1/2 casino game

Hero on the button (~$350) mid 20’s male. I haven’t played many hands yet and lady is reading her kindle between hands so not sure if image matters much anyways

Crazy lady in the cutoff (covers hero) 50’s female. Playing super aggressive, has chased gutshots when not getting the right odds at all, shoved when she hit and got called twice. Also has made large river bets and snap mucked when called on several occasions.

Table is one of the looser 1/2 tables I have played at. $20 preflop raises can get 4+ callers.

UTG folds, UTG+1 makes it $15. 3 callers including crazy lady to my immediate right. I raise to $50 with TT. Everyone folds to the crazy lady who flats.

Flop ($148) A K 7

She checks. I think for 15 seconds and then check.

Turn ($148) 5

She fires out $85. I think for another 20 seconds and call.

River ($318) 3

She bets $125, I call.

Thoughts?

It's hard to say if the turn call is correct, but if you call the turn you need to grow a pair and call off. So as played to the river you should call.

Her range is very wide, I doubt she has many kx here so it's ax + or air. You basically have qq

Set mine or make it $75+ pre

PFR size is terrible. Make it $85 or flat and set mine. As played just fold turn....even crazy lady probably isn't bluffing on an AKx board very often when your range includes a lot of AK/AA/KK/AQ type hands in the first place.

Seems like a really good spot to just flat PF. We're getting great odds to set-mine (especially with the crazy lady in the hand).

Flatting is just so clearly +EV, and it's really straight-forward to play post-flop.

Why complicate things by 3betting when flatting is so easy?

As played, I'm folding the turn, simply because we know that she's betting the river. So this isn't really an $85 decision OTT. It's a roughly $200+ decision.

From history it sounds like she's really polarized on the river when she makes a large bet (that it is either a bluff or the nuts).

Here she is not betting a large amount, and the fact that she led out on both streets makes it look like a value bet with weak ace or KQ type hand (when you didnt cbet she can be sure that her pair is good)

So like DaYu said knowing shes also betting the river and there is like 5% chance shes checking the river, im folding the turn.

Yeah you really have to size the 3bet bigger to at least 65+. I am also cbeting the flop when she checks to you. As played its a fold on the turn.

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Yeah, $50 pre is problematic, specifically because it:

-Isn't likely to win you the pot immediately
-Isn't likely to thin the field to a heads up situation (you got lucky)
-Isn't the same size you'd make it with AA or KK (I hope)
-Prices you out of profitable set mining

It does give you initiative in position, which is nice... But you proceeded to give that away by checking behind on a flop that smashes your range. Once you check this back I think you are pretty much committed to calling this particular player all the way down... 100% committed if you are confident she would have 3-bet AKo and AQs pre-flop.

PF we should just shove if we are raising, 50 was way too small.

As played cbet the flop 100%.

Turn is a fold as well as the river.

Ugghhh,

this is a crappy spot. Not only did the Ace hit but the King hit as well.

based on V description you can make the case for calling but...

I would be much more interested in making the case for shoving river.

If V can find a fold button and if V has laid down to aggression in the past, this is the perfect spot to turn our hand into a bluff and shove.

Yes, us shoving river as a line kinda doesn't make sense but truth is, making sense doesn't matter all that much at this level. LLSNL players think more in terms of bet sizing and it is common for LLSNL players to slow play and be all trappy trappy with their big hands. Not to mention in LLSNL the river c/r shove is the universal sign for "I haz a big hand "

If she can fold, I like a shove here because there are just too many random weak ass Ax and Kx in her range here.

So the question is, based on hhs, has villain been able to fold to big bets? If so, then shove, if she is a terribad station, then just make a crying call....

also, not a fan of your preflop raise, $50 is way too small, rather you just set mined your TT rather than raise $50.

Shoving pre is even worse than $50 imo. Did you miss that we are 175 BB deep?

You give up your positional advantage by shoving, and even this villain will play close to perfectly against that, perhaps with the exception of folding JJ. Both flatting and $75-$85 are better.

Opps,

didn't see that come river we really don't have enough to fold out villain, so a river shove doesn't have all that much fold equity and V would likely make a crying call with 90% of her Kx and Ax range...

meh...

I absolutely hate being in spots like this, tbh, feels like we just played this hand about as bad as possible and have to now resort to "hope" poker.

I'd rather take the line where we c-bet flop and shove turn than just turn our hand face up on flop by checking and then check/calling down and getting raped by Ax and Kx.

The only way c/c'ing down is optimal is if she is a certifiable maniac. Then yes, you can make a good case for c/c'ing down...

okay, re-reading the OP, description is that she is super aggro.... okay, if that is the case, then c/c'ing down is optimal. So, I guess we just grin and bear it and c/c river.

Grunch

Meh, I'd just call PF and set mine with my pocket tens.

If you were planning on continuing with this hand thinking you're ahead on the flop....then the correct move would be to raise all-in on the turn. Problem is that you're still behind a lot of hands she could feel that she's bluffing and betting with on the turn/river.

This is a high variance spot though and without a specific read. I'm just giving up with this on the turn. I don't want to be calling my stack off with middle pair and would choose to wait for a better spot against crazy, maniac player. I like flatting this preflop to set mine with as well rather than 3 betting.

Fold>raise> call on turn

I dont 3 bet the TT. I think it overplays the medium strength hand.

fold turn

Usually I don't like 3betting TT or JJ preflop bc I feel like you never get called by worse. But this particular table was so loose. I thought there was a very good chance I had the best hand, thinking that QQ+ Would have 3bet already so I am only worried about the initial raiser and JJ. Also I felt that there were a lot of loose calls to begin with that would not be able to call a 3 bet.

I was really confused what her range is after calling my 3bet. Is there any range where it is correct for her to flat my 3bet? I eliminated QQ+ bc I think she 3bets that, and she probably 3bets AK as well. When she checked flop I think she is Kx at best because if she called pre with Ax she is hoping to hit the ace on the flop so I can't see her checking here. I don't think there's many Kx combos that are cAlling the 3bet pre, maybe KQs and KJs. I would think JJ is possible and some suited connectors

I felt like the flop was a wa/wb type of situation and I can see her callin with all her Ax and Kx based on her calling to hit the gutshots earlier. Kinda sux that im letting her value bet me with Kx. Also I was afraid that she was bluffing with JJ but was actually good. When I took so long on the flop I felt like I induced and had to call turn. I didn't think she would necessarily bet river on a bluff if I called turn. But again I hesitated on the turn. Also she liked to shove with the nuts which also made me think this was more likely a bluff than a value bet

^ didn't you say that she makes big bets with both nuts and bluffs though?

Results?

She only shoved with the nuts. She bet like 50 into 100 a couple of times in multiway pots and snap muck when called

She had pocket 2's...

Cbetting flop is best against an aggressive maniac unless you are prepared to call down all the way with 3rd pair.

Seems like you were fine with calling down with third pair here...

Nevertheless, in spots where I am against an aggressive Villain who will interpret my flop check as weakness, I usually prefer to turn TT into a bluff on the AK7r flop to "beat the aggro to the punch."

Pocket 2s? lol

She probably is use to playing duces wild so she thought she had the nuts.

Even though your hand is only like a 2:1 favorite vs. a completely random hand, you have pretty good pot odds so I think it's a call. Also, this spot depends a ton on her preflop range IMO.

Does she value bet thin? Like Kx? Even Ax? Or is she really polarized to air (tons of combos) or monsters?

Or is she just button clicking and has no idea whether she's value betting or bluffing?