Trying to find the right outcome.

I can't imagine that we are ahead of both of them.

Why would short stack go all in? If he doesnt have spades, he is more than likely ahead.

lol.

I was showing you how to solve for the minimum equity we need for shoving to be profitable. Even if we're never ahead of him if we have that much equity it's +EV if not it's not.

That's a weird assumption though.

shove. and those of you stacking your chips in 50's, that's atrocious, please stop doing this immediately.

I stack mine in $200 stacks/40 reds, when I get over $1200 I make the pyramid shape w/ $200 stacks, and I've never had a problem of knocking them over or not being able to count or whatever. Seriously try to look like its not your first day.

lol $50 stacks

Omg. When I see $50 stacks I'm always iso ing that tard. It screams FISH newbie scared monies..

Hmmm maybe others think the same way I do and i can reverse bluff with this move?
Ill keep you updated.
If the $50 dosent work ill move down to $25

I like it.

Imagine playing from evil villain's side. you limped in m-lp, and then called roughly a pot sized raise from the button for about 25% of your stack after somebody else tagged along. Not a great move for a set miner. If someone is calling here with 55 77 hoping to set mine with a 1.2 SPR, I want to play them all day. If they are just calling with KK because they are scared to play for their monstrous 32bb stack or have some kind of FPS thinking about making more money postflop with their KK than just shoving pre for either a nice $35 pot, or a 3 way all-in where they are probably best, then pretty much same thing -- put this fish at my table any day and twice on sundays.

Honestly, I can't think of any hands with which I would play his line pre with this stack size, it's a clear shove/fold situation, so I think we can clearly mark this guy as a fish, probably loose passive calling station variety. At the very least they are unfamiliar with shortstack play and should be picked on mercilessly when short.

So we don't know for sure what he's playing here, but it's MUBsy thinking to assume he always has you beat when he goes all-in. There's no reason for him not to go for this this probable 3 way all-in, where one big stack may fold out the other with something like top pair good kicker, or a nut flush draw. And we've already determined that he's calling where he should be raising or folding pre, so it's even possible he's calling some nonsense like bottom pair postflop that should run for cover. Chances are he has far more AK, KQ and various AsXs in his range than KK, 55 and 77. If he has K5 or K7 in his range, then he probably also has every single NFD in it and quite probably some second or raggy FDs also.

So many more combos are behind you than ahead of you under expected fishy lines. And under any line where he is well ahead of you here, he is *massively* exploitable. If he shows down any hand that beats you here, his preflop play is terrible, and you've gained some valuable information about a good player to isolate pre when you can.

The reason i assume he is always ahead is because i dont see how he can check the flop, then call his all in stack after a bet and check raise.

IMO thats either a flush draw or a set.

Ok, so assume that -- there are still a lot more flush draws he could be holding than sets. And given the terrible preflop play, I don't at all discount the possibility that he is calling off this much with TPGK. Given his stack size, I'm not even sure it's wrong to call with TPTK here.

This is a great post.

Flush draws aren't ahead of you.