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Old 09-05-2013, 12:22 AM   #5626
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by dhcg86 View Post
yes you can make $50 an hr at 1/3
Really? That's like 50bb/100h or something. I know live winrates are effing massive, but is a WR that high sustainable?
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Old 09-07-2013, 05:30 PM   #5627
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Really? That's like 50bb/100h or something. I know live winrates are effing massive, but is a WR that high sustainable?
it is surely possible for some, but I wouldn't say its the norm. Expect half that.
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Old 09-09-2013, 04:35 AM   #5628
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Played a couple more times live since my first ti me a couple weeks ago, and man it is just nuts the types of people that sit down at the poker table. There are people that constantly buy in for 20/40$ at 1/2 and just give it away after a couple hands and then just repeat. People giving their stacks with mid pair, and calling off almost anything. After playing on dead usa sites that are just full of nit regs its really refreshing to see people happily give money away. Also got two outtered for the first time tonight when a guy bluff shoved a pair vs my two pair on turn and then hit a set on the river which was pretty sick which made a huge dent in my profits but wtver its poker. Live poker its a lot more fun too since most people are friendly and want to socialize
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Old 09-09-2013, 07:27 AM   #5629
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This may not be the best spot for this post, maybe goals and challenges, so sorry in advance if this is the wrong area. However the main question I'm posing is about live win rates, and for a lack of response I'm thinking this might be a better area.
Hi everyone!

Hello all!

I am still relatively new to posting threads, so I apologize in advance if it is all over the place and TL;DR. I've played poker for approx. 5 years now, but after BF I quit playing online/casino and just played recreationally with friends. Prior to BF I played micros online and didn't take it to seriously. Just enough to pay for cell bill, gas, entertainment expenses. etc... no actual responsibilities. In January of 2013 I turned 21 and for old times sake I went to a local casino to play. I bought in for $300 at 1/3 NL and ran into some positive variance. Playing again wiped off the rust from playing online and I quickly began obsessing over the game again. Since January I have been playing part-time to supplement my income from my permanent part-time job. So far I have accumulated 340 hours and ~11,220 hands(assuming roughly 33 hands an hour). With only the 300 dollar BI, I have slowly built my roll up to $7,758 (have also cashed out $336 over the past 3 months). Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe $/HR and BB(Big Blind)/100 is essentially the same # at these stakes assuming 33 hands an hour. So I am earning $22.92 hr as well as 22.92BB/100. Is a BB/100 like this sustainable in a Live Casino setting? I am used to online when I made about 3 BB/100 but I've heard much higher winrates are attainable.

Current Life Situation:
I am now renting a condo on a year lease and am soon to have my vehicle paid off. While still being in college I do not intend to work at my current job as a career. With that being said I very heavily have the itch to play poker as my sole source of income while finishing out college. I a have no kids and am not married. With my current job I bring in about $1200 a month and have maybe $200/mo left for savings/entertainment expenses.

Live Poker Pro Q's:
As mentioned earlier, does that winrate translate into a feasible expectation of something that could be attained in the long run? Also what other 'hidden' expenses are generally not accounted for while playing poker as your sole income; (i.e. Not having benefits such as health insurance).

My current goal:
To grind up to a $10,000 bankroll and ideally play poker throughout the rest of my college career, unless persuaded otherwise. Keep in mind I'm not leaving a career to play, however my current job is a decent one for a college student (regular raises, 401k, health benefits).

Thank you in advance! Any help is appreciated, especially from live players!
Answer is...... well.. It depends.

How good are you? What's the buy-in? How good are the games where you play? Do you table select(you better)? Change seats? Play nights and weekends?

From my experience:
I'm a 1-2x / week player with good job but enjoy the game. Decent online history. Since BF I put in about 500hrs /yr at 2-5NL mostly 500-600 max buy-in and a little bit of 5-5NL/5-10NL.

