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***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread*** ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

05-20-2012 , 03:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfred
I'm guessing that you play in games where the max buy-in is small.
Yeah I do, but even if it was a normal game. I would stay away from this aggro asian reg. He plays a solid lag game. He is a good player, plenty of other spots at the table.

Also he cracked aces 3 times last night. He plays a very wide range.
05-20-2012 , 03:32 PM
3-bet ranges are so villain specific that its hard to say specifically. In a box I only 3-bet QQ+, AK live and some people I wind up 3-betting a really wide value range (KQ, TT etc.) and some I just don't 3-bet period.
05-20-2012 , 03:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokahAllday
Yeah I do, but even if it was a normal game. I would stay away from this aggro asian reg. He plays a solid lag game. He is a good player, plenty of other spots at the table.
He's a solid lag but flats while holding AJo against an OOP 3b from a player who never squeezes and whose 3b range is AQs+ and likely AKs+ when OOP against 3 villains? Alrighty.
05-20-2012 , 03:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokahAllday
I'm not a squeezer, 3bet range but not precise 1010+,AQs,AK.
Why are we hoping for a 4 bet? If we have "years" history with this super agro lagtard insano villain, isnt he calling off any 3bet size anyway?
05-20-2012 , 03:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfred
He's a solid lag but flats while holding AJo against an OOP 3b from a player who never squeezes and whose 3b range is AQs+ and likely AKs+ when OOP against 3 villains? Alrighty.
His lag mentality is to win every pot. He is involved with a group who plays at commerce. They all have preflop leaks, but they're big winners and share bankrolls I believe.
05-20-2012 , 03:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazaway TM
Why are we hoping for a 4 bet? If we have "years" history with this super agro lagtard insano villain, isnt he calling off any 3bet size anyway?
He calls a lot of 3bets you can't bully him unless you're an idiot who is deep and shoves because you're scared. He won't pay you off.
05-20-2012 , 03:45 PM
Then you should be 3-betting him with a really wide value range, something like KJs+, 99+
05-20-2012 , 03:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokahAllday
His lag mentality is to win every pot. He is involved with a group who plays at commerce. They all have preflop leaks, but they're big winners and share bankrolls I believe.
None of your last handful of posts presents a good argument for a 3b size of $75, especially if it is believed that this loose-aggro Asian suffering from WEPS may be sharing bankrolls.
05-20-2012 , 03:47 PM
Pokah, you simply can't induce a 4b at a 2/5 game
05-20-2012 , 03:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokahAllday
He calls a lot of 3bets you can't bully him unless you're an idiot who is deep and shoves because you're scared. He won't pay you off.
I said nothing about putting your stack in here pre. Dunno where I hinted shoving 600 over 25 was a good idea. I asked why your plan was that he was going to 4 bet a TAG?

Why not make your 3 bet larger and be fine with villain flatting if we know that he is going to try to win the pot post flop anyway?
05-20-2012 , 03:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by masaraksh
Pokah, you simply can't induce a 4b at a 2/5 game
I thought I was, I guess I played the hand bad. Thanks for putting in words that hit home, actually helping instead of its the wrong sizing "I would make it 95". Which is only 20 more then I did.

Ill take your quote into mind. Are you guys done bashing my play. I'm trying to watch the heat game.
05-20-2012 , 03:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 11t
Then you should be 3-betting him with a really wide value range, something like KJs+, 99+
Idk about you but I try and stay away from good players,the guy is a big winner in the room. Dude routinely sits with 3 or 4k every weekend. Idk if he is always winning 3 or 4k but most of that has to be a plus.
05-20-2012 , 03:59 PM
Lol, nobody is bashing your play. We are imperfect people trying to play a mental game. Nobody plays perfectly all the time and you will always make mistakes.

