How often would a top winning 2/5 500 max reg bust threw a 5k starting roll if this money was strictly for the game and no winnings were taken out of the roll?

I agree that everyone started off tilting. Some people have learned to deal with it through various methods. IME, most poker players eventually see the swings as inevitable and this helps them not tilt.

My personal method of tilt avoidance is:
1. Recognize that I am tilting and playing suboptimally because of it
2. Go for a short walk through the casino to calm down, and grab pop from the free dispenser.
3. Decide to play a tighter range preflop because I know I am still playing suboptimally, and I have a losing image
4. If I still feel like I am playing really bad, I will cash out my chips and leave regardless of how stuck I am or how good the tables are

Bankroll usage question...

I am a 21 yr old college student, Bankroll~$4000. I use that $ for drinking/food money too along with poker. BR is NOT used for monthly living expenses(rent, utilities, etc.)

I want to build my BR steadily to move up stakes, but for now am playing 1/2 regularly, along with tourneys usually in the $30-$50 range at local cardroom (~40-70 entrants regularly). Occasionally I take a shot at $100-$300 tourneys at casinos in the region.

I am a better tourney player than cash. I have logged endless amounts of SNG's online before Black Friday and am very good at shoving ranges. Since most of the tourneys boil down to ss'ed play in the end (avg stack usually ~10-15 bbs), and the fact that the usual players in these tourneys are absolutely horrendous at short-stacked play, I feel i have a large edge in these tourneys.

Alternatively, I am confident that I can just play TAG poker in the 1/2 games and make a decent profit.

With only a 20 buyin bankroll for 1/2, however, i feel a bit more comfortable playing the tourneys.

Any thoughts on how often these tourneys should be mixed in to my general plan of action? (I have time to play about 2 nights a week btw, with school and all)

You shouldn't not play because you only have 4k, that's silly.

You do realize that the variance of donkaments is much higher than live games?

I wonder if anyone has actually done a tally of whether it's even possible to turn a profit in daily donkament over an extended period.

the rake makes even donkaments tough to beat

risk of ruin is probably like 10%

Couldn't find any ROR or var simulators online for cash games... 10% sound about right? As long as I never take any money out of the roll, 90% of the time 5k is all I would have to invest to get going then?

yea unless you hit a horrible downswing you should be fine with 10 BI

just dont play scared

SCARED MONEY DONT MAKE MONEY

Scared money? He said he's a top 2/5 winning reg....

WTF at even asking a question like that if the above is true.

yea i was just saying it to say it because i like that saying

idk who he is

Stop losses are fine if you don't have much emotional control. Everyone tilts when losing, and when winning, and when they've been breaking even for a long time. Tilt can be very slight by definition. But when you are losing, while you may still be making solid pf and cbet decisions and your technical game will be solid, you're still probably missing a lot of information you would be getting if your mind were clear.

However, stop losses are not necessary for everyone. Whether or not to do this is very personal, and it's crazy to give advice on the matter. If you are rolled and reasonable it's very possible you will not need to stop loss unless you go lose whatever you brought.

For me, stop losses don't work because if I am getting killed taking time off doesn't help. First, I stop playing entirely. I have little desire to play poker when losing and have to force myself to be disciplined. If I leave when down a certain amount, those hours never return. Second, while I feel fuzzy-headed when getting crushed, that doesn't go away because it's a new day. Mired in a losing streak, I am expecting to get my brains bashed in whenever I sit down to play again. Quite irrational. Obviously some things to work on, but a deep breath and a mental reminder about how without variance there would be no such thing as making money playing poker usually help a lot.

If you haven't read it, get Jared Tendler's book.

I'm in my mid 20's with a wife and 2 kids. I was working in the banking industry for 2 years before I resigned a couple months ago. My wife wanted me to spend more time with the family so she started working part-time as a dental hygienist and makes between 33-40/hr depending on the clinic. I've saved up about 5k for my poker bankroll strictly for 1/2 NL (2/5 NL is too deepstacked, 200 BBs minimum so its too much for me as much as I would love to play that game). I'm trying to build a bankroll for 2/5 NL.

- Is it okay to buy in for $500 in the 2/5 game and just try to double through donks? If not, how much should I build my bankroll to?

- If I need around $1000 for expenses at the end of each month, can I take it off my profits from poker? What's the best way to pay for my monthly expenses.

Thanks in advance.

Edit: I've logged 700 hours this year in 115 sessions and winrate of 20.00/hr. Most of my profits were used for our family vacation (disneyland) and paying off loans while I was still working.

I would put in 40 hours a week, 160 hours a month at 1/2 for three months and then honestly look at your win rate.

If you're averaging $20+ and your bankroll is more towards $10,000, move up.

If you're going to play 160 hours a month/are averaging $20 a hour, then taking 1k for expenses is fine.

You just need to start out running normal or good, starting out running bad could be devastating to your roll, especially if you start out shot taking at 2/5.

