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Old 02-03-2017, 03:13 PM   #17976
Dochrohan
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Well you would hope so
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Old 02-03-2017, 04:53 PM   #17977
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiltyjoker View Post
Probably. Maybe im thinking of slags... Would you agree that TAGs get to showdown with a higher % of hands they play than LAGs?
Yes.

Look, I've played with, 2, possibly 3 good lag players live. Thats over 2K hours, 4 years. One of the things in common... you'll find yourself near the tail end of a session, you'll be counting up your solid 80bb win, and you'll glance over at the quiet non descript lag, and you'll see he's sitting on 250bbs, and you think to yourself, "what pots did that guy win? I don't even remember him going to showdown in any big hands?"

That's because they pick up tons of small pots. Tons. And they don't go to showdown as often as tags. Sure, they still get to showdown at a decent clip. That's because people don't fold in live poker.

Alot of people think lag means loose aggressive. Ok well it does. But alot of people think aggressive means spew.

Those euro kids 5betting K5dd. They spew. That guy who normally plays 10/20 PLO who x/jams flop with air, he spews. They have huge ups and downs and very well may be winning players (probably not), but they aren't good lags. You'll see these guys sitting on 1 trillion bbs and think wow what a lag! Nope, they are spewing with variance temporarily on their side.

That quiet asian kid sipping hot tea that you can't recall a single showdown hand of his yet he's up 1.5 buy ins? The one who overcalls btn 4 ways with 57dd? Who when checked to him on J34d bets 60% pot and takes it down? That is the real lag. Like I said, I've probably only seen 3.
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:28 PM   #17978
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Real BR/game selection question. I'd like to minimize my risk of ruin.

I have $3k to play. After that I get $100 per month allowance. I would really like to avoid busting the $3k and ending up on $100/mo for poker, so let's just assume $3k is my whole roll and if I bust it I quit poker, even though that's not quite true.

My game choices are 1/3 with 60-200 BI, 3/5 with 200-500 BI, 5/5 PLO with 300-1000 BI.

Let's say I beat the field by about the same amount in nlhe and PLO if playing about 100-200 BB. I've played a fair amount of 5/5 PLO but none of that was short stacking. I am not so confident in my SS (BI 300) PLO game, but I could confidently SS nlhe. Should I:
(1) SS 1/3, BI 60.
(2) 1/3, BI 200.
(3) SS 3/5, BI 200.
(4) 3/5, BI 500.
(5) SS 5/5, BI 300 (would involve boning up my PLO SS game just to build my roll).
(6) 5/5, BI 1000.

Thanks.

Last edited by pokerodox; 02-03-2017 at 07:47 PM.
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:38 PM   #17979
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

(1.5) Play $1/3 with a 100-150BB BI
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:41 PM   #17980
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

(Z) play 1/2
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:49 PM   #17981
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Thinking more about it, I believe my lowest RoR is SS 1/3. Gives me the most BI's. I wonder if my ego is getting in the way of doing that. Or is the rake a real concern when playing with $60 stack?
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:50 PM   #17982
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiltyjoker View Post
(Z) play 1/2
winner

realistically you are not even sufficiently rolled for 1/2
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:50 PM   #17983
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Angrist View Post
(1.5) Play $1/3 with a 100-150BB BI
The BI numbers are $, not BB, so the most I can BI at 1/3 is 200, or 67BB.
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:51 PM   #17984
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True, not rolled but gonna play anyway. So what should I play? There is no 1/2. So I guess your answer would be 1/3. Next, should I SS or Fullstack?
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:52 PM   #17985
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If you are looking for lowest RoR, then I guess short stacking 1/3. But RoR should be pretty low in a 200 max 1/3 game with 15 buy-ins if you are a solid winner in the game. People are going to tell you that a 15 buy-in downswing will happen at some point, even if you are a crusher, and they may be right, but the chances that it happens to you at the very start are pretty low.

