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QQ bb <img -3NL strategy JJ9 flop, 3 way QQ bb <img -3NL strategy JJ9 flop, 3 way

03-17-2024 , 03:28 AM
Loose $1-$3 game with splashy betting. Bad splashy player limps, I get QQ in sb and make it $16. bb who knows I play tight but is a loose player calls. Bad player calls. Flop is JJ9r If I had AA I would check, but I don't want A or K to fall, so I bet $11 thinking bb would not raise me unless bb had a jack. But bb raises it to $50. Now bad player thinks and calls the $50! arrrgh. I figure one has to have a Jack so I folded as a $100 turn bet was likely coming as well. Turn is Ace, now they both check. River is 5 and they both check again. BB says "I missed" and bad player shows KQ for a busted gutshot and wins with king high. $152 pot. Was I crazy to fold the flop?
QQ bb <img -3NL strategy JJ9 flop, 3 way Quote
03-17-2024 , 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedOak
Loose $1-$3 game with splashy betting. Bad splashy player limps, I get QQ in sb and make it $16. bb who knows I play tight but is a loose player calls. Bad player calls. Flop is JJ9r If I had AA I would check, but I don't want A or K to fall, so I bet $11 thinking bb would not raise me unless bb had a jack. But bb raises it to $50. Now bad player thinks and calls the $50! arrrgh. I figure one has to have a Jack so I folded as a $100 turn bet was likely coming as well. Turn is Ace, now they both check. River is 5 and they both check again. BB says "I missed" and bad player shows KQ for a busted gutshot and wins with king high. $152 pot. Was I crazy to fold the flop?
For just 50 I can find a call on the flop and see what happens. If you dont have a read that they are real splashy I dont think a fold is bad. But with your read I would definitely call. That being said I dont think your fold is a really bad mistake by any means.
QQ bb <img -3NL strategy JJ9 flop, 3 way Quote
03-17-2024 , 11:21 AM
What are the effective stack sizes?

Helpful to know the suits of our QQ's and the suits on board, for backdoor draw considerations.

Pre flop seems fine. On the flop, it's probably better to start with a check, OOP vs two opponents.

Our hand doesn't need that much protection on this flop. We double-blocks V's combos of hands like AQ and KQ. The board double-blocks V's combos of AJ and KJ, and blocks A9 and K9. Any K would give us an inside straight draw that we could either hit on the river, or rep as a bluff. Neither V should have too much AX or KX in their range when they don't raise pre.

If we're going to bet, we should bet big, not small, because it's a low-frequency c-bet. Down-betting to $11 when there's almost $45-$50 in the pot is way too small, and could have induced BB to raise as a bluff, to get MP to fold, so BB can get HU and IP on us.

The problem with c-betting small on a flop of JJ9r is that there aren't very many combos of JX or 99 in our pre-flop raising range, and many of those are going to start with a check, not c-bet. On the other hand, both V's are going to have a fair bit of JX in their pre-flop calling range.

If we start with a check, and BB bets, then MP calls, we can call. It's too nitty to fold right away if stacks are deep. We're double-blocking V's combos of QJ and we have two of the straight outs for a hand like KT or T8. The board double-blocks V's combos of AJ, KJ, and JT, and also blocks J9.

Once we bet, BB raises, and MP calls, it becomes a bit dicey to call, and way too aggro to raise. Unfortunately we'll have to fold.

Last edited by docvail; 03-17-2024 at 11:27 AM.
QQ bb <img -3NL strategy JJ9 flop, 3 way Quote
03-17-2024 , 03:48 PM
You opened yourself up to that line from villain. $11 into what... $48? If you wanted to play it "safe" you could have checked. He knew you were tight so he used your image against you. Don't give results right away. Influences opinions.
QQ bb <img -3NL strategy JJ9 flop, 3 way Quote
04-11-2024 , 11:07 PM
I would check this flop at a high frequency OOP v these two opponents. Their limp calling range, should consist of a lot of Jx.. also having QQ, you block a lot of the obvious draws.

As played, I’m probably folding the flop as well. Especially when Btn cold calls.
QQ bb <img -3NL strategy JJ9 flop, 3 way Quote
04-12-2024 , 01:46 AM
OP dont post the results it always biases people.

i think folding the flop is fine after a raise and a coldcall and your flop bet size is fine. the flop coldcall is scarier than the first raise.

checking flop would be fine too. it depends on your image. if you have been losing im more inclined to check because people will take shots at you.

i certainly wouldnt bet the flop big here as i really dont have much a range here that would want to build a pot. of course you have to balance this by not betting big with Jx, JJ, 99, etc.
QQ bb <img -3NL strategy JJ9 flop, 3 way Quote

      
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