please please please grow up spike. you act like your ego grows through the ceiling. its that bad huh? (will be patiently awaiting a pathetic comeback if youre still acting immature)

as far as the hand goes, pre is good even OOP, cause youll stack one of these V's(donks), when a 7 hits the flop.

leading the flop is good.

should lead turn. however, id call V. seems like a bluffer. reevaluate river. c/c if it comes a low non-club?

hand result?

Lol at anyone getting all fired up at the player descriptions/banter. It was my favorite part.

Call and reevaluate, I don't mind the flop bet at all. Dudes will bet the 4 here so much more than you expect, then check through the river when another OC hits. If he pushes river, I'm giving him credit for it.

Jesse

Yeah spike is clearly just joking. I don't see what all the fuss is about.

Preflop is obviously good. I like the flop bet too. You'll get called by 4x a lot and whether they're calling or folding their overcards you want to bet because if they're calling you get value and if they're folding you gain a significant amount of equity in the pot because with this many players with overs they collectively have a ton of equity against you. Stack sizes are an issue but checking just seems like forfeiting the pot to me, which is weak when we likely have the best hand and can get called by worse.

Turn is gross because we have <PSB left against this guy (if Bilbo had been the caller it'd be a different story). With deeper stacks I think b/f turn c/f river is the optimal line, but any bet commits us, as does calling even his stupid $45 bet; if we call him here the pot will be ~$250 OTR and we'll have ~$110 behind. It's a shove or fold spot when he bets and I probably just c/f here but I hate it and I'm not confident in my decision. I'd like to hear some other people's thoughts that deal directly with the stack size issue (Angrist seems to be the only one that touched on it from my skimming of the thread).

This was my first thought...but stack sizes are weird.

And I don't know, if he floated with some broadways, we can take a pretty thin c/c line here and c/eval river. Like, if you go with the thought that he's floating a higher % of the time otf, then you should c/c turn.

Obviously the puss line is to just c/f the flop.

FWIW: I always hate these spots, set mining and end up with lol overpair.

FWIW + 2: I think its very important to know that spike is good looking, degen villains are more aggressive towards the genetically blessed, I would know.

Good catch, I wasn't paying enough attention. Ugh. C/f turn, I guess. Might seem super weak, but if a call or shove is better, the difference is so marginal that it seems wiser to wait for a better spot since you've got obvious punching bags at the table. In reality, I probably bet turn anyway, call the shove and hate myself.

Set mine is fine pf. That said, your betting line says exactly what you have, a pair below a pair of nines. That's never a good idea. You're never betting here with trip 2s or the nuts in their minds.

The biggest problem with this hand is you aren't looking two streets down as to what you are going to do. Your SPR is just over 4 at best. You have no room to maneuver and are OOP. Therefore, you're treating your hand as a bluff (bet on the flop, fold to pressure) if you aren't going to stack off. A bet of $45 is the worst option. You're giving over cards nearly proper pot odds to call. A decent player can float and take this pot from you on the turn unless you're willing to stack off (no card is going to make you happy unless it is a 3 or 7). Either bet this hand hard (PSB) or check and re-evaluate based on who bets.

On the turn, your only choices are c/f or shove. You're not going to get called by worse.

Personally, I don't bet this flop. If you think the villain is most likely stealing, then I like a c/r better. A bet on the turn as long as there is no ace is much better if it checks around.

Very good insight

Yo, Venice (and anyone else),

What if you considered everyone in the hand incapable of betting air on the turn? Would that change your play at all? That's pretty much how I had them all pegged.

Basically there's a lot of ugly people itt that can't take a joke.

Like this is the main problem for like 99% of llsnl. It was one of my leaks as well. Until I learned about lines and viewing them before it happens. Its call being considerate to all future actions and knowing how your opponent will react with certain types of hands.

/thread venice killed it.

Even the most clueless donks can bet with thin air. If you're playing based on your digestive track, those taco's for dinner call for a bluff every once in a while.

this

I'm not sure he is treating his hand like a bluff. I think there are hands he can get called by AND beat (a 4, 33, 55, 66, AK, AQ, etc) AND get it checked thru on turn and river. In a 1/2 game you have never seen a marginal hand bet a flop, get called by less, and have it go check/check on turn and river?

If he shutting down on the turn, overcards are not getting the price to call.

In the hand I think you gotta fold to Ricky's bet.