I would take option 2. Gives you the best opportunity to build your bankroll while offering low Risk of Ruin.
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:53 PM   #17986
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i'm not a fan of short stacking. if 1/3 is the lowest game i would tighten up your game and play 100 BB's. try to book a couple wins playing a value oriented ABC game to give your roll a cushion
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Old 02-03-2017, 08:38 PM   #17987
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Wtf do you expect to accomplish with $60 at a 1/3 game?

If you have a far amount of experience playing higher limits, you should know if you can beat the game. If you can beat the game buy in full to 1/3 or 3/5 (tho 67bb max bi @ 1/3 is turrrible). You're gonna have to nit it up regardless of what you do, might as well get max value
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Old 02-03-2017, 11:35 PM   #17988
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerodox View Post
Real BR/game selection question. I'd like to minimize my risk of ruin.

I have $3k to play. After that I get $100 per month allowance. I would really like to avoid busting the $3k and ending up on $100/mo for poker, so let's just assume $3k is my whole roll and if I bust it I quit poker, even though that's not quite true.

My game choices are 1/3 with 60-200 BI, 3/5 with 200-500 BI, 5/5 PLO with 300-1000 BI.

Let's say I beat the field by about the same amount in nlhe and PLO if playing about 100-200 BB. I've played a fair amount of 5/5 PLO but none of that was short stacking. I am not so confident in my SS (BI 300) PLO game, but I could confidently SS nlhe. Should I:
(1) SS 1/3, BI 60.
(2) 1/3, BI 200.
(3) SS 3/5, BI 200.
(4) 3/5, BI 500.
(5) SS 5/5, BI 300 (would involve boning up my PLO SS game just to build my roll).
(6) 5/5, BI 1000.

Thanks.

Grunch. Just play the 1/3 until you get to 5k, move back down if BR drops below 4k.

Sure, being forced to buy-in shallow sucks, but it actually gives you some more cushion. Plus, As long as you can table-select you'll be able to select deeper stacked 1/3 games.

And stay away from the PLO unless you want to go busto. Don't care if you're a monster. That's simply not enough wiggle room imo.
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Old 02-04-2017, 01:20 AM   #17989
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A good short-stack strategy is 1) very boring and 2) pretty high variance. Play 1/3 and buy in full.
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Old 02-04-2017, 02:43 AM   #17990
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Originally Posted by Garick View Post
A good short-stack strategy is 1) very boring and 2) pretty high variance. Play 1/3 and buy in full.
max for dude's 1/3 game is 200.
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Old 02-04-2017, 02:45 AM   #17991
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Correct short stack strat is actually pretty high variance as it has you shoving like ATs or mid pairs in a ton of spots.

If you want to short stack and play tight people will always pay you off -- but if you're ganna play tight you're better off buying in full tho. That being said, if you have a massive RoR then maybe shortstack/tight isnt the worst option, it's actually how I built my roll the first few months.
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Old 02-04-2017, 06:11 AM   #17992
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I'm cool with $200. You should be able to avoid the swings unless you get unlucky.
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Old 02-04-2017, 12:53 PM   #17993
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerodox View Post
Real BR/game selection question. I'd like to minimize my risk of ruin.

I have $3k to play. After that I get $100 per month allowance. I would really like to avoid busting the $3k and ending up on $100/mo for poker, so let's just assume $3k is my whole roll and if I bust it I quit poker, even though that's not quite true.

My game choices are 1/3 with 60-200 BI, 3/5 with 200-500 BI, 5/5 PLO with 300-1000 BI.

Let's say I beat the field by about the same amount in nlhe and PLO if playing about 100-200 BB. I've played a fair amount of 5/5 PLO but none of that was short stacking. I am not so confident in my SS (BI 300) PLO game, but I could confidently SS nlhe. Should I:
(1) SS 1/3, BI 60.
(2) 1/3, BI 200.
(3) SS 3/5, BI 200.
(4) 3/5, BI 500.
(5) SS 5/5, BI 300 (would involve boning up my PLO SS game just to build my roll).
(6) 5/5, BI 1000.

