Villain: mid 20s sat down ab an hour ago pretty tight player so far but did call a flop bet and river bet with a pair of 2s vs the table donk and he was good. Other than that hasn't been to involved yet.

Hero: mid 20s have been mixing it up quite frequently with table donk and a few other players. Have showed some big hands and some failed bluffs.

Villain has $800 hero covers.


Villain opens to 20 utg (table standard) hero calls on button with AcQs.

Flop As Kc 6c. Villain leads out for 45$. I call

Turn 4c completing flush. Villain checks I bet $125, villain pretty much insta ships...

What's our play? Are we ever ahead!

Well, you're 20% against a range of KK+,AKs/o,QcJc,JcTc,66 which seems about right. If we throw in some random spazz, we might get up to 25%. This is a pretty clear fold, imo.

What do you think his UTG opening range is? I don't see AQ beating much in a tight range.

Seems like you turned your hand into a bluff by betting the turn. AP, fold, not getting proper odds to call and hit NF.

Fold for sure.

Ok, so if I check it back what are we doing if he bets a non club river? Just fold.

Anyone not like his line? I mean he has seen me be pretty active what range is he putting me on here?

Bet the turn for sure, but bet smaller. That big I don't know what is calling you for value. Bet like 1/2 pot, ~$65.

So are we folding to just a shove then?

If he re pops it to 180$ can we just call?

How would you have played AXcc here? I doubt you'd have bet so big. Your bet yelled at him that you didn't have it, and since he didn't have the ace of clubs he might peg you squarely on the TP FD. Is this the type of bet you'd previously been bluffing with? I think that's why he overbet the pot all in.

On a side note, your TP was rather weak to be betting on the turn and expect to get called by worse made hands. Since you've got the nut draw I wouldn't have minded a check back here. On the river you can reevaluate but by keeping in all his garbage and missed draws here on the turn his range can be wide enough on the river to call a bet with TPTK (except for perhaps the J or 10 coming on the river).

Touché the big bet does look kind of weak I guess..

I want to read a few more opinions and ill post results later def an interesting hand..

One more thing tho, he insta shipped pretty much does his strength there ever mean weakness or is this totally villain dependant, like I said I only played with him for an hour or so before hand.

You have 7~9 outs (7 if he has flush, 9 if he has set). There are 44 cards left

Well just say 8/44 times you hit.

If he makes it $180 as a check raise, then pot is:
130 + 65 + 180 = 375
and you owe 115 more... pot would become 490

You need 44/8 * 115 in pot + implied money to make this call = 632.5

so.. if you can count on getting another $140 out of villain if you make your hand, then you should call... and yes - you can get another $140 out of him OTR

(@ other post - villain is not making a play... almost always he has a great hand here and your huge bet led him to believe he was getting paid or he better charge you big time to draw)

Aren't there only a few combos of QcQx we may get value from? It seems so thin I opt to check. Obviously we fold to a raise.

It's my understanding that it's been shipped on the turn so there's no implied equity

I think if the V was able to hand read here he may have the "gut feeling" on exactly the TP+FD and can make this move knowing it was good or could be trying to not give odds to the nut flush with the weaker flush. Either way I don't see a call from the OP here. We got outplayed by going for value on a turn that we couldn't call the reraise.

That discussion was a hypothetical. "What to do if I bet smaller and he clicks it back?"

Looking at the line again, villain bet pot OTF, so this must be some sort of set (weird check raise on turn, but whatever?)... so I think the check is good advice now.

If V had bet smaller OTF, I would pack in all Ax hands as value victims.. even ones without clubs [AQ,AJ,AT].. plus all hands with a lone club like JJ/QQ etc.

Way to play yourself into folding the nut draw

turn is a clear check AINEC unless villain is a mouth breather

Results: I was actually the villain in this hand. I had 9c9s and I did think his huge turn bet after I checked screamed AcXx... I know player is capable of calling lightish and he knows I know so I figured my shove is almost like begging for a call, and I don't know that his second card was the Qs I just said that so u guys didn't know that it was me who was villain. He literally could have any card with his Ac. I ended up showing the bluff as I was leaving soon after and it ended up working out great because I stacked someone else when I donked bet into him with bottom set and got all the money in vs his top pair no kicker..

Edit: he shows Ac when he mucked


Thanks for replies thought it was an interesting hand!

I take back my earlier comment about outplaying you because this thread pisses me off. Please read the guidelines about posting "how can he call this" threads. Bad form IMO

hmmm... you may go broke making this play in the long run.

Yeah, might want to read the stickies. Reverse HHs (Hero is actually villain) are forbidden ITF. Kinda figured when you said how eager you were to show results...

Congrats on finding a V who was thinking enough to lay that down, but BBV is <------- that way. Or if you travel far enough, you can get there going --------> that way...

Actually with your 99 a bet/fold accomplishes more here than a check/raise

And your flop c bet sizing is atrocious

Haha sorry guys I didn't read the stickies obviously. But exactly why I did it. Obviously admins remove if this is not wanted here

But this is my point I found a villain Jo was capable of laying it down... Isn't that the point? Against this villain wasn't the hand played a ok way? Obviously nothing good long term.. And I don't want to post in BBV I wanted real opinions

Yeah but what does the original post have to do with your logic here?

Telling us he had hand X isn't meaningful, having us evaluate his hand range from your perspective is much more meaningful

You can't get real opinions when you give the fake AcQ hand though... with the 99 you are playing against a range, not a specific hand. When you get snapped by 66 or AK, this is a stupid play. Also, history and reads are very important when doing this. If villain is always going to give you credit, then sure, ok bluff.

But really you posted this as a brag and to pat yourself on the back.. just a stupid thread here.

Real opinion, the raise on the flop was a fps float, why so much? the turn c/r, congrats but it's a very high variance play that will mess you up. The only reason you won is the V botched it so bad. I congratulate you on finding such a soft game to play in, because your winrate wasn't due to your skill.