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Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board

05-10-2015 , 06:40 PM
Villain: 40s heavyset white woman who is probably a losing player at any decent table, though this table is not. Weak tight.
Hero: late 20's white guy with something in between scruff and an actual beard. Probably viewed as a good player by anyone paying attention. Has raised TPTK against villain who called with middle pair, so villain probably respects Hero, if villain even thinks at Level 2, which is doubtful.

Also include any relevant info from previous hands/games that could have influence the mood/metagame, plan for hand, etc.

Hero covers villain's stack of $139.

$1/2 NL (10 handed)
Hero (UTG): raises to $20 with KK. I'm raising to $20 here because anything less will usually be called by 3 or more random hands. Folds to villain.
Villain (SB): says "I call" and puts in the $20. Saying "I call" seemed a little weird to me because this table was pretty talkative except when it comes to player's actions; they would just put chips out there or muck their cards. I'm probably overthinking this aspect though.

Flop ($42): 632
Villain quickly says "all in" and puts in her remaining $119.

Hero ???
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 06:51 PM
Glad to see that you used the template.

Call. She has other overpairs that "put you on AK" often. Occasionally she will have a ridic played AA, or an even more ridic set, but not often.

The shove is an indication that she just wants to end the hand now, which usually means JJ to these types of players, but could be red AA as well. In any case, with a SPR of less than 3-1, never folding here.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 06:56 PM
Can't fold. Lots of over pairs you beat. Sure she could play aces this way but also any other over pair. I think she checks a set a good portion of the time too. Could be the ace high flush draw but you gotta get it in regardless. Call and be happy about it.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 06:59 PM
I often see pre-tilt players who are losing their patience do this with overpairs pairs and flush draws, thinking "WTF I am calling anyhow so I might as well bet, I read somewhere it is better to bet than to call".

If she had AA it was badly played.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 07:03 PM
I know exactly one player who likes to shove in this spot with a set because no one ever thinks he has a set, so this is a call.

Her quick all-in makes me think she might have been waiting for a safe flop with no overcards before getting it in with a hand like QQ.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 07:27 PM
Lol snap
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 07:55 PM
Easy fold.

Spoiler:
Since OP makes this thread ~never if they win the hand. This is a fistpump snap call tho.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 08:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirRawrsALot
Easy fold.

Spoiler:
Since OP makes this thread ~never if they win the hand. This is a fistpump snap call tho.
Yeah, yeah, I thought this was obvious and someone would call me out on it but I just wanted to make sure. Never really dealt with such a stupid all in shove like that before. (Grand total of 10 hours live and nothing to speak of online.)

Villain had AcAh.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 08:21 PM
She's lucky you didn't have the AK Vs like that always put you on.

Spoiler:
PF. After the flop she obv had to price out your combo draw.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 08:28 PM
Also the preflop raise sizing is pretty bad. You're losing tons of value
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 08:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirRawrsALot
Also the preflop raise sizing is pretty bad. You're losing tons of value
Curious to follow up on this a bit. What would you raise in this spot?
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 08:39 PM
So at this table the standard raise was 12-15. Usually 3-4 people called and are generally calling stations postflop. Do we generally want a multiway pot OOP against mostly calling stations? With what hands would we prefer a smaller number of callers?
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 08:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nimbleninja
So at this table the standard raise was 12-15. Usually 3-4 people called and are generally calling stations postflop. Do we generally want a multiway pot OOP against mostly calling stations? With what hands would we prefer a smaller number of callers?
I personally prefer the multi-way pot to just taking down the blinds. I like playing multi-way pots against calling stations because it is usually easy to tell when you are beat.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 08:44 PM
Obviously table dynamics come into play, but 20$ is going to get folded out a good deal of the time at 1/2 and you miss out on players who have Ax or whatever and spike tptk. Also, you raising more with hands like KK and AA is an easy tell for someone who's looking. Im guilty of it as well, but you can get away with it at 1/2 usuallyn

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Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 08:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Case2
Curious to follow up on this a bit. What would you raise in this spot?
Quote:
Originally Posted by nimbleninja;46910027[B
]So at this table the standard raise was 12-15.[/B] Usually 3-4 people called and are generally calling stations postflop. Do we generally want a multiway pot OOP against mostly calling stations? With what hands would we prefer a smaller number of callers?
Something in that area.

One thing that amateur players notice A LOT it when you suddenly raise to $20 when you usually open to $12. If you raise to $12 with AJs/99/KQs then suddenly make it $20, everybody will immediately put you on AK/JJ+

Just keep it simple.
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote
05-10-2015 , 09:19 PM
Calling and very very happy about it
Whether to call weird all-in with KK on low board Quote

      
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