Thanks.
Play 1/3,

With $200 cap. Strat is fairly straight forward until you get deep with someone.

Raise your premium hands, likely going 4-5 ways into bloated pots. Check/fold when you miss. Value bet and stack off when you hit top pair.

AK, AQ, AJ, KQ, are printing money in that structure.

Set mining 22-66 is losing money. So keep your range Ace heavey and mid pocket pairs. And should be no problem to quickly move up.

Suited connectors are useless so shallow, but everyone is awsome so they will still play them. If you don't. Then there is your built in edge.

F w.i.w

It is boring poker!!!!!

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
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Old 02-04-2017, 01:06 PM   #17994
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Originally Posted by gobbledygeek View Post
Amen to that. Two sessions ago I made 3 (THREE!) terrible postflop decisions in THE SAME HAND (I mean, lol, I'm too embarrassed to even give a HH). It cost me dearly, and was the difference between a good session and a poor one. It's tough to be a consistent winner if you are constantly blowing one big hand per session, and you have to be honest with yourself about it (i.e. even if you aced every other decision for the session, these big lone mistakes will sink you).

GcluelesspoordecisionnoobG
This resonates with everyone! I feel like my first mistake in a hand often leads to justification for the second and third mistakes.
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Old 02-04-2017, 01:10 PM   #17995
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max for dude's 1/3 game is 200.
Yes, "full" is a bit short, but you can play a pretty standard strategy with 66.67BBs effective.
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Old 02-04-2017, 01:23 PM   #17996
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I want to bring up the idea of shot taking. I've had a solid month of January, my first month with a win rate north of 10 big blinds/hour at $2/$5 over 150 hours. My winrate typically hovers in the 5-7 bb/hour range, so maybe I'm running good or maybe I'm playing better or maybe some of both. I've considered sitting in the $5/$10 game a few times when I've run up a stack to the 500-600 bb range at 2/5. Specifically there are a few players worth targeting in the $5/$10 game based on how they've played in the 2/5 game. I wouldn't be rolled adequately but it would seem like taking an occasional shot could be a good thing. Anyone think this way or have any experience (good or bad) with taking a shot at a bigger game?

Last edited by soxfan43; 02-04-2017 at 01:25 PM. Reason: Typo
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Old 02-04-2017, 02:37 PM   #17997
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What's your BR? How will you respond emotionally if you lose a couple grand in one hand? Nothing wrong with shot taking if you can handle the shot failing.
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Old 02-04-2017, 02:46 PM   #17998
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What's your BR? How will you respond emotionally if you lose a couple grand in one hand? Nothing wrong with shot taking if you can handle the shot failing.
Great questions! I'm a professional in something other than poker, so there's always money beyond my designated bankroll. You could say that I am a serious rec player with more experience than most recent players. That said, I currently have about $12k in my poker-dedicated BR. I'm basically dead from an emotional perspective, so I don't think I'd play bad if I got stuck haha. I would just go back to my normal game. There is also something that feels different about taking pure winnings from a day to play a higher game. I know it is the exact same thing, but ending up back where I started the day doesn't seem as bad as starting the day in the higher game and getting stuck. Both times I've put my name on the list the game didn't run or a seat didn't open up.
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Old 02-04-2017, 03:22 PM   #17999
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The same day thing is only true if you have 0 tilt which is basically no one. I think it's a smart way to proactively prevent tilt.
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Old 02-04-2017, 03:24 PM   #18000
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Originally Posted by johnnyBuz View Post
i'm not a fan of short stacking. if 1/3 is the lowest game i would tighten up your game and play 100 BB's. try to book a couple wins playing a value oriented ABC game to give your roll a cushion
This is what I did in January. It was pretty boring, but low stress, easier decisions, and has worked out. I feel like I have some breathing room now
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