1/3 NLHE 8 handed.

V - young asian guy. Gets out of line. Knows the game and odds and so on but generally plays too wide pre and too wide post. Has a x/raise button. Can make big bluffs. Not at all afraid to gii. But generally just clicks buttons too much/gets FPS.

H - image should be that of a tighter player.

HH - couple limps to V who opens BTN to 20, only good LAG calls in BB, stacks are 1k deep. Flop Qd-4h-3h. Good LAG x, V bets, good LAG calls. Turn 9s. Good LAG x, V bets, good LAG x/r, V calls. River Ah. Good LAG shoves for pot ~600$. V tank calls with KQo no and wins.

--- Both hands are 500 eff ---

Hand 1:

H opens UTG+1 to 10 with A Q, loose passive calls CO, V calls BTN. 3-ways OOP.

Flop 30 - Q J 3

H bets 30, CO folds, V calls.

Turn 90 - T

H checks (planning a x/r), V checks

River 90 - 2

Hero?

----

Hand 2:

Six limps including V and straightforward (SFWD) japanese man to Hero in BB with A K, H makes it 30, only V (HJ) and SFWD japanese man (BTN) call. 3-ways OOP.

Flop 90 (470 back) - Q 8 2

I cbet 30, V calls, SFWD japanese man folds

Turn 150 (440 back) - T

Hero?

H1: I'd x and let him bluff at it.

H2: I think we have too much equity to bluff. Prefer to x and call a reasonable bet.

H1 is frustrating, if you bet can he call with much other than Kc which is probably KQo or KTo? At the same time if you check what hands is he likely to turn in to bluffs - top pair no club? It's an odd one with so many of the high clubs out there. (Also notice that there are a couple of realistic straight flush combos...if you check and he bets big, is this an automatic check-raise?) Interesting spot. I might be tempted to check, this is probably either very clearly correct or very clearly wrong though! Notice that the big flop bet should have condensed V range right down to a few hands (tricky to know how to get the most money from QJ, although that may not check back turn)

H2 I would now check and tread very carefully

H1 keep betting turn.

AP, overbet river.

H2 check flop, bet turn.

AP, check turn. Hope the river is an off suit jack.

If it is, block bet 40% pot, or check to induce. Otherwise, check-fold on a brick.

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Hand 1 - bet something ridiculous like 15 to induce him to bluff. Checking makes it easy to check back with weak clubs for him, betting big makes it easy to fold. Sometimes you can get someone to go crazy by betting a ridiculous small size.

Hand 2 - check and give up, we ded

Maybe if hero took a different line, but not the way this was played. If hero bet turn, then bets river stupid-small, maybe V blasts off with worse value or a bluff.

Hero raised pre, then bets full pot into 2 opponents on this wet flop, then checks turn when the flush comes in. It looks like he was trying to take it down on the flop, then got scared and shut it down on the turn.

A big bet on the flop and a big bet on the river, taking a bet-check-bet river line on a four-flush board might look fishy enough to get called, but a small bet after checking turn just looks like thick value trying to induce a raise.

A small bet here isn't getting spaz-raised as a bluff when there are four clubs on board, hero has the Ac in his hand, and the Qc, Jc, and Tc are on board. V either has KXcc (possibly K9cc for the straight flush), or he flopped or turned 1P-2P. Maybe we can get called by K9 of some other suit, or QT maybe.

We're hoping V hero-calls with a worse flush or anything else that was strong enough to call flop but not strong enough to bet turn. As described, and as played, V can have a lot of 2P and worse value hands here (worse than our nut flush), and might level himself into a hero call.

If V has K9cc and slow-played the turn, we're just getting stacked. We should pray he jams worse KXcc.

Doubtful any bet gets called, much less raised, which is why I would have kept betting the turn. Once we check turn, all we can do when we get there on the river is bet big to polarize to the nuts or a bluff.

Thanks doc that was my thinking too. I really need to work on my turn barrelling game OOP, understanding when to bet and when not to and I certainly check turn too often I think. I think my hand is strong enough that I can clearly go for value OTT. If river bricks idk.. maybe block sizing.

Result:

Never show - if the guy is any competent player he is going to pick up that you check when your strong and bet when your weak.

AP - I'd go with Spanishmoon's plan

misread hand

I dont know how competent this guy is if hes limp calling for $30 w 52s and then raising a turn barrel with no spade.

Tricky maybe, but a great opponent to play with.

He definitely picked up that you checked when strong on the first hand bc he raised you w air on the second hand in the same situation when you barreled.

Next time you play him bet a turn flush or strong hand and see if he raises.

Wait, did he have 52cc or 52ss? Is it possible he really did misread his hand, and thought he had spades? Raising 52cc here is wild.

It could be that he picked up on a pattern of when you bet versus when you checked turn, or it could be your bet sizing is a tell.

You're multi-way and OOP as the PFR in both hands, and both flops are pretty similar - two-tone, queen-high, with potential straight draws. But the hands are different in that you opened UTG1 in H1 and they both call, and in H2, these guys are limp-calling after you raise from the BB.

At these stakes, when someone flat calls or over-calls an EP open, I tend to think they have middling PP's just hoping to flop a set, or some SC's. But when they limp-call, I think the range is trashier, because some of those hands that would call your EP open are now opening themselves. With six limpers, your BB raise could look like a light squeeze, so they make light calls with all sorts of trash.

So, in H1, we're only worried about someone having QJ or 33 on the flop. In H2, we have to be worried about all kinds of weird $hlt, which is why I'd have preferred we check the flop in H2. In H1, we could have QQ, JJ, QJ, AK, AQ, AJ, KQ, KJ, and KT. In H2, we might have QQ, AQ, or KQ, but we won't have as much 88, Q8, or J9. So there's a difference in nut advantage.

In H1, you bet full pot. In H2, you bet 1/3 pot. I don't mind the big bet in H1 because we hit it pretty hard, the pot is small, and we aren't too concerned about bad run-outs. In H2, the pot is bigger, but we didn't connect as much, and we shouldn't be as eager to bloat the pot when not all our outs are clean.

I'm just wondering if V might have picked up on the flop bet sizing. In H1, it looks like we want to build a pot. In H2, it looks like we're just c-betting 100%.

Also, our turn bet in H2 was just over half-pot, when the Ts completes a flush draw and brings in an ISSD. If we had the nuts there, I'd think we'd either check to induce, or bet huge. After we bet 1/3 pot on flop, our 1/2 pot bet on turn looks like we're just barrelling without wanting to fully commit.

he had 52cc... no typo