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Old 01-14-2013, 03:31 PM   #3576
11t
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

tbh if you are playing poker it is better to QUIT college and GO BACK later.

Nobody is hiring you with an engineering degree if you took classes 10 years ago
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Old 01-14-2013, 03:38 PM   #3577
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Actually that is really good advice. Unluckily I found poker my last year of college so I stuck it out and finished my degree. If I had to do it over again I would do the poker thing in vegas in my early twenties then move on to a career.
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Old 01-14-2013, 03:42 PM   #3578
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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tbh if you are playing poker it is better to QUIT college and GO BACK later.

Nobody is hiring you with an engineering degree if you took classes 10 years ago
Having a huge resume gap is a bad thing, yeah, your graduation should be timed around when you are entering the workforce.

Although lots of the time you should be doing things prior to graduation (i.e. getting work experience, taking tests for grad school, doing research) that should also be timed to maximize their impact on your ability to find a job/go to grad school/do whatever it is you want to do next.
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Old 01-14-2013, 03:42 PM   #3579
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

yeah I wish I would have dropped out, grinded poker until Black Friday then go back to college and pay for it with my winnings in like South Florida
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Old 01-14-2013, 03:50 PM   #3580
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Depends though 11t. It was a lot better to graduate in 2005-2008 than 2009-2011. It was much easier to find a job in many fields when the economy was humming. Picking online poker over college until the UIGEA passed could have screwed you.

It can also be hard financially to quit in the middle (i.e. when you turn 21 or something like that.) Your loans require monthly payments, increasing your monthly expenses. You often lose the scholarships you had if you quit, so you're stuck paying more when you go back or going to the cheapest place possible. I think that's a situation that would vary heavily by person.
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Old 01-14-2013, 03:56 PM   #3581
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I was just making broad generalizations fwiw
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Old 01-14-2013, 04:00 PM   #3582
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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If you are beating 1/2 NL and 2/3 NL games for 19bb/hour, why don't you move up to 2/5 NL and 5/10 NL where you can be making some real money?

Personally, I would never bother playing poker again if I didn't expect to have at least a $75 hourly win rate, so I really don't understand you guys who are so happy to keep grinding 1/2 NL and 2/3 NL.

If it is so easy to have such high win rates at those levels, it should also be easy to grind up enough money toove up to serious stakes like 2/5 NL and 5/10 NL quickly. I can guarantee you that 2/5 NL is the very bare minimum stakes on which a poker pro can make a decent living. Everything else below that level is really just "play money" stakes.

I own a business and play poker for fun and as a challenge. While I have a life roll to play way higher, I set myself the challenge to grind up 20BI or more out of nothing from Jan low stakes just to prove to myself I'm good enough to move up. I never want to have to dip into life money for poker and made that deal with my wife.

I've now moved up to 5/5 when the game is good and 3/3 when it isn't (I don't play it when there is no bigger table open at the casino, as I don't want to be playing the 10/20 regs), although I haven't had much chance to play over the past few months
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Old 01-15-2013, 12:05 AM   #3583
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Man I can't figure out what's right and what's wrong.

1/1/12-6/30/12

501 hours/$4,825 profit

7/1-8/31
114 hours/$739 profit

9/1-12/14
148 hours/$7,475 profit

12/14-12/31

52 hours/$2,945 LOSS

Obviously, consistently winning at $50/hour (mostly at $1/$2; pretty breakeven at $2/$5) is not consistently achievable. But $20/hr should be. Yet I can't get there.

And 2013 is basically breakeven to this point.
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Old 01-15-2013, 12:12 AM   #3584
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52 hours is nothing. Keep your head up. Good results there overall. Think about that.
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Old 01-15-2013, 12:24 AM   #3585
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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52 hours is nothing. Keep your head up. Good results there overall. Think about that.
Is it, though? I mean, 815 hours for about $10K in profit ... so barely $10/hr. It should really be double that.
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Old 01-15-2013, 12:46 AM   #3586
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Is it, though? I mean, 815 hours for about $10K in profit ... so barely $10/hr. It should really be double that.
Closer to $12.50.

That quick loss in 52 hours looks really nasty. How much could you attribute to tilt vs run-bad?
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Old 01-15-2013, 12:56 AM   #3587
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

$1/$2 NL - 722 total hrs recorded

Profit- $14,045 ($19.45/hr)

$2/$5 NL- 215 total hrs recorded

Profit- $10,155 ($47.23/hr)

Current Bankroll- $14,000
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Old 01-15-2013, 12:58 AM   #3588
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Closer to $12.50.

That quick loss in 52 hours looks really nasty. How much could you attribute to tilt vs run-bad?
A little of each. I spewed a couple of buyins here and there and there was one night that was -$1,000 at $1/$2 which is unacceptable. First $500 of that was spew; second $500 was run bad.

Sometimes you make a bad decision, though, and it's neither, it's just poker, which I accept. And I absolutely can admit that I flat-out spewed some.
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:05 AM   #3589
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

kolb institute a 500 stop loss
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:06 AM   #3590
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A little of each. I spewed a couple of buyins here and there and there was one night that was -$1,000 at $1/$2 which is unacceptable. First $500 of that was spew; second $500 was run bad.

Sometimes you make a bad decision, though, and it's neither, it's just poker, which I accept. And I absolutely can admit that I flat-out spewed some.
Can you really still be playing well after 4bi? I have a 3bi stop loss at 200 and 300nl and 2.5bi at 500.

I know some guys who can keep going tilt free but I'm not one of them
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:08 AM   #3591
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Live tables are still essentially like this, it's the hands per hour that hurts.



