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Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Winrates, bankrolls, and finances
View Poll Results: What is your Win Rate in terms of BB per Housr
Less than 0 (losing)
5 6.41%
0-2.5
0 0%
2.5-5
6 7.69%
5-7.5
8 10.26%
7.5-10
15 19.23%
10+
26 33.33%
Not enough sample size/I don't know
18 23.08%

02-13-2016 , 06:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by suited fours
speaking of not knowing what GTO means...

not sure if intentional or accidental but this is hilarious
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 07:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapzbrah
Hello everyone!

I think I've posted in here before, but I'm back. I'm going to venture into the live poker scene soon here in the states. I've built up a $4k roll from a $200 deposit on Bovada exclusively for the 1/2 game. I'm ~5-6bb/100 winner at 100nl 6max.

My question is: how should I adjust my game for the live games? I've played live a few times and the players are just so bad. But it's been a few years.
Iso limpers wider in co and btn, C-bet more frequently in hu pots, bet the turn more frequently for protection and thin value, and call much tighter when someone makes a big bet unless you have good reason to believe they don't have it.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 07:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowball2
In terms of big blinds an hour.. obviously
Ok but this whole time we've been arguing about which game has the higher $/hr. Who cares about big blinds/hr. I don't pay the bills in big blinds I pay them with $.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 08:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Parker
I disagree.

Have you ever watched a LLSNL donkament? Players routinely limp/fold 20% of their stacks and passively bleed away their stacks.

That's how LLSNL players adjust to straddle when the effective stacks are halved. If anything, the edge becomes greater against bunch of players who cannot adjust to a 50bb game.
Nobody said live players play perfectly when effective stacks are short. But our edge is significantly larger when we have 100+bb stacks and can get three streets of value or pull off a big river bluff as opposed to getting them to limp/fold with 15bb.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 08:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daniel9861
Ok but this whole time we've been arguing about which game has the higher $/hr. Who cares about big blinds/hr. I don't pay the bills in big blinds I pay them with $.
I know the maths aren't for everyone but it's not like she's asking you to convert miles per hour into rods per hogshead.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 08:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Parker

Obviously at 2bb, there isn't any decision, and maybe that's why "good" players such as yourself stay away from any games less than 100bb, because maybe they all see them as 2bb game.

Hence I said earlier, good players don't play short games because they turn into calling station, the only way they know how to play short stacks.

Even at 50bb, LLSNL players don't adjust by doubling their bet or calling bigger pots with the same range, and that's where our edge is. If you don't get that, I can't dumb it down any further.
Lol, nice passive aggressive use of quotes around "good", but that doesn't make up for your bad logic and inaccurate perceptions. No, it's because no one in their right mind is going to sit in a 50bb game when they can sit in a 200bb game. An action player doesn't sit in a short game, so why should a pro?

What makes you think a good player turns into a calling station in short games? Shouldn't the ability to adjust be part of what makes someone a good player, so by definition they aren't good players if they turn into calling stations? That paragraph is really irrelevant other than to serve your purpose of mocking people who delusionally believe that they are "good".

People call off too light, or too much of their stack when they are shallow, which is a mistake, obviously. A lot of spots becomes close, and you are forced to call off in spots that you aren't happy about. I wouldn't call it the biggest edge, but an edge is an edge.

Last edited by Snowball2; 02-13-2016 at 08:45 PM.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 08:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Sandbag
Nobody said live players play perfectly when effective stacks are short. But our edge is significantly larger when we have 100+bb stacks and can get three streets of value or pull off a big river bluff as opposed to getting them to limp/fold with 15bb.

And our edge is even bigger when our opponents are playing blind...

So how does your obvious point have anything to do with the discussion in hand?
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 08:34 PM
Someone said we lose a lot of our edge when effective stacks are reduced. You said you disagree. I stated why we do in fact lose a lot of our edge.

If it's such an obvious point, why did you disagree with it in the first place?
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 08:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kebabkungen
I know what it means very well ty. a 2bb game is easily GTO solvable.
This tells me you don't. You may know the definition but you don't know what it means.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 08:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daniel9861
Ok but this whole time we've been arguing about which game has the higher $/hr. Who cares about big blinds/hr. I don't pay the bills in big blinds I pay them with $.
I made my point in direct response to what you said about win rate in big blinds increases proportionally to increase in big blinds - ie., "double the blinds, double your win rate in money because your win rate in bbs stay constant".

I'm saying your win rate in bb doesn't stay constant, because it's limited by the effective stack sizes (ie. there are less bbs to be won)

To be fair, I think your win rate in $$ probably increases somewhat just because the pot sizes are bigger/more blinds to steal, but you definitely arent going to see a proportional increase. It's hard to say how much it increases though, and it may not increase at all. Really depends on the game. Much higher variance too playing short stack, so depends if you prefer making a little more with way more variance, or the other way.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 08:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny_on_the_spot
speaking of not knowing what GTO means...

not sure if intentional or accidental but this is hilarious
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 09:01 PM
Bad players with 100bb stack might lose 10bb an hr. What about with a 200bb stack, will the bad player lose more money or less money per hour?

