Kind of amazes me when I hear of this sort of stuff. 14BI downswings in a 120bb cap game probably aren't super standard and to have two in such a tiny sample and still win at 9bb/hr? Kinda perplexes me tbh.

Kind of cross posting with your pg&c, but i believe dgaf was around 20k hours iirc

Logged!? Where TF is this giraffe!?

Im well over 10k

Not that you're obligated to or anything, but how come we never see 10k+ samples posted ITT etc? Or have I just missed them...

I was looking at Bart Hansen's graphs on his website. Never went more than 10k down playing 5/10. Some people...

Link to giraffe? I guess different styles, different caps, different standard deviations. No going on a 10BI downer at 5/10 over what sample? That's kinda absurd.

I recall finding a graph somewhere, but just go through the 500 hr challenges he sets up for himself in this link. I've heard him say in some of his podcasts that he hasn't had worse than a 10k downswing over like 1.5k hrs doing 5/10 at Commerce. Considering what he does for a living, I find it hard to believe that's all the hours he's ever put into 5/10, but it is what it is. He has mentioned that he's had $50k downswings playing 10/20 however.

True, ty, will check it out.

I've been on a $80k downswing in ~2 months playing a mix of 5/10/20 NLHE and 5/5/10/20 PLO at my local casino (play twice a week) and 10/25/50 PLO in Vegas.. was not fun

Where do you play and what do you look like?

Asking for a friend

When you combine that most people don't keep records and extremely few players actually can consistently win at poker, it isn't very surprising. On top of that, the older school players knew the last thing you wanted to do is let people at the table know how much you won. I'd prefer that people believe I'm a break even player at best, like most of the rest of them. I just get lucky a lot.

$80k doesn't seem to be that bad for those stakes of PLO.

There was a large series there this week, I wouldn't put a ton of weight into your results if you don't travel for poker and have big swings during big series. That said, given how bad the rake is at playground you've likely been running quite hot before this downswing.

My laptop got stolen with my database. Luckily I am old school and have written records. They are currently in storage across the country and one day I will update my giraffe with all of my results/hrs post BF. I posted a 2500+hr sample somewhere. DCFT saw my most recent 3k hrs and saw that I win north of 10bb/hr.

There are a handful o dudes that stomp the game over very large samples that post in llsnl. However, they do not post results itt. Prolly cuz they know they stomp and they got nuttin to prove/gain by posting their results. I can say with out a doubt they are legit and have worked exceptionally hard to achieve the results they do

Sometimes I feel there are so many aspects of my game I could improve, I sort of get lost trying to organize which leaks to focus on first & when to move on to another area. If you don't mind sharing, what was your process for planning/organizing off-table analysis & study when you first took poker seriously?

i'm in outside sales... i'd say 75% of the guys with the same job as me make less then 25k a year. 10% make avg money, and 15% around 80-120k with less then 5% clearing 150k a year. Is poker much different?

Also most players capable of beating the games don't have a challenge, keep a blog, or have public documents sharing there results.

The earnings / brackets would be similar but even less at the top. Im actually a bit disconnected from hs as compared to a few years ago but Id guess most live winning "pros" are $25-$50k (like 80%), 15% $50-$110k, 5% > $110k.

It should be noted though that those 5% are similar to the 5% earners in the country, where their top can be pretty high. I knew one personally who was > $200k (that i could readily believe, anyway)

People just way over estimate the true number of pros anyways. There arent many that last >2 years, from what I have seen over the past 5.

Also, the biggest problem isnt skill...its commitment. If most pros could put in 2k hours they'd be in the 15% with little to no study, imo. But they dont.

I dont blame them. Its very tough to do.

QS - In all honesty I got exceptionally lucky. I had a bunch of gamboolin buds from my blackjack days that were elite poker players. I was fortunate enough to be able to watch a high stakes endboss play on line and sweat his action, as well as discuss strat and ideas with several dudes that were mopping up the games back in the early 2000's

I got into a life changing accident in 2006. I spent 2 years getting surgery/recovering. I started playing again late 08. The game had changed significantly (on line from 06-08). I effectively had to relearn how to play. I started playing small - and watched as many cardrunners videos as I could - play - repeat. I did sweat sessions with on line pals...and we would discuss lines etc.

I think one of the most critical things in terms of improvement is to have a circle of friends who are around your skill level and really discuss ideas/lines/etc.

Again I am very lucky in that regard I have a circle that is highly intelligent and motivated


Edit - addl info

I dont play plo. I just spent 5 days back in las vegas. I was able to do multiple sweat sessions with a pal who is highly skilled at the game. Hearing a mid stakes players thought process etc had a real impact on me. I got several beautiful nuggets that I will incorperate into my NLHE game.

Can confirm Squidder is a crusher at 10 bigs an hour over a 2500 hr sample. I see no reason to believe he didn't have similar results before he got into the 21st century and got him an iPhone.

Closing in on 2,500 hours of 1/2 and 1/3. I have some solid results at 2/5, but not enough to be meaningful so am filtering them out.

Giraffe is entire sample. Then screen shot of stats are entire sample, last 1,500 hours and year to date.



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Zippy's on point. Well done man.

i'm fairly sure we play in the same games, very nice stats. Are the plentiful promo dollars included in those numbers?

also, i usually have orientation lock on and never thought to turn to landscape in Poker Income, and wow graphs look way better so thanks for that.

i recently surpassed the old peak so still in the running to have numbers like yours after another 1k hours

I know the rules are strict itt and im not epeening but i see graphs like zippy's get posted and Im like WTF AM I DOING WRONG then i see graphs like homers get posted and im like oh ok cool.

Nice graphs both of you.

@Ava the only difference really is sample size lol