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Old 04-13-2013, 12:44 PM   #4726
fabianblom
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

I understand your point. Well there are more than 8 graphs with each their own style and you can use filters on your statistics like display only cashgames from location X. In the settings menu there's also an option to set the time to hours/minutes in stead of days/hours/minutes.
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Old 04-13-2013, 12:50 PM   #4727
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

always wondered why poker journal only measures by date and sessions in the graphs function, and not hours, which i would feel would be the most helpful?

am i missing something?
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Old 04-13-2013, 12:58 PM   #4728
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

My first 100 hours of playing Live Seriously.

Just took up Poker again after a long break after the whole Black Friday deal online. Worst part, was I was just starting to become a solid winning player, after years of study and hard work improving my game. I did play occasionally live for fun, but not seriously because the action was so slow, I didn't think I could make enough to make it worth my time. However, being able to see players and their tells, has certainly made me a much better live player than I was online. So, recently I decided that I needed a second job, and there are a ton of cardrooms close to my house, so I decided to give live cash games a try. Here are some pics of my results off of Poker Journal. I'm looking forward to building up my roll so I can move up in stakes.


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Old 04-13-2013, 01:01 PM   #4729
Richard Parker
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Hours is an arbitrary number, because you are not really tracking your progress per hour (unless you're literally updating the app every hour), but rather tracking sessions.

So let's say you have a session of 5 hours that ended in $-100, and another session of 5 hours that ended with $600. The logical way of displaying these two sessions with breakdown by hours would be to take the total win/loss and average out by hours, and in this case it would be $50/hr.

The graph would then show a linear line using the information, and as of such, it would be rather moot.
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Old 04-13-2013, 04:30 PM   #4730
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Parker View Post
Hours is an arbitrary number, because you are not really tracking your progress per hour (unless you're literally updating the app every hour), but rather tracking sessions.

So let's say you have a session of 5 hours that ended in $-100, and another session of 5 hours that ended with $600. The logical way of displaying these two sessions with breakdown by hours would be to take the total win/loss and average out by hours, and in this case it would be $50/hr.

The graph would then show a linear line using the information, and as of such, it would be rather moot.
What other units would we put live winnings in *other* than hours?

Such a graph would show a line from $0 to -$100 over 5 hours, at a downward slope of -$20/hr, then an upward line from -$100 to $500 at an upward slope of $120/hr over 5 more hours. So it'll have the overall win/loss from start to finish ($50/hr), as well as the individual session winrates (which are of value in and of themselves for diagnosing game selection problems).
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Old 04-13-2013, 04:40 PM   #4731
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I was referring directly to chart. Replacement of date and session by hours would simply be of the same thing, except the bottom would be hours, but each interval would still be the same as before.
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Old 04-14-2013, 04:24 AM   #4732
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Parker View Post
I was referring directly to chart. Replacement of date and session by hours would simply be of the same thing, except the bottom would be hours, but each interval would still be the same as before.
lol yup
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Old 04-14-2013, 05:14 AM   #4733
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Havok, Im in same boat you are. However I never specialized in cash online, so the transition is a bit harder for me as I have to plug in ton of leaks still. Good thing live games are so soft, while I keep learning. Im barely at 60 hours right now, but aim to get in 300 hours at 2/5, 5/5 to get SOME sort of an idea where im at. Would like to hit Vegas in June.
Btwn your pics are not showing up
gl in your live adventure

Last edited by DonkvFish; 04-14-2013 at 05:22 AM.
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Old 04-14-2013, 06:57 AM   #4734
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Had my biggest win ever tonight! Played genuine TAG. After winning a few big pots, used my image to steal a ton of pots postflop. Limped some very, very speculative hands on the button after 4 or 5 other limpers. The table was really passive preflop. I didn't limp to setmine--I raised my medium-small pocket pairs because people were giving me credit and I knew I had a good chance of taking the ones I missed uncontested (or getting a check down to see a free turn in addition to the flop).

The deck ran me over a little bit, as in people missed their draws against me--but then, I didn't let them see the river after they peeled one off on the turn, either.
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Old 04-14-2013, 08:38 AM   #4735
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonkvFish View Post
Havok, Im in same boat you are. However I never specialized in cash online, so the transition is a bit harder for me as I have to plug in ton of leaks still. Good thing live games are so soft, while I keep learning. Im barely at 60 hours right now, but aim to get in 300 hours at 2/5, 5/5 to get SOME sort of an idea where im at. Would like to hit Vegas in June.
Btwn your pics are not showing up
gl in your live adventure
Thanks,

Not sure why the pics aren't showing up but I've made $2,866 at 1/2 NL for an average of $35.92 hr in 80:20 hrs, and $1,044 at 1/3 for $60.98 hr, in 18.45 hrs. Online I was probably making around 10 or 12 BB hr average from Poker Tracker. So I'm curious to see what my win rate will be after 1,000 hrs when it will be more accurate. By then though I should be playing mostly 2/5 NL.

But, I must advocate you try to really plug your leaks before you move up in limits. It will be very costly for you if you don't. I probably have put in around a million hands online before I really started to take my game seriously enough to plug some leaks that were costing me money. You can easily over look small leaks when the competition is soft, but the games are tougher the higher you play.

Last edited by Havok; 04-14-2013 at 08:47 AM.
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Old 04-14-2013, 10:16 AM   #4736
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There is a delicate balance between moving up as quickly as possible and plugging leaks.