Spoiler:
Snowball preaching sound strat and llsnl beating him up with their opinions
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowball2
Lol, nice passive aggressive use of quotes around "good", but that doesn't make up for your bad logic and inaccurate perceptions.
Easy now. FWIW, I quoted "good" long before you chimed in and "dumb" things down for me.

I don't get these insults from you...it's ok to be wrong, you know?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowball2
No, it's because no one in their right mind is going to sit in a 50bb game when they can sit in a 200bb game. An action player doesn't sit in a short game, so why should a pro?
Correct, but what are we talking about now?

Is the discussion which games are better, 50bb, 100bb, 200bb, or is it:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowball2
One fact that people can never admit or realize is that mandatory straddle makes a game that's already bad, worse.

If the game's tight and people are already hesitant to put money in, how would it make the game better if they suddenly had to put in twice as much money?
This whole time, I thought we are still talking about how the game is better when people suddenly have to put in twice as much money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowball2
What makes you think a good player turns into a calling station in short games? Shouldn't the ability to adjust be part of what makes someone a good player, so by definition they aren't good players if they turn into calling stations?
The same rationale why you keep on saying that doubling the blind is bad...

Does that mean you don't know how to adjust?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowball2
That paragraph is really irrelevant other than to serve your purpose of mocking people who delusionally believe that they are "good".
Nope, I said "good" many times before.

I don't know why you're so aggressive all of sudden.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowball2
People call off too light, or too much of their stack when they are shallow, which is a mistake, obviously.
Is this your way of agreeing? I guess I'll take it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowball2
A lot of spots becomes close, and you are forced to call off in spots that you aren't happy about. I wouldn't call it the biggest edge, but an edge is an edge.
Close to some, not so close to others.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 09:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Sandbag
Someone said we lose a lot of our edge when effective stacks are reduced. You said you disagree. I stated why we do in fact lose a lot of our edge.

If it's such an obvious point, why did you disagree with it in the first place?
If you don't want to follow the discussion, you don't have to, but please don't stir up non-sense because you don't want to put in the time to read prior discussion.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 11:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spikeraw22
This tells me you don't. You may know the definition but you don't know what it means.
I do know what it means, not sure why you think otherwise.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 11:33 PM
Richard, Im not sure what games you are playing in, but if the players dont understand that a mandatory straddle makes the games play shallower, then congrats, great game. In most games, a straddle makes players play tighter because they have to put in more money pre flop.

Tighter range pre-flop = less post flop mistakes. Most fish are exponentially worse the deeper the game plays and they play a lot worse post flop than pre flop. A straddle makes the game play shallower, and it makes post flop decisions more trivial and thus easier for fish.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 11:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kebabkungen
Richard, Im not sure what games you are playing in, but if the players dont understand that a mandatory straddle makes the games play shallower, then congrats, great game. In most games, a straddle makes players play tighter because they have to put in more money pre flop.
And I said that it's a good thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kebabkungen
Tighter range pre-flop = less post flop mistakes. Most fish are exponentially worse the deeper the game plays and they play a lot worse post flop than pre flop. A straddle makes the game play shallower, and it makes post flop decisions more trivial and thus easier for fish.

Is it really that hard to follow the context of the argument?

If people are folding like crazy and playing super tight, all things equal, doubling the blinds make it more profitable because you get to steal for more money...
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-13-2016 , 11:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapzbrah
Hello everyone!

I think I've posted in here before, but I'm back. I'm going to venture into the live poker scene soon here in the states. I've built up a $4k roll from a $200 deposit on Bovada exclusively for the 1/2 game. I'm ~5-6bb/100 winner at 100nl 6max.

My question is: how should I adjust my game for the live games? I've played live a few times and the players are just so bad. But it's been a few years.
Read these two threads and print mobnies. The F do.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-14-2016 , 12:28 AM
''Are you sure you want to add Richard Parker to your ignore list? ''

YES
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-14-2016 , 12:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kebabkungen
Playing a style that is unexploitable. Tbh I'm not sure such a game is be GTO solvable, but isn't short stack tourney play up to like at least 20bb solved?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kebabkungen
I do know what it means, not sure why you think otherwise.
Because the first statement is not actually a thing.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-14-2016 , 12:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kookiemonster
''Are you sure you want to add Richard Parker to your ignore list? ''



YES

:-). Appreciate the support.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-14-2016 , 07:09 AM
here's a little chip porn to get things back on track. ran very poorly at 2/5 in february so i used my "i'm due for a heater of a session" at 10/10. did not disappoint.

cashed out ~6800 (bought in for 1k). have a couple of hands to post in mid-high stakes.

Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-14-2016 , 08:02 AM
nice hit JB!
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-14-2016 , 08:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyBuz
here's a little chip porn to get things back on track. ran very poorly at 2/5 in february so i used my "i'm due for a heater of a session" at 10/10. did not disappoint.

cashed out ~6800 (bought in for 1k). have a couple of hands to post in mid-high stakes.

nice hit.

i like that you use the 'running bad, so it's time to move up' logic.
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote
02-14-2016 , 08:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibelieveyouoweme$80k
nice hit.

i like that you use the 'running bad, so it's time to move up' logic.
it was clearly his time to hit.

its like when you bet $20 on roulette and lose 4 times in a row you now its time to now put down a $1000 bet. its almost a sure thing
Winrates, bankrolls, and finances Quote

      
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