Prehand Descriptions
Villain 1: been playing with villain for a good 3 hours, he's about 30 years old, tight, passive, is rarely the aggressor in a hand
Hero: fairly tight, but looser than villain and more aggresive, is usually the aggressor when in a hand,



$1/3 NL (10 handed)
UTG ($300)
EP ($130)
EP+1($250)
MP V1 ($750)
MP+1 Hero ($850)
MP+2 V2 ($400)
CO ($550)
Button ($300)
SB ($200)
BB Villain ($300)

Hero is dealt KK

folded around to hero, Hero raises to $10, 3 callers (2 are from the blinds)

Comments: this is fairly standard at the table, $10 raises seem to get 2 callers or so.

Flop ($40) K of hearts, 3 of diamonds, 9 of diamonds

checked to hero by both blinds, Hero bets $30, 2 folds and villain calls from the BB

Comments: I'm thinking flush draw on villain

Turn ($100) 6 of hearts

villain bets $25, hero raises to $100, villain calls $75

Comments: I'm thinking still a good draw or maybe a pair

River: Ace of hearts

Villain bets $100, Hero?

Villain has about $100 behind after his river bet. Hero has him covered.

Minraise him all in.....never anything else.

If somehow he managed to make a backdoor flush then props to him. Not getting him allin is leaving money on the table over time.

The only way you lose this hand is if Villain has like J10hh and was trying to hit a gutter ball and tried keeping it cheap on the turn when he made a FD.

Against most of the people I play with, this would be a shove on the river. However, since you describe the villain as "tight, passive, is rarely the aggressor in a hand", I would just flat expecting to see something like Q J, A K, or a set.

..

raise more pre

pot flop

raise pot when he leads out on turn

scoop river

Well.......we beat 2 of the 3 things you listed so......shoving is better than calling.

It's not about calling cause he could have X....it's about making that extra money all the times he doesn't.

I don't view his turn donk as aggression.....more like.....clicking buttons.

Villain shows up with two pair a lot more then a backdoor flush.

Shove. Sorry he had qjhh or 10jhh.

Hands villain takes this line with that beat us:

QJhh,QThh,Q9hh,JThh,J9hh,T9hh,98hh,97hh,96hh
AA
12 combos

Hands that we beat:

33,66,99,AK
11 combos

It seems raising here would be high variance.

I flat.

A6dd is another hand that would take this line. Also, it's somewhat important if you have the Kd in your hand or not. If not, Kxd is another possibility for a passive player. The line he took screams draw.

Do we have the K of diamonds........If we don't there's so many Kxdd he can have.....

I don't remember if I had the K of Diamonds. This hand occured around 6AM after I had been playing for 6 hours and drank all day and night.

lol.. but you remembered everbody's stack sizes perfectly...

this.

That was just a template, the only correct stack sizes are hero and villain.

I shove here, what's he calling your flop bet with on K93 a gutter a FD set and donking on the turn and calling your RR, a heart? no way.......just shove, you're way ahead too often not to given the way this hand was played.

k... i think villain started the hand with 330 not 300...

in any case river is a shove for value

we need to have seen him play multiple sessions to give him credit for better than a set of kings the way this hand was played.

I simply can't believe the number of people that say to shove the river. The OP said this guy was passive and he has donked both the turn and the river. Players like this will not make a river play like this without at least two pair - at a minimum!

That turn donk looks too much like a blocking bet (as was already suggested) and the river bet is screaming that the river improved his hand.

Raising the villain on the river is not for value, it is only for increased variance.

If you look at it that way then it's time to embrace the variance and shove the river.

You're gonna say his hand consists of J10, Q10, QJ all of hearts.....but he won't do any dumb spazz plays with a set or A6dd or A9.....What if he thinks you're gonna check back KQ OTR when a flush comes and he was trapping or made two pair?

He donked turn when wr still had the nuts. I think it's just as likely he has a weaker set as well as most 2 pr combos. If he rivered the flush you move on. I think we lose too much value in the long run by calling.

This

i wager all of our (effective) chips.

The turn donk was a $25 bet into a $100 pot, which looks like some kind of pot control bet. He then flatted the raise instead of 3-betting.

Then he donks $100 on the river, 1/2 of his remaining stack and 1/3 of the pot. He clearly doesn't want Hero to check back anything and wants to get value from a player that has shown constant strength.

Also, for the third time in this thread, I repeat: I only flat the river because he is described as a passive player.

This decision is extremely marginal

Can't go wrong either way really

Having said that, I get it in

OK, now I want the result of this.

Can this ever be a really passively played AA here?

[QUOTE=JayKon;26849364]The turn donk was a $25 bet into a $100 pot, which looks like some kind of pot control bet. He then flatted the raise instead of 3-betting.

Then he donks $100 on the river, 1/2 of his remaining stack and 1/3 of the pot. He clearly doesn't want Hero to check back anything and wants to get value from a player that has shown constant strength.

Also, for the third time in this thread, I repeat: I only flat the river because he is described as a passive player.[/QUOTE]

I'm sorry, now that you said it 3 times I completely agree with you...