the people to some level, and it's a lot more fun to BS with them about sports and other things.

^^^^

I know nothing about PLO (have literally never played a hand, not even sure I completely understand the rules, exactly 2 cards have to play?, lol), so kinda thankful my room has never spread it (especially afraid it might kill the NL action / make reg losers go busto quicker). They spread it in at least one other local room but I don't think it's really the game for me (although your strat seems right up my alley, lol).

Agreed that you can't base much on your NL results on so few hours last year; run better!

Gcongratsontheresultsgettingintoanewgame,imoG

PLO is great.

Everyone gets 4 cards, and you must use EXACTLY 2 from your hand to make the best possible 5 card hand. So on a board with QQQJ2, if you have 8766 you beat AKJT, since you have QQQ66 and he has QQQAK. If there's a 4 flush on board and you have the A of that suit you *don't* have a flush. Makes for some interesting spots and places where people can misread their hands.

You can only bet the amount of the pot at any time, which *seems* like it should make the game smaller than a No Limit game, but it doesn't since it grows so fast. It's also hilarious when someones says "re-pot", gets told 'that's $850 sir', and turns green because they didn't realize how big it would be.


All of the local home games have switched to PLO, the local charity rooms that used to have crazy NLHE action have adopted it and all the big action players are at the PLO table, and even the Casinos have started spreading it regularly. Those guys *love* it because they always have a draw (or think they do) and no hand is bad enough to fold (lol).

I know that it's made the local NLHE games *worse*. I wouldn't want to put a $/hr number on it, but you can tell from the overall action, the players that are sitting at the table, stack sizes, and how often the chip runners show up. I've watched action players that used to play 3-4 times a week for 3 years straight go busto when they switched to PLO and only show up 3-4 times a month now. It's made a lot more of the NLHE action like 'day-game' rock garden tables instead of weekend spewfests.

There's a lot more variance in PLO (good for the fish), but there's also a vastly bigger upside than NLHE since people are SO incredibly bad at it and just can't help themselves. It's probably good for poker overall, but the size of a $1/2 PLO game crushes most rec players bankrolls.

I don't think I'm in the top 10 best players in my room (only one 2/5 game) but here goes.

2/5: 21.95/hour over 134 hours
1/3: 35.87/hour over 93 hours

feels pretty bad to not even be making that much at 2/5. Also on a 10bi downswing which is the third time I've had a downswing that big in the last 6 months. I guess I gotta keep grinding and maybe I'll get out of it someday.