Remember, you have a wife/kids involved, you can't fail at this if this is all you have for income.

I am single and only have the responsibility to myself. I could blow my roll any time I feel like it and laugh it off/replace it with money from my savings/stocks.

I play for competitive fun though, not to support a wife/family.

P.S.- Just saw your edit.....

I still say get your roll more up towards 10k before shot taking, REMEMBER... YOU HAVE FAMILY INVOLVED IN THIS.... you can't risk a bad run with only 5k.

Re question 1: Yes, but you'll be better off if you build the roll more first, probably at least to 10k.

Re question 2: Uh, pay for it out of your wife's income? Seriously your income is going to be heavily volatile, it would be for the best if your wife covered your family's monthly nut, especially if she's making $6,000+ a month pre-tax or something like you're claiming. Use the extra income for now to build your roll, then start using some as needed to up your standard of living/save for retirement/whatever floats your boat.

When I am on a downswing, I think the opposite way...

I think...

"I am 2-3 buy ins down. I must get out of this casino. If I don't I am going to lose 1k+ or end up playing blackjack. I must go home, honestly review the session, and then sleep it off. Tomorrow when I come back to the poker table it will be the start of at least a 10 session win streak."

I need to sleep it off because I do get upset or even ashamed when I feel I knew the correct plays to be a winner, but failed to execute.

Thanks for the reply lotgrinder. My wife made it clear that there's no pressure for me to make money to pay expenses but i want to help her anyway. I'm not that confident with my winrate as I haven't hit 1000 hours yet. And I know how bad losing streaks could be to a bankroll. In the 2 months I played full-time I've only logged 140 hours and play around 4-5 times a week as wife wants to see me more. How do you schedule your sessions? Long sessions or do you play more than 5 days a week?

Thanks for the reply. My wife only works part-time so shes not making full-time salary. She can pay the monthly expenses most of the time but there are months like christmas where our expenses are higher than usual. Those times she needs me to chip in.

If you are going to be playing for a living...

You have to put in these hours...

Thursday: 6pm-2am
Friday: Noon-4am (Just make sure to get in 8-10 hours)
Saturday Noon-4am (Just make sure to get in 8-10 hours.)
Sunday: Noon-11pm (Just make sure to get in 8-10 hours.)

Schedule cool stuff to do with your wife/family on Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday nights.

They'll be less people to compete with at the movies, restaurants, malls, etc, etc, etc anyway.

Maybe she'll like that?

You can still sacrifice a Fri or Sat night from poker every now and then to..

On Mon,Tue, Wed you should never be in the casino earlier than 5pm or later than midnight unless you found a JUICY game.

You're better off reserving that in advance when you win than worrying about coming up with $1,000 for Christmas or $1,000 for summer camp. If you have a good September, set that aside. Etc.

Don't put yourself in situations where you need to win to pay for your life.

But, for now, you really should focus on building the roll.

That's what my ideal schedule would look like even though I run so bad on weekends lol. The only problem is when she works I stay home with my 2 yr old so I cant start at noon. Thanks though as that gives me an idea how to make mine. I'm going to start logging 8-10 hour sessions. How do you build your mental endurance for this? (I average 7 hours per session)

Make sure you take a 30-45 minute break to go get some food during the session. (eat as healthy as you can to... if you have a losing session then eat like **** to ease the pain.)

If you're used to 7 hour sessions, take a 10 min stroll around the casino after the 7th hour and review the session. If you think you're playing well/running well and the table conditions are good, extend the session another 3 hours.

If you're satisfied with your session, table action has died down, and you think your wife would like you home by 1am to bang her, the go take care of that.

Thanks you've been great help

Np. Good Luck.

When the run bad comes hold tight and remember to keep playing the way that got you to your great win rate right now.

If you feel tilt, get out of the casino and get home to your family, they're the reason you must succeed/not tilt with only a limited roll to start this all off.

One 1k monkey tilt losing session is 20% of your bankroll gone.

Guard that 5k with your life.

My run good streak at 1/3 NL live has finally ended.

I just ended a 17-1 streak (where the only loss was for $12 over a 12 hour session). Went 7 winning sessions in a row, then the $12 loss session, then followed that up with 10 winning sessions in a row (a personal record).

For this once-a-week recreational player, this streak can seem like a lifetime, as it actually stretched exactly 4 whole months (my last lost before the streak being on October 9, 2012, and then finally ending with a loss on February 9, 2013).

All told over this streak: $12,075 over 194.25 hours = $62.16/hr = 20.72 bb/hr.

Ended it with a rather mundane 78bb loss (most of it coming when I lost a flip in a big pot). Then followed that up with a rather terrible 224bb loss (almost half of that coming when I decided to hero call down with 2nd pair and was horribly wrong on my read).

Well, it was fun while it lasted.

GdoomswitchnowengagedG