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Value bet AA on double-paired board? Value bet AA on double-paired board?

09-26-2016 , 03:19 AM
1/2 ($200 max)

Hero- Younger white guy one ear-bud in, wearing a hoodie. Not being very vocal and pretty agro image. Went on a heater about 30 min ago opening and winning 5 pots in a row. Haven't had to show down a thing. $~275

V- Older guy 50 ish, has been pretty sticky pre and OTF. Def more passive than agro. Was talking about $5 per line, $75 per spin slot pulls earlier fwiw. Unsure if is a solid older gambler type or str8 degen. $~400

Hero open AA utg for 15, V on my direct left calls as does the BB. Pot $~45

Flop is Q88 rainbow. Hero is first to act and leads for $25 expecting to be called by pocket pairs or hopefully top pair. Not enthralled w the paired board, but it could be worse. V thinks for about 15 seconds and announces that he calls softly. BB Folds Pot~$100

Turn is another Q, ***** turn obv but I do not want to check and let V name the price so I lead an amount that I feel comfortable w in $50, feeling fairly confident V would raise if he has top full house. V calls pretty quickly making the pot right at $200.

River is a 7, no flush on board.


Check fold? Bet fold? Check the turn?
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-26-2016 , 08:18 AM
I would check turn more then bet. A passive opponent will check his QX a lot on the turn and won't bet other hands very often. Betting isn't bad though. Since you have to have QX his calling pushes his range towards the top.

Checking river is better then betting. It's hard to get 3 streets of value from worse. I would mostly check/fold because a passive villain won't be betting worse very often. Not always though, depending on villain, because this is such a good spot for villain to bluff when you let up on the river.
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-26-2016 , 09:08 AM
Stacks are too shallow IMO to bet/fold river. Any reasonable amount you bet, you will be getting a great price to call the river.

Vs this Villain, I would check/call any reasonable turn bet and if he shows aggression again on the river, I would just give it up...

If he checks the turn, I would value bet the river.

As played, I would check/fold the river. Is this type of Villain really going to value bet an Ace high (which we block)? I don't think so.

Will he valueown himself with JJ? Probably not. Passive Recs are just trying to get to a cheap showdown with JJ.
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-26-2016 , 03:01 PM
I think his range is pocket JJs,10s, 9s. Since he's an older guy I wouldn't put him on 8s full. It's possible that he has AQ, but I think you'd see a raise on the turn if he had queens full.

Check/fold the turn. If he checks back then I'd bet 1/2 psb on the river.
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-26-2016 , 03:17 PM
His call OTF gives him a reasonable range of Qx, some 8x, middle pps (99-JJ), and gutshots.
His call OTT takes away most of the gutshots - and maybe a few middle pairs... but def leaves in Qx and 8x (he's not concerned about many scare cards at all).
OTR - It's not clear that he would turn his middle pairs into bluffs... so his betting range is heavily weighted to boats (with only a rare missed gutter in there). Bet fold.
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-26-2016 , 04:05 PM
Bet-f 1/3 pot all streets
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-26-2016 , 04:09 PM
Villain's range on the river is most likely {AQ,KQ,QJs,QQ,88} (16 combos) and maybe some {99-JJ} (18 combos) (I don't think he gets to the river will all these combos)

Against this range, all your $ winning comes from when the river action is check/check. (From Villain's perspective, you could clearly have Qx yourself...)

If you were to bet on the river, I'd assume you're only getting villain to put more money in when he has Qx +. What bluffs could you possibly have for villain call with JJ?

Given above, I'd recommend a check/fold on the river. And if you were forced to put more money in the $, I'd prefer a blocker-bet on the river to check-calling.
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-26-2016 , 07:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amanaplan
Bet-f 1/3 pot all streets
Ehhh I kinda like this. This probably gets max value from 99-JJ.

On the flop I'm betting like 2/3 pot though. Maybe slightly less. 1/3 pot on turn and riv is kinda nice though.
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-27-2016 , 03:57 AM
Thanks for the feedback as always guys. Looking back on it today, it is obvious that I overplayed my hand. No excuse but I had not had AA in my last ~20 hrs and I just really had a feeling that I was going to win a big one once I finally got them, especially with how my image was at the time.

With villains action OTT I bet the river convincing myself he could call a $75, 1/3 pot bet w 99-JJ and I actually thought, and still think that villain could have just called w KK pre since we were the first two to act. Lesson learned you don't always have to go for thin value!
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-27-2016 , 10:29 AM
bet flop a bit bigger but not much around $35. You want Qx and 99, 1010, JJ and the occasional gutter to pay you off.

I would have checked turn, looking to bet bigger on the river to get called by A high, 99-JJ

If you bet turn and river, I think only Qx and 8x is calling.

With a turn check, you show weakness and you can bet river larger I think around $70 if the pot is now over $100 because your flop bet was slightly bigger too.

Overall you would have gained $25 in profit over your $25 and $50 bets.

Betting this river is going to look very bluffy to most fish after checking the turn and keeps their value hands in on the river bet.

As played, x/f is fine.
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote
09-29-2016 , 08:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKC_grinder
1/2 ($200 max)

Hero- Younger white guy one ear-bud in, wearing a hoodie. Not being very vocal and pretty agro image. Went on a heater about 30 min ago opening and winning 5 pots in a row. Haven't had to show down a thing. $~275

V- Older guy 50 ish, has been pretty sticky pre and OTF. Def more passive than agro. Was talking about $5 per line, $75 per spin slot pulls earlier fwiw. Unsure if is a solid older gambler type or str8 degen. $~400

Hero open AA utg for 15, V on my direct left calls as does the BB. Pot $~45

Flop is Q88 rainbow. Hero is first to act and leads for $25 expecting to be called by pocket pairs or hopefully top pair. Not enthralled w the paired board, but it could be worse. V thinks for about 15 seconds and announces that he calls softly. BB Folds Pot~$100

Turn is another Q, ***** turn obv but I do not want to check and let V name the price so I lead an amount that I feel comfortable w in $50, feeling fairly confident V would raise if he has top full house. V calls pretty quickly making the pot right at $200.

River is a 7, no flush on board.


Check fold? Bet fold? Check the turn?
I don't hate your turn bet, I read it as a defensive bet from your reasoning, which is good here if villain isn't aware of it. I think checking might be better, though you'd have to read him on sizing if he bets turn. Thing is, if you check turn and he checks turn, then you bet river and if he comes over top he could range you weak and be making a move; but is such play/cleverness in his capacity. If he calls pretty quickly like you said, I think you're prob good. Defensive Bet > Check > Value Bet



As played: Pretty sure I defensively bet the river for like $80. The $ is important, and actually find a fold if I get raised? lol, that'd be sick. Next best play is to x/c based on his sizing/manner.

You really really really need to read him on that turn mannerism, is he checking softly cause he's in unknown territory and his derived cuteness is mannered from the fact that he's nervy. Or is the turn mannerism with him checking softly because he's super comfortable and giddy, thus his derived cuteness from being coy with notion.
Value bet AA on double-paired board? Quote

      
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