Basically, 1/2 NL and 1/3 NL players need to move up to 2/5 NL ASAP because the increased win-rate and lower rake is absolutely necessary if a poker player wants to "make a living wage." Just ad importantly, poker will keep stagnating, so the window of opportunity to "make some real money at 2/5 NL+" is closing.

On the other hand, poker players trying to move up to 2/5 NL may set thousands of dollars on fire if they don't fix their leaks quickly. To address this, aspiring grinders should set up an ambitious "study schedule" in addition to a 150 hours/month 2/5 NL playing schedule.
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Old 04-14-2013, 10:18 AM   #4737
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

And of course, only move up to playing 2/5 NL if you have 10k bankroll in addition to 6 months expenses saved.

Taking 2/5 NL shots 50% of the time can be done at $7500.bankroll as long as 6 months expensed have been saved.
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Old 04-14-2013, 11:39 AM   #4738
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Took my first 3 shots at playing 2-5. First session lost a $2k pot to a 2 outer when villain rivered top set. Next 2 sessions I cashed out $1600+ from my $500 buy in.

I now notice I play differently at 1-2, more marginal hands in bad spots, how do I get over this lack of giving a crap 1-2 until I have a true 2-5 roll.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:55 AM   #4739
ibelieveyouoweme$80k
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

If someone told you they won $16K in one month at $1/$2 would you believe them?
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:55 AM   #4740
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by Havok View Post
Thanks,

Not sure why the pics aren't showing up but I've made $2,866 at 1/2 NL for an average of $35.92 hr in 80:20 hrs, and $1,044 at 1/3 for $60.98 hr, in 18.45 hrs. Online I was probably making around 10 or 12 BB hr average from Poker Tracker. So I'm curious to see what my win rate will be after 1,000 hrs when it will be more accurate. By then though I should be playing mostly 2/5 NL.

But, I must advocate you try to really plug your leaks before you move up in limits. It will be very costly for you if you don't. I probably have put in around a million hands online before I really started to take my game seriously enough to plug some leaks that were costing me money. You can easily over look small leaks when the competition is soft, but the games are tougher the higher you play.
Nice, so far so good man.
Yea, I would have started at 1/2, but the buyin max was $40...the 5/5 game was $500..so I kinda just said ok screw it the first day, but been doing ok since then. Im barely getting over the nerves , not gonna lie, my first few days my heart was pounding so hard on certain spots/ face probably getting red etc....probably spelled out BLUFFING YOU on my forehead haha.
Much easier to run a big bluff online thats for sure. But, I guess like all things, the more you practice it, the easier it gets.

I have been lurking around here sooooo much and trying to absorb as much info as possible to try and get my thought process right/plug the basic leaks.
Probably studying around 2x more than my actual hours of play atm.
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Old 04-15-2013, 09:33 AM   #4741
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IbelieveinChipKelly View Post
If someone told you they won $16K in one month at $1/$2 would you believe them?
No.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:01 PM   #4742
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by IbelieveinChipKelly View Post
If someone told you they won $16K in one month at $1/$2 would you believe them?
only if they recently got laid off! that would be 10.5 hours every day of the month. Actually probably more, thats going off of grinding 1/3
or a included jackpot.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:33 PM   #4743
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Originally Posted by kdready View Post
only if they recently got laid off! that would be 10.5 hours every day of the month. Actually probably more, thats going off of grinding 1/3
or a included jackpot.
I think it would most likely be BS. I've won about $1,500in about 40 hrs of play at 1/2 the last 2 months back to back. So if I turn that into a full time job, and play 160 hrs in a month I'm only looking at $6,000 and that's only if I don't hit a big downswing. You could potentially make that much at 1/3 though as I'm starting to play that more often, and making more than double an hour at that level.

Last edited by Havok; 04-15-2013 at 04:40 PM.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:35 PM   #4744
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It's not possible unless the game is uncapped and bunch of spews were around while the player was having a heater of his life.

People don't just dump money, and big pots are won by coolers, but the odds of winning those coolers consecutively is slim.

Plus big winners don't brag to strangers.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:36 PM   #4745
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Even playing 50 hours/week that would be around $80/hr which is almost impossible to sustain over 200 hours straight, but I guess it could be done on the heater of a lifetime. The best month of $1/2 I've had is a little over $10k.
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Old 04-15-2013, 07:22 PM   #4746
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by IbelieveinChipKelly View Post
If someone told you they won $16K in one month at $1/$2 would you believe them?
Lol, no chance.
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Old 04-15-2013, 08:26 PM   #4747
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16k. Very hard to believe. Don't think a long term winner can do it. Seen one kid win 5000 on a weekend heater. But I'm pretty sure he was broke by following Saturday. I beat him up for 1200 in one session and heard he tilted away 2 k that morning to the reg nits also.

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Old 04-15-2013, 08:59 PM   #4748
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

We've all probably seen one person that has gone on a $3,000 or $4,000 heater putting in a full weekend at $1/$2 but those are basically once in a lifetime heaters. And at my local 20 table room you only hear about someone doing that a few times a year. The math just doesn't work out at $1/$2 NLHE. Even at 200 hours that's $80/hr LOL - uh no.

Spoiler:
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Old 04-15-2013, 10:17 PM   #4749
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Depends on the structure but I think it's more doable than you think if you put in lots of volume.
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Old 04-15-2013, 11:01 PM   #4750
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IbelieveinChipKelly View Post
If someone told you they won $16K in one month at $1/$2 would you believe them?
Only if followed by a 16k loosing month....

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