If you have the nuts and get raised, go all in.

Played 1/2 and good but gambly player limps. Me 230 he covers). I complete small blind with AQo and BB checks. Flop comes AQ9r. I lead 5 into 6. BB folds, he calls. AX, JT, KT all in his range.

Turn A. I bet 15, he calls again.

River J. I lead 25 hoping to get called by AX. He raises to 60. I go all in. Villain calls with AJ.

Yeah it's a cooler for him, but, in the past, I would have probably reraised smaller or afraid villain might fold. But, I shipped and probably would have shipped if we were even deeper.

If you aren't sure V has an ace then betting $25 for value is fine. But if you strongly suspect V has Ax you could have just open shipped river. Villain is NEVER fold Ax in this spot. 98% of LLSNL players are biologically incapable of folding trip aces. So when we have a strong read villain has trip aces and we have a better kicker or boat, we can just shove.

I can't count the number of times I've seen solid 2/5 players sit at 1/2 and LAG it up until their name is called and they go sit at the big boy table with $1500.

They usually come out ahead too because almost everyone at 1/2 is scared money. Nobody wants to call the crazy guy's $40 3bet even though it's the 3rd hand in a row he's done it and he showed 72o and T4o the last two hands.

It's true. When they call and lose they don't even feel shame about it or that they did anything wrong. To them it is like being set over setted and they view it as impossible to get away from... "THAT'S POKER."

How about Half-n-Half? (HAF-N-F)

Was remembering this one this morning and I don't think anything like it is in the thread yet. (Also, wanted to bump one of my favorite threads...)

1/2 game; effective stacks $300.

Villain is a middle-aged rec player who knows the game but is purely Level 1 (as we will see).

Villain raises to $12 (standard for table), two callers, Hero calls with 99 on button.

Flop ($48): T72r
Villain bets $20, two folds, Hero calls.

Turn ($88): 9
Villain checks, Hero bets $40, Villain calls.

River ($188): A (rainbow board)
Villain jumps out of his seat, screams "YES!," pumps his fist and shoves all-in for $230 or so.
Hero thinks for a minute and Villain (standing up and bouncing slightly) announces, "Only two cards beat me. Do you have the nuts? 'Cause only two cards beat me!"
Hero calls and Villain shows AA.

Analysis
Hero completely leveled himself into believing that nobody would be foolish enough to act the way that V did when he rivered the near-nuts. V basically behaved as if he were playing in a game against the house and not against another player.

This is another manifestation of the Player Who Views Poker As Another Gambling Game (PWVPAAGG?). He is not thinking about making money but rather about getting lucky and winning hands. Whether the hand is for $5 or $500 is almost irrelevant and this most often manifests itself in ridiculous bet-sizing and checking the nuts (neither one the case here, although the check on the turn may have been a symptom).

The lesson I took away from this (and this was quite a while ago when I was making the transition from online to live) is that your average rec player is not acting and the bad ones don't even care to try. If they are celebrating, they really, really did hit that card.

Overpair versus gambly LAG = PAYDAY

1/2 deep stacked game, $350 eff. stacks

V is a well-off insurance salesman with more money than he knows what to do with. Plays very loose and is not afraid to pull big bluffs on later streets.

Hero dealt 99 in MP

First to act (tight EP raiser) makes it $13 to go, hero calls, V calls in the BB.

FLOP ($40) 234

V bets $25, PFR folds, hero raises to $70, V thinks for a couple of seconds before announcing all in. I call.

Board runs out 7 2 I showdown, villain looks back at his hand and mucks. Probably had like a pair and a straight draw with a 5

Funny. Generally, it's really obvious when a V is acting. let's just say that none of them are getting paid to do it during the day. If you can't tell that they're obviously putting on a show, then it's probably genuine.

2-5 Game at Charlestown:

Fish (SB) 700 - wide range, doesn't like to fold, calls big bets preflops with any two
Reg (EP) 1200 - very LAG, raising every straddle, and betting almost any two from late pos
Hero (MP) 1200 - Playing tight, won a massive pot with QQ earlier with 4 all ins
Fish 2 (HJ) 500 - lose, likes big hands
Villan (Button) 450~ - Seems quiet, passive most hands

Straddle on ~ 10. Hero with QQ..

Pre flop:

Reg - bets to 30
Hero - calls 30
Fish 2 - calls 30
Villan - 3 bets to 65

Fish - calls 65
Reg - calls 65
Hero - 4 bets to 170
Fish 2 - calls 170
Button - calls 170
Fish - calls 170
Reg 1 folds

Flop: (170x4 + change ~~~) 247r

Hero shoves
Fish 2 folds
Villan takes forevvvverrr and puts in remaining 250ish
Fish q folds

Turn: A
River: meaningless

Villan turn over AJ clubs for the WIN...

Typical night at Charlestown......

4bet much much bigger

this is awful.