I play at Sands and Borgata mostly plus some other places. I feel the games are ridiculously soft at 2-5(don't even ask how bad they are at 1-2NL). It starts to get a little better at 5-5 and better still at 5-10 but not that much better just a lot more aggressive.

I still make a decent amount of mistakes and leave money on the table, but my game is pretty solid. I pretty much am printing money at 2-5 without too much variance. First 500hrs at $44/hr. 2nd 500hrs at $79/hr. Running above that since I passed 1000hrs.

So if you are any good and if you play in any decent market and with $300 buy-in at 1-3 you should be able to do $30/hr and maybe push $50/hr. If you are a superstar(probably not by your history) maybe $65.

Where do you play? How are the games? Lotta rec players?

As far as going pro. Forget it. Stay in college get a good job and play poker as an enjoyable and profitable hobby. That way it stays a game, not a job, and actually will remain fun. Don't become one of the many unhappy pro's who now hate the game which has become a miserable drudgery as a job. As a job, where you must win just to pay your bills which constantly eat away at your bankroll, poker sucks. No healthcare for you or your family, no guarantees, nothing. It's a hard and stressful way to try to survive and it gets harder every year.
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Old 09-10-2013, 05:50 AM   #5630
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

$30-$65 at 1/3......You've got to be kidding me with this range of numbers
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Old 09-10-2013, 07:48 AM   #5631
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Why? Seems reasonable to me.
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Old 09-10-2013, 09:55 AM   #5632
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Why? Seems reasonable to me.
I think $30+/hour is reasonable, especially if the 1/3 game plays deep.

as far as $65/hour goes, I think anyone good enough to crush deep 1/3 for $65/hour would just move up to 2/5.
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Old 09-10-2013, 01:06 PM   #5633
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I think $30+/hour is reasonable, especially if the 1/3 game plays deep.

as far as $65/hour goes, I think anyone good enough to crush deep 1/3 for $65/hour would just move up to 2/5.
Yeah, I was just giving a range of what's possible. There's quite a few 1-2NL guys making $20+/hr and 2-5 guys at $50+/hr. 1-3NL especially deep(200+ BB buyin) should be able to almost double 1-2 rate(keeping in mind you have to be good too- you don't just sit down and get handed $40/hr).

I also doubt there's any superstars staying at 1-3 to make $65/hr unless they just piss away their bankroll on ballin', bitches, pits, etc. Most guys that good should really be at 5-10 or 2-5 at the very least.
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Old 09-11-2013, 10:36 PM   #5634
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

35 buyin downswing and counting. Someone just please tell me that it will end at some point
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Old 09-11-2013, 11:21 PM   #5635
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35 buyin downswing and counting. Someone just please tell me that it will end at some point
That's pretty big. Assuming there's some spew in there.
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Old 09-11-2013, 11:29 PM   #5636
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Originally Posted by Gatsb View Post
35 buyin downswing and counting. Someone just please tell me that it will end at some point
What's your game? What's your BI?

Also, I can't help but notice that you have created zero threads asking for advice about hands. Why?
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Old 09-11-2013, 11:36 PM   #5637
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35 buyin downswing and counting. Someone just please tell me that it will end at some point
Sounds like terrible play rather than run bad. Its live poker lol. You could have made more than a few folds.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:01 AM   #5638
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Sounds like terrible play rather than run bad. Its live poker lol. You could have made more than a few folds.
Thanks ILCD, you the man....

As for others, it's 2/5 NL, 2/5/T PLO. A bit of spew in there, but overall just a brutal, never ending feeling of doom.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:10 AM   #5639
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Originally Posted by Larry Lido View Post
What's your game? What's your BI?

Also, I can't help but notice that you have created zero threads asking for advice about hands. Why?
I've posted a bit of HHs on Run it Once, but in general, I don't get all that much benefit from posting live hands as gameflow/game dynamics are so hard to describe and for others to comment on. I run hands through PPT Odds Oracle all the time, though.