This is such a great attitude. When i was practicing law, my winnings amounted to a small fraction of my income, but I always thought, "lol, what other fun hobby can you make money at?" And we used the money to fund other indulgences--all kinds of stuff that was essentially 'free' because poker paid for it.
This is why i have decided to completely stop recording winnings, im pretty sure i can win at least 30 an hour at 2/4 going by prior records. Long as im having fun and winning a little, I really don't care.
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:08 AM   #3592
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kolb institute a 500 stop loss
funny thing is, i had a $400 stop loss (two $200 buyins) and $600 for $2/$5 and it was just that the $1,000 night was an EXTREMELY rare saturday night when i was there with my female friend ... so I broke my rule, which i will try to adhere to better in 2013.
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:12 AM   #3593
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

I always implement a 2 BI stop loss to keep my loses small and my wins big. I also barely play sessions of 8+hrs unless table is super juicy and loose. My sessions average about 4-5 hrs. It works for me because I tend to play worse after 4 hrs and especially if I am down over a buy in.

I also always buy in for 100 BB's and when i have a 4 BI loss at $2/$5 I drop down to $1/$2 for 2-5 sessions and make up a minimum of $500 to regain my confidence/ conserve my roll. I also table select a ton and most surprisingly my overall highest winnings days are Tues, Wed, and Thurs! lol I use *************.com and takes daily notes on my phone for every hand I play. Hope that helps!
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:13 AM   #3594
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by ibelieveinkolb View Post
A little of each. I spewed a couple of buyins here and there and there was one night that was -$1,000 at $1/$2 which is unacceptable. First $500 of that was spew; second $500 was run bad.

Sometimes you make a bad decision, though, and it's neither, it's just poker, which I accept. And I absolutely can admit that I flat-out spewed some.
Fair enough. I've had similar months.

Losing two 150bb buy-ins in under an hour from massively ahead can be tiliting, as can botching reads and getting the money in horribly behind. I find I have to fight the urge to try to "force it" when I'm running bad ... because that always seems to lead to either spew or very marginal spots that are bad for the psyche (low EV, high variance, yuck).
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:22 AM   #3595
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by ibelieveinkolb View Post
funny thing is, i had a $400 stop loss (two $200 buyins) and $600 for $2/$5 and it was just that the $1,000 night was an EXTREMELY rare saturday night when i was there with my female friend ... so I broke my rule, which i will try to adhere to better in 2013.
Ugh. I'd rather spew an additional $200-400 doing something stupid to impress a ladyfriend than stick around and spew at a poker table. Obscenely fancy dinner, corner suite, etc.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jMoNToYa View Post
I always implement a 2 BI stop loss to keep my loses small and my wins big. I also barely play sessions of 8+hrs unless table is super juicy and loose. My sessions average about 4-5 hrs. It works for me because I tend to play worse after 4 hrs and especially if I am down over a buy in.

I also always buy in for 100 BB's and when i have a 4 BI loss at $2/$5 I drop down to $1/$2 for 2-5 sessions and make up a minimum of $500 to regain my confidence/ conserve my roll. I also table select a ton and most surprisingly my overall highest winnings days are Tues, Wed, and Thurs! lol I use *************.com and takes daily notes on my phone for every hand I play. Hope that helps!
How/why do you think your Tues/Wed/Thurs results are so good?
I've never found my local games to be very good on those days. Fewer players, generally nittier, hard to table select when there's < 3 tables and no open seats.
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:28 AM   #3596
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

If your highest win rate in a decent sample is on weekdays, the most likely explanation is that you are a winning player running badly in the high variance games. But you can't rule out the possibility that you have a very specific leak of putting drunks on a wider range than is realistic even for a drunk.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:39 AM   #3597
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Quote:
Man I can't figure out what's right and what's wrong.

1/1/12-6/30/12

501 hours/$4,825 profit

7/1-8/31
114 hours/$739 profit

9/1-12/14
148 hours/$7,475 profit

12/14-12/31

52 hours/$2,945 LOSS

Obviously, consistently winning at $50/hour (mostly at $1/$2; pretty breakeven at $2/$5) is not consistently achievable. But $20/hr should be. Yet I can't get there.

And 2013 is basically breakeven to this point.
Kolb I have a great memory and recall you admitting to being a small losing player in 2011...

You made nice progress in 2012, you should be proud of that. Rome was not built in one day. Nh

52 hours is not that much of a sample size, I would start worrying about general leaks aside a little tilt if this continues over another 50 hours

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Old 01-15-2013, 12:07 PM   #3598
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

hey kolb, just try harder. that is your only real option. all you can do is work harder and let the chips fall where they may.
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Old 01-15-2013, 12:20 PM   #3599
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by mpethybridge View Post
If your highest win rate in a decent sample is on weekdays, the most likely explanation is that you are a winning player running badly in the high variance games. But you can't rule out the possibility that you have a very specific leak of putting drunks on a wider range than is realistic even for a drunk.
It's certainly possible that it's variance but it's also possible that the room is more profitable during the week than on weekends. The big night in my poker room is Tuesday night.
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Old 01-15-2013, 12:28 PM   #3600
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Is it, though? I mean, 815 hours for about $10K in profit ... so barely $10/hr. It should really be double that.
Well, as noted above, it's more like $12.5 per hour.

You act like you have to make $20 an hour. Why? This isn't your job. It's a hobby, one you do quite well at. You've worked very hard to get this far, and you should be damn proud of that.

Now, your winrate does suggest you have the ability to improve your game, especially since you live in a city where many tables of 2/5 run regularly. If you improve your game, you could significantly beat 20/hr by moving up stakes. How to do that really depends on you, there's no easy answer for me or any of us to give you. I could give you the standard answers but you already know that.
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