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Old 03-11-2018, 06:21 PM   #21251
samo
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

In my room, I'm told the fastest dealers go 18-21 hands per 30 minutes. Still, $1/$2 NL plays slower than $2/$5 NL.
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Old 03-11-2018, 07:37 PM   #21252
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@browni3141: The BBJ is already up to $661K & I did not know losing hand only gets 40%.
I agree you'll never recover 100% of your promo money raked from your pots, unless you have losing hand in a big BBJ.

@MikeStarr: I've played 2/5 at 3 different casinos & the players DO NOT take 15 seconds to decide & then toss in $5.00. They know when to act & usually do not delay the game for bullshytt reasons. The good dealers tell me they average 18 hands per table. They also say the high stakes PLO games play faster than many 1/3NL games.
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Old 03-11-2018, 07:38 PM   #21253
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeStarr View Post
If you're only getting 28 hands per hour, your dealers suck. Count the number of hands for a few sessions. Ive counted many times and the avg is right around 40. A little higher when theres no action. A little lower in the evening when there's more big pots.
I play at the same casino as ZuneIt and the hand speed is just about 30-35 hands/hour at most $1/3 tables. And 35 is probably the upper range.

Although if it does slow down due to drunk people and people on their phones not paying attention, they usually get reminded by the table to speed that **** up.

I'd love to play where the average is 40.
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Old 03-11-2018, 07:58 PM   #21254
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When it comes to speeding up cash games I want to find the person who first started circulating the strategy that you should wait until its your action to look at your cards and tell them to go die in a fire.

Most people would use their time machine to kill hitler but I would probably use it for that guy.
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Old 03-11-2018, 08:07 PM   #21255
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Originally Posted by Koss View Post
When it comes to speeding up cash games I want to find the person who first started circulating the strategy that you should wait until its your action to look at your cards and tell them to go die in a fire.

Most people would use their time machine to kill hitler but I would probably use it for that guy.
+1
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Old 03-11-2018, 08:32 PM   #21256
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Originally Posted by Koss View Post
When it comes to speeding up cash games I want to find the person who first started circulating the strategy that you should wait until its your action to look at your cards and tell them to go die in a fire.

Most people would use their time machine to kill hitler but I would probably use it for that guy.
I know a guy who does this, however, he is paying attention to the players behind him while trying to watch those in front of him.

Then, when it's his turn, he already has his cards in his hand & it doesn't take 3 seconds to look/fold.

Why is that? Because he doesn't pull them up & when he sees the ace of slowly squeeze the 2nd card out from behind the A like it's some kind of exciting event.

That's right folks! 2-3 seconds to look/fold.

And, since he pays attention to the table, instead of watching sports/reading facebook, etc., he knows what he will bet based on action in front & those behind him when he has a playable hand.

That person is ZuneIt

P.S. I would use my one-time in a time-machine to go back to my senior year in high school & have a condom in my wallet instead of having to say "no" to a fine young lady who refused to go out with me again because she was so embarrassed.
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Old 03-11-2018, 09:41 PM   #21257
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Yea just look at your cards before it is on you and play faster, it's better for your image and the your winrate.
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Old 03-11-2018, 09:51 PM   #21258
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Enough on the look before or not derail!
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Old 03-11-2018, 10:13 PM   #21259
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Enough on the look before or not derail!
what about zuneit's time machine strat? I honestly think his heart is in the right place and its a +EV move. However, I think that is is really really weak overall. And he is most likely a fish when it comes to Timemachine play...and would b considered a very weak nit in virtually any timemachine lineup.
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Old 03-11-2018, 10:26 PM   #21260
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I've counted a couple of times in the casinos around me, and I get about 16-18/down for a half hour down of $1/2 with a reasonable dealer. The slow as dog**** ones get 12, and the fast ones get 20. Average is little over 30. Call it 34.

I wish we got 40/hr.
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Old 03-12-2018, 02:15 PM   #21261
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Did 1-2nl even exist 15 years ago?
Ha, I was kinda thinking the same thing. When I would go Vegas in the 90s on business trips I seem to recall 7 card stud as the game of choice, but I mean I didn't really look hard for anything else (I had probably never even heard of Texas Hold'em at that point) so maybe it was around. And I definitely don't claim to be an expert on Vegas games in the 90s because I played liked maybe half a dozen times, but I'm sure others here are much more in on the know.

Gclueless1/2NLnoobG


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So if I'm reading this correctly you made 10,500ish in 211 hours? So 50$ an hour at 1/3 300 max? I would be prepared for some runbad.
If I've read things right, he's at $80/hr for his first 130 hours and $0/hr at his last 80 hours.

