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Old 06-20-2016, 05:48 PM   #15376
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I used to prepay the whole month ahead.


A friend of mine in London who plays for a living actually negotiates a small discount with his landlord and then pays rent 6 months ahead.

He has been playing full time for years and is very obviously rolled for his games, so doing this doesn't impact his roll at all but he still likes the security of knowing he has this sorted in advance to manage his mentality through lean streaks. Ironically, this habit started because his landlord was worried about his ability to pay knowing he was a 'gambler' but he has ended up instilling a practice he now really believes he benefits from
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Old 06-20-2016, 06:07 PM   #15377
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A friend of mine in London who plays for a living actually negotiates a small discount with his landlord and then pays rent 6 months ahead.

He has been playing full time for years and is very obviously rolled for his games, so doing this doesn't impact his roll at all but he still likes the security of knowing he has this sorted in advance to manage his mentality through lean streaks. Ironically, this habit started because his landlord was worried about his ability to pay knowing he was a 'gambler' but he has ended up instilling a practice he now really believes he benefits from
GREAT spot!

wish the note holder on my house would let me do this!
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Old 06-20-2016, 06:16 PM   #15378
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I don't know why buying the car would take forever. You could weekend warrior for two years at 2/5 and have your 50k.

I think from your posts though that you lack the discipline for this. Stuck to the pits for the fun of it as long as you aren't losing control of your life.
If he just stayed away from the pits for two years he could probably buy the car from all the money he saved
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Old 06-20-2016, 10:43 PM   #15379
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How does this work, are you taking a weighted average by time?
18hr at 1/3 , 30hr at 2/5, 60hr at 5/T.
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Old 06-20-2016, 11:05 PM   #15380
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To Avarita and Happy Luck Box,

Are these numbers that you are quoting based off peak hours like Friday/Saturday nights? Or do you believe these hours would be sustainable during non peak hours? Say someone played every night except Monday-Tuesday. Do you think they could still attain 10bb/hr at 2/5, or 12bb/hr at 1/3?
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Old 06-20-2016, 11:13 PM   #15381
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To birdsalla - I personally know for a fact that 10+bb per hour can be attained during non peak hours at 2/5
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Old 06-20-2016, 11:21 PM   #15382
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To birdsalla - I personally know for a fact that 10+bb per hour can be attained during non peak hours at 2/5
By about 1-2% of the poker playing population. If hes asking, he probably cant do it.
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Old 06-20-2016, 11:56 PM   #15383
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Mike, did it ever occur to you that some people don't live under circumstances where they could even attempt to play full time/high volume hours at non peak times? I also think you're the last person who should be saying who can and cannot attain certain winrates, considering you've posted some questionable strategy to say the least.

Thanks for the response Squid. I've grown curious about this, because of some online statistics I've seen recently: that the only hands you'll make 100bb/100 hands with are AA-QQ. A live winrate of 10bb/hr is approximately 30bb/100 hands. Assuming a pretty high full-ring VPIP (20%) you'll play 6 hands an hour. That means you have to make an average of 500bb/100 hands for each hand you play.

I'm not calling anyone a liar over their winrates. I myself have had good numbers over 1000 hours of play at peak times at my local casino and during extended trips to Vegas. However, after seeing this math, it's really difficult for me to wrap my head around how, statistically, these winrates are possible.

I know that live players are worst than online players, but wow those are some staggering numbers. I would be interested if MPethy had any input on this. I remember reading posts in the past where he had tracked his performance in the blinds and compared it to online, finding that he was actually a winner in the blinds in live poker. Such a feat would be impossible at all but perhaps the microstakes online.

Last edited by BirdsallSa; 06-21-2016 at 12:01 AM.
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:05 AM   #15384
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Mike, did it ever occur to you that some people don't live under circumstances where they could even attempt to play full time/high volume hours at non peak times? I also think you're the last person who should be saying who can and cannot attain certain winrates, considering you've posted some questionable strategy to say the least.

Thanks for the response Squid. I've grown curious about this, because of some online statistics I've seen recently: that the only hands you'll make 100bb/100 hands with are AA-QQ. A live winrate of 10bb/hr is approximately 30bb/100 hands. Assuming a pretty high full-ring VPIP (20%) you'll play 6 hands an hour. That means you have to make an average of 500bb/100 hands for each hand you play.

I'm not calling anyone a liar over their winrates. I myself have had good numbers over 1000 hours of play at peak times at my local casino and during extended trips to Vegas. However, after seeing this math, it's really difficult for me to wrap my head around how, statistically, these winrates are possible.
Of course most people cant play at non peak times. Most people have a real job. All I said was that almost nobody can make 10BB/hr unless they are playing evenings and weekends and even then I doubt more than 4-5% of all players can do it. I estimate that 85-90% of all players lose. How many do you really think are winning 10BB/hr or more?

