1/3 NLHE 5 handed

V - Unknown Asian LAG kid. Friends with house's maniac asian lag kid but never seen him before. Clearly came to play. Table was awful, 5 handed with me, 1 whale and 3 nits. I was only staying to get into hands with whale but then whale left as did a nit and then V and his gf sat down so table didn't break plus I like 5 handed. He's been using massive sizings pre. First hand he opened 45 UTG and everyone folded. Another hand he opened 35 and ended up showing AJo when OMC called him. Another hand he opened 20 from CO, OMC calls OOP, runout was A-A-8-8-K, flop checked through and OMC check called turn (has KQo) and led river, V raised river IP and OMC paid off V's A5s. He also flopped a set of 66's and slowplayed OOP as well. But he's been mixing in x/raises and using big sizings. One hand he 3-bet one of our tightest nits who opened UTG, V 3-bets UTG1, HU to a 6-7-8r, nit checks, V bets, nit calls (suicide mission), turn 6-7-8-8 FD. Nit donk jams. V taaaaaaanks and can barely bring himself to fold the obvious overpair. 525$ CO/UTG+1.

H covers and should have a tightish image to V, we've only been playing together 45 minutes or so but I haven't been dealt much. I opened KTo one hand OOP and he 3-bet me and I folded and he looked annoyed. Covers. BB.

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UTG folds, V to 13 (unusually small for him), BTN folds, SB folds, H to 40 with 7 7, V calls. HU OOP.

Flop 80 - A A 6

H cbets 30, V calls

Turn 140 - 6

Hero?

3b is bad, bad sizing too

kinda bad flop sizing

now chk

Check call.

PRE - I like the 3B, but we should size up to $50, at least. I wouldn't hate $60.

FLOP - either check or bet 2/3 pot. It doesn't make sense to c-bet small on this flop, short handed. V is going to float us wide when we bet this small, and look for an opportunity to steal the pot if we slow down.

TURN - if we checked flop, we could make a delayed c-bet for around 1/2 pot. As played, I think we can barrel kind of small, like $60, to target his K-high and worse PP's for value, and deny equity from better PP's we hope will fold.

He either has an ace or he doesn't. If he has it, he'll call, or maybe raise. If he doesn't, he'll probably fold, or maybe call. We don't want to barrel huge, and we don't want to just give up now or on the river. Once we start with a small bet on the flop, I'd just keep betting small. If we have a tight image, it should look like we have a boat and we don't want him to fold anything.

One of the hands we were getting value from just turned us and we’re now dead against an ace. We should let him bluff while pot controlling when we’re almost dead (or dead).

Beware the LAG who suddenly makes a normal sized raise or bet. Not necessarily relevant here, just thought I'd mention it.

3! is fine to do some small percent in theory, but I don't like it against described player. You should go for thinner value against players who are loose and passive. Pot control is more important with marginal hands against LAGs, particularly OOP, or you'll quickly get yourself in over your head. You want to take the bottom of each of your value bands and turn them into checks and calls and let him do the value betting for you.

In either case, your 3! should be bigger OOP.

Given my first paragraph, you might not be surprised to hear me say turn is a check. It's a little close if he bets big OTT, and I don't like to expand my calling range TOO much on earlier streets against players like these because it just leads to more x/fs on the river. I'd probably also rather expand my x/c range with good K-high than low pocket pairs. I think a strat of calling 77, KQ and maybe some KJ/KT is probably fine.

Also gotta say we have very different definitions of OMC.

Understood, and not disagreeing with you.

If V had opened a normal size from +1, I'd probably just flat call and set mine with 77. I don't mind the 3B when he raises small. But the AAX board is obviously kind of scary for both us and V, because we could both have a lot of AX in our range. I would expect V to fold most of the un-paired hands in his range when we c-bet, and also fold out any pair lower than 6.