Gcongratsonyourfirst210hours,imoG


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On the plus side, promos and giant BBJs draw in bad players and help off-set the drain.
In smaller rooms that have a limited number of tables, this actually has a negative consequence in that BBJs often attract all-day grinders grinding the BBJ, which fills out the max tables and prevents randoms from passing by the poker room and getting into the game.

GimeG


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Originally Posted by MikeStarr View Post
If you're only getting 28 hands per hour, your dealers suck.
My guess is that style of game (i.e. super loose preflop, lots of chips going in to take / make change for, and longer streets postflop with more cards to deal / chips to deal with over multiple streets, etc.) has a much bigger affect than dealer skill.

My test from last year had our room at ~30 hands an hour (but then our dealers also have to handle cash-for-chips transactions so that definitely slows things down).

GcluelesshandsperhournoobG


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Originally Posted by ZuneIt View Post
That's right folks! 2-3 seconds to look/fold.
If everyone took 2.5 seconds to fold preflop (instead of the ~0 seconds it takes me to fold since I've already looked at my hand), that would add 2.5 * 10 players * 30 hands an hour (or approximately 12.5 minutes to each round). (I mean, my math ain't exactly right, but you get the idea)

Gpleasedon'tdothis,imoG
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Old 03-12-2018, 02:38 PM   #21262
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Originally Posted by gobbledygeek View Post
Ha, I was kinda thinking the same thing. When I would go Vegas in the 90s on business trips I seem to recall 7 card stud as the game of choice, but I mean I didn't really look hard for anything else (I had probably never even heard of Texas Hold'em at that point) so maybe it was around. And I definitely don't claim to be an expert on Vegas games in the 90s because I played liked maybe half a dozen times, but I'm sure others here are much more in on the know.

Gclueless1/2NLnoobG
holdem was common but cash was mostly limit. I dont think low stakes nl was a thing. That was reserved for some high stakes cash games or tournies. Maybe Im wrong though, Im just going by what old timers told me. I started hitting casinos in late 2004 and limit was still about half the cash games, and the old timers said the nl games were new, especially the 1/2 games.
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Old 03-14-2018, 08:15 PM   #21263
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2018 has been very good so far, had one losing session right at the beginning (-$10) and then 11 wins in a row. 29 hours to go to my first 1000 hours recorded, excited to share the graph when I hit it

stakes are 50/50 between 2/5 and 2/5/10
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Old 03-14-2018, 08:45 PM   #21264
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Nice heater! That's a great 50hrs. Looking forward to your first 1000 graph.
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Old 03-23-2018, 12:36 AM   #21265
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Originally Posted by Ranma4703 View Post

2018 has been very good so far, had one losing session right at the beginning (-$10) and then 11 wins in a row. 29 hours to go to my first 1000 hours recorded, excited to share the graph when I hit it

stakes are 50/50 between 2/5 and 2/5/10
Where do you play if you don't mind me asking?
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Old 03-23-2018, 10:21 AM   #21266
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Where do you play if you don't mind me asking?
I don't mind, cause it's pretty easy to tell by creeping on my post history.

I play at Sugar House
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Old 03-23-2018, 05:19 PM   #21267
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Every now and then I pop into this thread for the LOLs... I usually find myself agreeing with MikeStarr. It's easier to get 10bb/hr in 1/2 or 1/3 than 2/5, IMO.

I was in a 9-handed 2/5 this week, in Maryland no less, with six pros, a winning reg, and the world's biggest nit. The spot, if you can call him that - he'd win in other lineups - had <100bb. That sort of lineup is more and more common these days. The winning regs at 1/2 and 1/3 are still pretty easy to play against. I put together a pretty fun strategy during my 300 hour month last year.

Anyway, I have 950 hours of 1/2 and 1/3 in my records at 13.01 bb/hr. I played about 270 hours of it last year (mostly 1/3) during my 300 hour month. Otherwise, it's just while waiting for a game.

That 270 hours involved no game selection and no seat selection - in fact, negative seat selection at times. I always tried to get into the roomiest seats on the corner of the table (3 or 8 I think it was) to have more room, so that I'd be more comfortable for the long sessions. When I'm waiting for a seat in a bigger game I virtually never table/seat select, either, and I am often distracted while playing.

About 470 hours were in a 1/2 300 max with 4+1 rake. About 290 hours were in 1/3 300 max with 6+2 rake. The rest is scattered around. It's in 20+ rooms in eight different states. So, for a ~1,000 hour sample, it's a pretty good one with some pretty varied conditions and some tough rake structures.

And, let me give another +1 to those saying that virtually nobody who crushes 1/2 or 1/3 will ever stay around for 4,000 hours. Why would we? One of us is supposed to sacrifice $50-70/hr for like 3,000 hours to make a point? No thanks.
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Old 03-23-2018, 07:46 PM   #21268
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Where I live, even the "good" players suck. The problem is that nothing over 2-5 ever runs. I have a real job making good money; it's hard to get motivated for a lower hourly than my real job. I'd rather just go to Vegas every few months and view it as recreation.
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Old 03-24-2018, 03:27 PM   #21269
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Question of shot taking.

