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11-04-2009 , 07:43 PM

#26

matt2411

journeyman

Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 277

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasons0147

Plz quote the post where anyone was talking about calling a 4bet. Calling isnt an option and either is folding in my opinion once you 3bet.

Yes - coming from a ssnl player... lol

please move on... nothing to see here

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11-04-2009 , 09:21 PM

#27

Tapow Dayok

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 4,121

It sucks that people can't stop getting personal long enough to actually discuss the issue.

Quote

11-04-2009 , 09:29 PM

#28

Williegb

grinder

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 655

Yes, it can be the most profitable line to 3bet/fold AK. It's just that the vast majority of the time it isn't. For instance if Villain is flatting their entire range, but 4 betting AA-KK it's an easy 3bet/fold. Most don't play that way though, and without a read of that nature I would say flatting is standard here.

Quote

11-04-2009 , 09:37 PM

#29

matt2411

journeyman

Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 277

Quote:

Originally Posted by Williegb

Thank you.

Quote

11-04-2009 , 09:39 PM

#30

jasons0147

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 4,593

Quote:

Originally Posted by matt2411

Yes - coming from a ssnl player... lol

please move on... nothing to see here

w/e Ive played from 1c/2c to 5/10 and this was something we learned at 1c/2c. Im not saying that Ive never 3bet AK and then folded it, Im just saying that iif that is ur plan than it doesnt make a whole lot of sense, dont get why u made that comment. I also agree with you that flatting a 4bet against a player with AK when we dont think we can profitably 5bet shove doesnt make a whole lot of sense either.

I actually think the better discussion would have been with AQ but thats just my opinion, back to SSNL I go.....

I also think that this issue is a bit more dynamic in regards to whether or not we should be 3betting AK in the first place

Quote

11-04-2009 , 09:52 PM

#31

Williegb

grinder

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 655

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasons0147

I also think that this issue is a bit more dynamic in regards to whether or not we should be 3betting AK in the first place

I agree. Flat here is super standard. With AQ it's a lot more interesting.

For instance, it's possible that this villain could be flatting better a decent portion of the time. At what point do reverse implied odds start to outweigh value?

There's also a (somewhat unlikely) possibility of villain catching on, realizing a large portion of our 3betting range folds to a raise, and exploiting us. That actually may be more problematic with this player than most, since their 3betting range is perceived as very strong, and our value range is very narrow.

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11-04-2009 , 10:51 PM

#32

Tapow Dayok

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 4,121

Okay after rereading the OP, I think we need to know what position the villain is sitting in. If he's in the cutoff, this is a very different situation than if he's UTG.

I'll happily 5 bet and get it in if this villain is in the cutoff.

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11-05-2009 , 12:24 AM

#33

homeboy604

veteran

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 3,360

in op it said hes UTG + 1

Quote

11-05-2009 , 12:48 AM

#34

Tapow Dayok

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 4,121

Quote:

Originally Posted by homeboy604

this is for a student of mine.
playing 1/2. full table.

villians stats are 14/11 3% 3 bet and 5% 4 bet.
he opens to 9.
he seems like tightish meh reg.
i am 17/14 with 5% 3bet.

folds to me on button i 3 bet to 26. he 4bets to 64.

my student advocates 3bet/folding because he thinks villians 4bet range is aa,kk,qq, and sometimes ak and we're dead to that range.

i say, dont 3bet ak here, if you're going to fold to a 4bet. why would you fold your value 3bet range in this situation. if you're going to fold to 4 bet, just flat.

pls help.
serious replies only thank you.