As to the second part of your statement, I consider it a badge of honor when people here say that my strategy is questionable because most people here suck at poker. Just like most poker players suck in real life. Im not saying you suck. Im saying most posters suck.

I know what my win rate is and I know that very few people have that high a win rate, so when these same people with lower win rates than mine tell me my strategy is questionable, that's all I need to know. A lot of terrible players here just dont understand the lines I take and I really dont give 2 ****s what they think. Some good players here question some of my lines also and I pay a lot of attention to their advice, but there's more than one way to skin a cat.

Last edited by MikeStarr; 06-21-2016 at 12:12 AM.
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:26 AM   #15385
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MikeStarr, TBH, only thing you got going for you is your claimed WR and you pretty much use that to justify every one of your positions.
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:29 AM   #15386
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I still have 13 BI.


Winrate since returning is $58/hr at 1/2.


Approx. $232/100 or 116bb/100.

Assuming slightly smaller WR at higher stakes so like $150/hr at 5/T.
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Old 06-21-2016, 03:35 AM   #15387
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I got AA aipf vs KK for 250bbs preflop and he spiked an King
How will that affect my 100hr sample? For example usually I win a

Last edited by VolumeKing; 06-21-2016 at 03:46 AM.
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Old 06-21-2016, 08:08 AM   #15388
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Of course you are going to be confused comparing winrates between online poker and live poker given that they are completely different games played completely different ways. You called a 20% VPIP high, but in live poker they'll probably call you a nit if you only play 6 hands an hour. In live poker the opens are much bigger as well which makes the game play larger as well, particularly with more flops going multiway.

I know for a fact that 15bbs+/hr is attainable in the softer live markets. There are players in this thread that have made 10bbs/hr in the toughest live low stakes games in the country.
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Old 06-21-2016, 09:06 AM   #15389
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BirdsallSa View Post
To Avarita and Happy Luck Box,

Are these numbers that you are quoting based off peak hours like Friday/Saturday nights? Or do you believe these hours would be sustainable during non peak hours? Say someone played every night except Monday-Tuesday. Do you think they could still attain 10bb/hr at 2/5, or 12bb/hr at 1/3?
This might belong in the pro poker thread but the lack of games during non peak hours was a top 3 surprise for me when I took a year to play poker. I ended up playing a similar volume that I was playing when employed, which is one of a number of reasons I returned to work.

As for actual WR, Im guessing my Saturday night WR is close to my Monday afternoon WR. I can look but I doubt I have the sample for results to matter.

Even if that is true, however, the peak games are still where you want to put your time in, and this is best done as part time...with full time cash flow as your main source of liquidity.
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Old 06-21-2016, 09:14 AM   #15390
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MikeStarr, TBH, only thing you got going for you is your claimed WR and you pretty much use that to justify every one of your positions.
I honestly dont know how or why I got off on the wrong foot with people here. I guess I come off as a jerk online but I dont have that problem in real life. Ive met several people from 2+2 in real life and we are now friends. I have several good friends that are top players in my main poker room. We all discuss tough hands by texts during the day and I can guarantee you that my game is well respected. I'll go out on a limb and say that I am in the top 3 winners in my game and its a very big room.

I just happen to have a semi non ABC approach to the game and people here just dont want to embrace it. I play alot more read based poker than math based poker than most people. When my friends and I discuss a hand, I normally ask who the villain was before answering. If its a reg, the advice will often change dramatically based on who it was.

I probably fold the best hand more than anyone else I know. I check TPTK or an overpair more than most people I know. I check raise all in more than most people I know.

Ive been playing for a lot longer than the majority of posters here so Ive strayed from basic strategy. It works for me. Thats all that matters. I used to play very basic ABC and nitty and I won playing like that as I started playing more and more regularly I started adding in a lot more "strange" lines. Since Ive started mixing it up a bit my win rate has soared. What doesnt matter is whether or not anyone else likes my lines or even whether they believe I win or not.

PS...actual success is a pretty good judge of whether something works or not in real life. Anything else is just theory
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Old 06-21-2016, 09:30 AM   #15391
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A friend of mine in London who plays for a living actually negotiates a small discount with his landlord and then pays rent 6 months ahead.

He has been playing full time for years and is very obviously rolled for his games, so doing this doesn't impact his roll at all but he still likes the security of knowing he has this sorted in advance to manage his mentality through lean streaks. Ironically, this habit started because his landlord was worried about his ability to pay knowing he was a 'gambler' but he has ended up instilling a practice he now really believes he benefits from
+1

As a landlord, I look favorably upon tenants who have (what I consider to be good) habits like this. I am willing to cut tenants lots of slack if I feel like I'm not being jerked around.