A little back ground on me.

Currently, I'm playing anywhere from 20-30 hours/week. Over the last 6-7 weeks I've played 135 hours of 2/3 and making 42/hour. I know I'm running a over EV, but over the course of 600+ hours playing at 2/3 I'm making around 28/hour.

I am also in the middle of a loooong job search. Getting the job is my main priority, and poker most likely will never become my #1 income option. With that being said, when I get my job, I can easily play 2/5 w/o risking going broke because I can supplement my poker br from the job. But, that's not the case rn.

I've managed to run my poker br up to 4k over the last 6-7 weeks. My initial goal was to run my br upto 6k, and take 1 buy-in shots at 2/5.


Given that my poker br and life roll are the same at this current moment, any suggestions on when to take a shot? Should I try to aim for 7k? Or 6k good nuff?
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Old 03-24-2018, 03:49 PM   #21270
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Honestly man - get your life dialed in before taking any shots. Getting/changing jobs is super high in the life stress index meter. Do not add to this with shot taking right now. Enjoy life on ez street play kick ass poker at the 2/3 level. Nail down a job - get yourself situated then take some shots.

How much would it suck to get nuked while shot taking get your roll low, get stressed, then somehow screw up an interview that you should nail?
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Old 03-24-2018, 04:19 PM   #21271
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Honestly man - get your life dialed in before taking any shots. Getting/changing jobs is super high in the life stress index meter. Do not add to this with shot taking right now. Enjoy life on ez street play kick ass poker at the 2/3 level. Nail down a job - get yourself situated then take some shots.

How much would it suck to get nuked while shot taking get your roll low, get stressed, then somehow screw up an interview that you should nail?
All very good points.
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Old 03-24-2018, 05:51 PM   #21272
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Honestly man - get your life dialed in before taking any shots. Getting/changing jobs is super high in the life stress index meter. Do not add to this with shot taking right now. Enjoy life on ez street play kick ass poker at the 2/3 level. Nail down a job - get yourself situated then take some shots.

How much would it suck to get nuked while shot taking get your roll low, get stressed, then somehow screw up an interview that you should nail?
squid bringing the truth bombs as always
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Old 03-24-2018, 06:08 PM   #21273
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Originally Posted by setintostraight View Post
I play at the same casino as ZuneIt and the hand speed is just about 30-35 hands/hour at most $1/3 tables. And 35 is probably the upper range.

Although if it does slow down due to drunk people and people on their phones not paying attention, they usually get reminded by the table to speed that **** up.

I'd love to play where the average is 40.
I counted hands during my last 4 sessions

1) 198 hands in 4hrs 23mins....45/hr
2) 126 hands in 3 hrs 1 min...42/hr
3) 164 hands in 4 hrs....41/hr
4) 153 hands in 4 hrs 15 mins...36/hr

First 3 sessions were daytime and the games are pretty nitty with small pots
Last session was Friday night. More degens, more action. More big pots that take longer.

I dont know if my room just has better and more efficient dealers than most or if Im getting more hands/hr because most of you guys work during the day and play in the evening when there are better, looser games with more action where each pot takes longer.

My guess is that more hands per hour is not better because the games are so nitty there is less chance to win large amounts of money.
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Old 04-01-2018, 03:27 PM   #21274
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My guess is that more hands per hour is not better because the games are so nitty there is less chance to win large amounts of money.
QFT
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Old 04-01-2018, 03:38 PM   #21275
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Originally Posted by MikeStarr View Post
I counted hands during my last 4 sessions

1) 198 hands in 4hrs 23mins....45/hr
2) 126 hands in 3 hrs 1 min...42/hr
3) 164 hands in 4 hrs....41/hr
4) 153 hands in 4 hrs 15 mins...36/hr

First 3 sessions were daytime and the games are pretty nitty with small pots
Last session was Friday night. More degens, more action. More big pots that take longer.

I dont know if my room just has better and more efficient dealers than most or if Im getting more hands/hr because most of you guys work during the day and play in the evening when there are better, looser games with more action where each pot takes longer.

My guess is that more hands per hour is not better because the games are so nitty there is less chance to win large amounts of money.
Yup, nitty games are uber-boring and the pots are tiny, and there aren't too many raised multi-way pots, and chopping seems like a hobby for lots of these regulars who play in these games. It feels like death.

The best games are the short-handed, overnight, loose/passive fit-or-fold games where people take lots of flops but insta-fold if they don't hit anything. Or they just consistently check/call and only bet or raise when they have something. It's like printing money. But these games are getting rarer and rarer because it's so easy for people to lose money if there is even one dominant player in the game.
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