I'm not sure if he's flatting the flop with 66, or very much 6x, so I'm not TOO concerned about the board pairing 6 on the turn. I think once we c-bet the flop small, V is going to be continuing pretty wide with all his pairs higher than 6, just hoping to boat up, and all his un-paired high-card combos.

So I sort of like the 6, in that it cuts down on the number of 6x combos he can have, and is just a brick for the rest of his range. If we barrel small, and he raises, obviously we're just done with it. Even if he calls, I wouldn't plan on betting the river, no matter what it is.

It's not that I like the way we got here, and I want to continue barreling. I don't like the way we got here, but we got here the way we did, and I think barreling small is probably better than just checking.

Like, say we made it $60 pre, he called, and we bet $80 on the flop. I think we have more fold equity when we take that line. If he calls, I'm just done with it unless we boat up on the turn. We'll have lost $140 or won $60 if he folds.

The way hero played this, we're already in the pot for $70, and the pot is $140. If we barrel for $60 and V folds, we win $70. If we don't bet, are we check-folding, or check-calling? If V bets $100, and we fold, we lose $70 with what might be the best hand. If we call, we stand to lose $170, possibly more, depending on what happens on the river.

I don't really love the idea of checking with our hand, and having to play a guessing game. I'd rather take a chance that V will fold if we fire again, even at the risk of having to give up and lose more than we would have if we checked, rather than check and open the door for V to bluff us off our equity.

It's a 3B pot and V opened from +1. I have to think that if our LAG read is accurate, he'd be 4B'ing a lot of his better AX holdings pre, or raising some of them on the flop, which would weight his range more towards other PP's and suited connectors, especially suited Broadways. Both of those types of hands should over-fold to a second barrel.

Even if V has some weak AX, like A5, he won't love the situation if we bet again for a small size. Even though he has a boat, any card higher than 6 could possibly make us a better aces full. I'm not saying he'll fold, but he's unlikely to raise, whereas if we check, he's definitely going to value bet AX, and probably a lot of other hands that would have likely folded to another bet.

I disagree that flop is a check or bet big spot. I think it makes a lot of sense to bet small on this flop. The board is bone dry and very good for our perceived range (Ax and big pocket pairs). We really want Villain to float us wide in this spot when we have a hand like AK or KK since he is going to be drawing dead. From a psychological perspective, I also think this is a board Villains expect us to bet small on with our value, so they won't necessarily go crazy floating and trying to steal on later streets. I also don't mind checking here.

On the turn you said we should bet small to target worse pocket pairs for value. On AA66, all of the worse pocket pairs than 77 are counterfeit and need to bluff. If Villain has a lot of worse pocket pairs (as well as some random floats like 89s with a backdoor), I think we need to check and think about calling down. There just isn't a ton of value to be had here. I think it's a mistake to bet just because it's easier to bet than it is to check and face a tough decision.

3! is awful with that hand OOP. You usually don't know where you are at with 77, as here.

I guess I wasn't overly clear.

I don't think we have any value here. We're bluffing, to rep Ax. It doesn't matter that we have 77, with this line. We're not targeting worse for value, we're targeting better to fold. It's not like V is going to hero call with K-high often enough to make this a value line.

If we're bluffing, then we can't check-call, unless we think V is going to turn K-high into a bluff, which seems unlikely.

You aren't value betting or bluffing, because you have no idea where you are.

This is one of the worst hands to 3!. Better to 3! strongish hands like AQ or TT or suited broadway / suited connectors. If you 3! 87s, sometimes you will make a pair and not know where you are at and sometimes you will hit it hard, but often you can semibluff or pure bluff with air representing JJ+ or AK. With 77, you are unlikely to make decent draws to represent a big hand preflop with.

Also, when you 3! and make your set with 77, it is harder to get action than if you had flat called. You represent AA or whatever and opponents may not call down with one pair.

Oi thanks everyone, good advice all around, I think I played it badly. I bet turn for 110 and he snap folded

This is, of course, the best argument ever made for 3 betting...

For 3-betting in general, say with a draw you can 3-barrel with, but not with 77.