Although, no too long ago, one particularly good tenant wanted to prepay a few months. I said sure, but let me ask you a personal question first -- do you have an emergency fund, and how large is it? We talked about it a bit and I suggested that instead of paying me first, he could take that $$$ and put it into the emergency fund to pad it a bit.

~~~~

As for myself, all my utility bills have positive balances.

E.g. my electric bill has a credit equivalent to 4 months of charges.

This is in addition to my personal emergency fund.
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Old 06-21-2016, 09:47 AM   #15392
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GREAT spot!

wish the note holder on my house would let me do this!
They will. You just have to get creative.

1) You can probably pay your mortgage bi-weekly (or even weekly). Because of the amount of principle involved, you save a massive amount on interest. You can turn a 30 year mortgage into a 25 year mortgage in this way.

Bi-weekly Mortgage Calculator.

2) You can setup a separate online checking account with automatic bill pay and just keep pouring $$$ into the account as possible. In this way, you need not even really think about the check writing.
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Old 06-21-2016, 09:50 AM   #15393
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GREAT spot!

wish the note holder on my house would let me do this!
If you don't escrow your taxes and insurance then you can make a yearly lump sum payment for each which is nice for a full time poker player.
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Old 06-21-2016, 09:56 AM   #15394
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They will. You just have to get creative.

1) You can probably pay your mortgage bi-weekly (or even weekly). Because of the amount of principle involved, you save a massive amount on interest. You can turn a 30 year mortgage into a 25 year mortgage in this way.

Bi-weekly Mortgage Calculator.

2) You can setup a separate online checking account with automatic bill pay and just keep pouring $$$ into the account as possible. In this way, you need not even really think about the check writing.
He doesn't want to pay it bi-weekly or weekly though. He wants the opposite. He wants to make payments every 6 months and receive a discount for doing so. My understanding is that you will not save on interest by doing this with most mortgages. You would need a simple interest mortgage that allows you to make payments well ahead of time.
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Old 06-21-2016, 10:00 AM   #15395
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He doesn't want to pay it bi-weekly or weekly though. He wants the opposite. He wants to make payments every 6 months and receive a discount for doing so. My understanding is that you will not save on interest by doing this with most mortgages. You would need a simple interest mortgage that allows you to make payments well ahead of time.
He will save interest if he specifies that he wants the advances payments to go specifically towards principal.
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Old 06-21-2016, 10:02 AM   #15396
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He will save interest if he specifies that he wants the advances payments to go specifically towards principal.
That wouldn't constitute a monthly payment. He would still have to make monthly payments which is exactly what he doesn't want to do.
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Old 06-21-2016, 10:11 AM   #15397
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That wouldn't constitute a monthly payment. He would still have to make monthly payments which is exactly what he doesn't want to do.
Hmmm, you're right. I guess we need to know what hes trying to accomplish other than flat out save money. Saving money and cash flow issues are 2 different things.

The guy paying 6 months rent in advance to save money still has to take the rent money out of his bankroll every month and put it in savings. Otherwise at the end of the 6 months he will have no money to pay the next 6 months.

Last edited by MikeStarr; 06-21-2016 at 10:17 AM.
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Old 06-21-2016, 10:24 AM   #15398
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He doesn't want to pay it bi-weekly or weekly though. He wants the opposite. He wants to make payments every 6 months and receive a discount for doing so. My understanding is that you will not save on interest by doing this with most mortgages. You would need a simple interest mortgage that allows you to make payments well ahead of time.
See step #2...
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Old 06-21-2016, 10:33 AM   #15399
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He needs to save the money for sure but he doesn't have to do it on a monthly basis and thus short term fluctuations are not going to affect him as much as someone that has to pay rent every single month. Also, an added benefit of paying upfront is that if he does experience a short term fluctuation, it doesn't affect his ability to pay rent because he can still just make a normal monthly payment rather than paying the entire 6 months.

This is perhaps an extreme case, but when I was first playing I had $12k+ in property taxes to pay every year. If that was escrowed I'd be paying $1k a month in property tax a month. However, since mine wasn't escrowed I paid it in one lump sump, after the year in question. For instance, 2016 taxes would be due on January 31st 2017 but I could pay them as early as November 2016. So for like 7 months of the year, February through August I didn't really have to worry about property taxes at all because really if I can't come up with $12k in 5 months playing 2/5+ then I should probably just quit poker.

If I ran real good in October then I could just go ahead and pay my taxes off in November. If not, I'd still have a few months to come up with the money. Paying off early is not the ideal decision financially but may make sense for piece of mind (and for over-spenders).

Last edited by Dream Crusher; 06-21-2016 at 10:41 AM.
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Old 06-21-2016, 10:37 AM   #15400
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$12K in property taxes? Jeez!
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