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River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff?

10-25-2023 , 04:28 PM
$2-$100 spread limit ($100 is the most you can raise).

I raise UTG2 with KdJd to $10 (there’s a $4 UTG straddle on). Only the Straddle calls.

Flop: AhTh7c (pot: $20, heads-up). He checks I bet $15 he calls.

Turn: AhTh7c Ks (pot: $50). He checks I bet $30 he calls.

River: AhTh7c Ks 3d (pot: $110)

He checks. Do we check back or bet $100?
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-25-2023 , 04:36 PM
yeah, I would check back with my cards held face down a few inches above the felt getting ready to muck to an ace, but it was played fine (I would bet 20 ott but that's just nit picking).
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-25-2023 , 04:45 PM
i dont think betting the turn to check the river makes much sense but i also instinctively thought dont bluff when i saw the thread title so do with that what you will.

w that said taking a look at 50 bb sim (and even 100), mp vs bb basically bets range ott and gives this up otr basically pure

given your pop reads, if i bet turn it would be to barrel through, hes supposed to do a good amount of folding w ax ott but i think people are not really going to do that (which should make river better)

Last edited by submersible; 10-25-2023 at 04:51 PM.
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-25-2023 , 05:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by submersible
i dont think betting the turn to check the river makes much sense
It makes sense when we have medium strength hands in position like this, for example if we check the turn and he leads out for pot otr, do we call assuming he's bluffing? It's easier to keep the pot under control this way.
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-25-2023 , 05:28 PM
if you look at the turn it thinks hes indifferent / folding a large amount of his ax. i dont think random at 1/2 that is straddling (even independent of the straddle i think people are going to be too sticky with tp here) is going to fold them at nearly the frequency hes "supposed" to so i think betting turn with intent to give up river isnt that good. i think practically speaking, except for some fd, you take a hand with good sdv and neuter that by forcing him to call another bet ott here.

call the river if you think hes bluffing? idk what to tell you beyond that. you give him the option to bluff missed hearts, missed sds, turn underpairs / 7x / Tx into a bluff. i dont see how putting in a bet ott prevents you from losing a bet to the hands you're behind or makes the pot more manageable. i just think hes going to end up at the river w way too much bare top pair in his range and make a decision there.

Last edited by submersible; 10-25-2023 at 05:33 PM.
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-25-2023 , 07:13 PM
I don't love betting turn. As said before, if we think villain is capable of bluffing, we can always call river.

You know this pool better than we do. Are people folding aces for $100 here? I think on the river as played we also beat some hands.

I think JJ, maybe might make a good bluff on turn and river, blocking the nuts. JJ blocks AJ which he can have. I don't think villain would have AK here. You block KT, but I think villain mostly has Ax here. 98s and some lower showdown value flush draws also make sense as bluffs. JTs even maybe, but I think AT would raise flop a lot.

Seeing how there are better bluff candidates, I feel like we are too high in our range on turn and river to bluff.
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-30-2023 , 02:42 PM
Quote:
River: AhTh7c Ks 3d (pot: $110)

He checks. Do we check back or bet $100?
RESULT: We bet $100 and get snap-called by KsQh!
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-30-2023 , 03:02 PM
Read title, obv. check.


I don't mind turn bet, without reads lots of random hh or Tx that can call. Obv. we getting owned by A7o or whatever "I see an A, so I call" ... would bet or check this hand, probably more likely to bet the less likely I think V is to bluff brick rivers.

River I don't see people folding A5 much, but you have an entire thread about people making insane folds to you ... but we also beat a lot of stuff, not just 2nd pair but 2nd best 2nd pair. Explicitly worth noting that NFD on the flop now beats anything but an A (or your better K), so betting 30 on the river is something I might do sometimes.
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-30-2023 , 05:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by davomalvolio
RESULT: We bet $100 and get snap-called by KsQh!
I wonder if he's been reading your thread on sick $100 bluffs and how no one calls in this game?
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote
10-30-2023 , 05:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man of Means
I wonder if he's been reading your thread on sick $100 bluffs and how no one calls in this game?
Haha. Maybe! Learned afterwards that he was on the waitlist for the big Omaha game…hard to bluff a guy with **** You money!
River decision: accept my showdown value or turn 2nd pair into a bluff? Quote

      
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