I know most will view this as an easy excuse, but I'm just running beyond awful for the last few hundred hours of live play. This is my biggest ever downswing $ wise and I've played a million + hands online up to 2/4 (a ton of HU), where downswings/breakeven stretches can run into the 100k hands territory. I'm just defeated at the moment haha
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:13 AM   #5640
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

how deep are you buying in?
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:22 AM   #5641
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how deep are you buying in?
100bb unless I can buy in for 200bb. The 5/5 PLO (don't know why I wrote 2/5/T) plays more like 10/20 and I'd buy in for 400bb. Swingy game indeed
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:32 AM   #5642
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yeah like its hard to say "man huge swing" if you are buying in to a 2/5 PLO game for 100xbb and people are straddling to 5/5/T or it is a 2/5/T NLHE game and you are buying in for 2k and lose 6k and you are like "omfg 12xbi!"

I am also in the middle of a big downswing. Sucks bro.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:40 AM   #5643
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yeah like its hard to say "man huge swing" if you are buying in to a 2/5 PLO game for 100xbb and people are straddling to 5/5/T or it is a 2/5/T NLHE game and you are buying in for 2k and lose 6k and you are like "omfg 12xbi!"

I am also in the middle of a big downswing. Sucks bro.
Yea, like a significant chunk of the $ lit on fire has been due to plo, but I haven't been able to put any type of win streak together at NLH either. I'm seriously contemplating playing 1/2 for like 200 hours and reassessing everything.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:44 AM   #5644
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Ha, I'm playing 1/3 this weekend
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:47 AM   #5645
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I wouldn't recommend dropping down stakes in NLHE. Just cut out PLO entirely unless the lineup looks great.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:50 AM   #5646
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I wouldn't recommend dropping down stakes in NLHE. Just cut out PLO entirely unless the lineup looks great.
When you get stuck 35 buyins I'm sure he will take your advice to heart, I say do whatever you can to get your mind right.

Sometimes it feels good to book a win in a smaller game. You don't play to be miserable.
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Old 09-12-2013, 01:06 AM   #5647
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When you get stuck 35 buyins I'm sure he will take your advice to heart, I say do whatever you can to get your mind right.

Sometimes it feels good to book a win in a smaller game. You don't play to be miserable.
This is where I'm at right about now. Just pretty miserable and having that terrible feeling of entitlement when every drooler wins every pot against you. I need to freshen up on some Tommy Angelo vids I think.

I'd also just allocate more $ to my poker roll but I'm buying a house in the very near future. In all honesty, I'm going to be done with poker if I somehow lose like 2k at 1/2, at least until FTP refunds roll in.
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Old 09-12-2013, 02:06 AM   #5648
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taking a break might help you out
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Old 09-12-2013, 04:34 AM   #5649
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I'd also just allocate more $ to my poker roll but I'm buying a house in the very near future. In all honesty, I'm going to be done with poker if I somehow lose like 2k at 1/2, at least until FTP refunds roll in.
If you seriously come even close to losing 2k @ 1/2 then something is up with your game or mindset. Not sure what style you play, but perhaps nit it up for a while to reduce variance, at least until your confidence returns. It sucks man. I'm only just coming off a 1.5month breakeven stretch, while that's nothing compared to you obv I know my confidence was destroyed and it took a really good session for me to realise that nothing had changed, I was just running like ****. GL in the future man, keep your head up and keep making the good plays.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:31 AM   #5650
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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If you seriously come even close to losing 2k @ 1/2 then something is up with your game or mindset. Not sure what style you play, but perhaps nit it up for a while to reduce variance, at least until your confidence returns. It sucks man. I'm only just coming off a 1.5month breakeven stretch, while that's nothing compared to you obv I know my confidence was destroyed and it took a really good session for me to realise that nothing had changed, I was just running like ****. GL in the future man, keep your head up and keep making the good plays.
$2k at 1/2 is like 7 max buy-ins. I've lost 4 $300 buy-ins in one day before. It's not that hard to lose $2k in one stretch if you aren't nitting a sweater.
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