Sorry DGI, but this really has seemed to have digressed to people posting really bad plays and calling them gold. Maybe a mod can come through and clean it up at some point eh?

THe problem isn't that we know V hit his card, the problem is interpreting what V thinks is the nuts. Is he jumping around because he has AK or AA?

When he does say, "Only two cards beat me" that makes the case for AA however there is something we can do with these players that will give us an even bigger edge...

We can ask them.

When they are celebrating and happy and the endorphins are flowing, if we ask them they will honestly tell us what they have and then we can fold and then they will show us.

I have this happen to me several times per week. I will have a big hand like top two pair or middling flush vs a total fish on the turn and when I value bet and they shove for some weird reason they feel the need to celebrate and then tell me that i'm beat and then tell me their hand. I will even say, "Well, if you show me I'll fold" and they will show me 4 times out of 5 and then I fold and I'm sure to reinforce their behavior by telling them that they have to show me so I don't draw out on them...

BUt you both are right. When rec-fish celebrate like this, it is because they have it. They just aren't crafty enough to do it on a bluff.

Now, all bets are off when its an old crusty angle shooting veteran whose been playing poker for 30+ years. They could be celebrating on a bluff
He could have 4-bet a little more--$225ish but his 4-bet (a touch on the low side) was okay. We want 1-2callers and odds are QQ will lead most flops.

Even the bad posts are still donkaliscious and thus apply to this thread

I suppose. I just didn't think the point was to post bad plays by the "poster." That's what all the other threads are for.

heads up?

1/2NL
2 limps. Hero makes it $25 in HJ with A9o. 5 callers. Hero whiffs and c/f.

Hero will now make it $30+ for the rest of the night.


Lesson- dont believe they won't call insane amounts preflop. They can't all have AK.

Spike, do you just overlimp then with speculative SC in CO or BU then if they call insane amounts?

Probably the worst amateur mistake I see is overvaluing non-nut one-card hands.

Hand the other day, the board on the river reads T8264.

Pot is about $100 on the river. Reg bets out $65. Amateur raises to $265. Now at this point I'm pretty sure the reg is going to fold, because the amateur is bluffing 0% of the time here. Instead, the reg re-checks his hole cards, re-checks the board (making sure there is no straight flush possibility), and then shoves for about $290 on top.

I'm just sitting there thinking, FML, must be nice to have a fish just gift you an extra $490. Obv the amateur agonizes over his last $290 and then calls it with the naked K and loses.

But I had the second nut flush! Yeah, you know how much that's worth? Nothing.

In that particular game ya I do. You can't really raise those hands profitably because you seet up such a low SPR. That's probably the most extreme Preflop table I've ever been at as far as cold callers and limp callers. You make it $25 and expect maybe 1 caller who's fit/fold. Nope. Not this one. I posted a hand from later in the night. I made it $30 and still got a caller....

Yeah, just checking.obviously this is super table dependent

I have never attempted to raise $75 in 2/5 to punish limpers, just seems silly to me. So I don't quite understand why people do it in 1/2.

Was playing 1/2nl last week and saw this almost exact same situation.

6-way limp fest (the open is $4) eff stacks $300
Flop(24) 7c 6c 4c
Chks to MP who bets $15, HJ call, BB calls everyone else folds

Turn(69) Js
Chks around

River(69) 3c
BB chks, MP bets 40, HJ calls, BB snap shoves for 280, MP snap calls, HJ tanks forever, looks at his cards several times and then says, well if you have it you have it and calls.

MP has Ac9s
HJ has KcTh
BB has 5cQs for the obv straight flush

It was like the thought of folding never even entered the MP's mind. He didn't even stop to think for one second what hand over bet shoves this river. HJ on the other hand was a drooling station who just couldn't fold to save his life.

A call is bad enough, but K overcall is lol.

If you knew with certainty they would call $75 with ATo, how would you play AK?

1/2 NL, 10 handed

Pre flop: 7 limpers in who cares positions

Flop: (15$) A K 10
7 checks

Turn: (15$) Q
7 checks

River: (15$) J
2 checks
Fish: Bets 10$
Reg 1: Calls
Fish 2: Tanks, and raises to 40$

(At this point I start laughing out loud, and the dealer politely asks me to stop.)

Fish 3: Calls
Fish 4: Calls
Reg 2: Calls
Fish 1: Tanks, and raises to 200$
Reg 1: Calls
Fish 2: Calls
Fish 3: FOLDS?..
Fish 4: Shoves
All call

This happened last night. Thank you Friday night, I shall miss you for the next 6 days.

1/2 players really make me laugh with their sizing.

Llsnl is not about preflop. Its about value betting second best hand. So instead of trying to protect your value with big raises. You make smaller raises and hope to flop an A and take him to value town.

Why raise 75$ and flop comes 10 high, now you have a sticky situation postflop where you make yourself play straight forward. Big raises handicap's your skill advantage at least ime.