The day you play a session and feel you played perfectly is probably the day you should quit because you have lost the ability to honestly analyze your play.
05-20-2012 , 04:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokahAllday
Idk about you but I try and stay away from good players,the guy is a big winner in the room. Dude routinely sits with 3 or 4k every weekend. Idk if he is always winning 3 or 4k but most of that has to be a plus.
Yeah I don't worry about that stuff. If somebody has a leak I exploit it and not folding to 3-bets OOP is a big leak with hands like AJ even when you are getting good odds.

I mean I would avoid "going to war" by 3-betting light or 3-betting a lot of his opening raises but 3-betting him with a good value range isn't a terrible play. However, you will have to be prepared to stack off lighter PF and OTF.
05-20-2012 , 04:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokahAllday
I thought I was, I guess I played the hand bad. Thanks for putting in words that hit home, actually helping instead of its the wrong sizing "I would make it 95". Which is only 20 more then I did.

Ill take your quote into mind. Are you guys done bashing my play.
Plenty of posters have stated much more than simply saying $75 was the wrong size.

Also, I've seen no bashing here. Instead, I've seen all but one poster critiquing and that one poster, until now, holding steadfast to the belief that his play was appropriate.

Like Limon popularly noted, pre-flop play is the most important. A bet-size difference of only $20 (if not $25+) can make a world of difference in a hand that likely goes multi-ways. AA is unlikely to see 3 streets of action anyway. In a game where the effective stack is 120bb and the HJ opens to 5bb and there is a 3-bet, the vast majority of the time the money goes in no later than the turn. Set the stage for that.
05-20-2012 , 04:12 PM
I agree I don't play optimal deep. Since you can only restart with 60bbs. I don't just shove in chips because I have big pairs. Maybe I would be a big winner if I started playing like that.

Thanks for all the advice I needed it.
05-20-2012 , 04:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokahAllday
Idk about you but I try and stay away from good players,the guy is a big winner in the room. Dude routinely sits with 3 or 4k every weekend. Idk if he is always winning 3 or 4k but most of that has to be a plus.
I question your perception of him. You state that he is a solid lag. Unless he spazzed out, I don't see a good lag flatting AJo against a player who admittedly (almost) never squeezes and whose 3b range in this particular spot appears to be AKs+ (bottom being AKo).

Also, now that he's seen you 3b this small size from OOP with AA and you've seen him flat with AJo, I would look for him and sit a few seats to his left and look for good spots to squeeze with undersized bets. His play is exploitable. Unless you have bankroll issues, then you should exploit him.
05-20-2012 , 04:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 11t
Yeah I don't worry about that stuff. If somebody has a leak I exploit it and not folding to 3-bets OOP is a big leak with hands like AJ even when you are getting good odds.

I mean I would avoid "going to war" by 3-betting light or 3-betting a lot of his opening raises but 3-betting him with a good value range isn't a terrible play. However, you will have to be prepared to stack off lighter PF and OTF.
I like the range you posted KJs+,AJs+ and 99+. I never thought about exploiting people's 3bet calling range. Something I should have been added to my game. Since everyone in california wants to be a lag and never give up on pots.
05-20-2012 , 04:25 PM
Problem with OOP and very tight range against many callers is pretty obvious I thought.

None of them will get it in with worse, but we will almost always get it in worse.

It's 2012, donks that get it in with AJ on Jxx board against preflop 3-bet raiser have already gone broke.
05-20-2012 , 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaUlater
It's 2012, donks that get it in with AJ on Jxx board against preflop 3-bet raiser have already gone broke.
Have you been to Florida? LOL.
05-20-2012 , 04:27 PM
Yeah, 3b a depolarized value range v. 3b-callers. 3b a polarized range v. 4b-or-fold villains...
05-20-2012 , 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfred
Have you been to Florida? LOL.
Obvious not, and I do hope to get there before they're all broke.
05-20-2012 , 04:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaUlater

It's 2012, donks that get it in with AJ on Jxx board against preflop 3-bet raiser have already gone broke.
You need to come to southern california. I seen players shove with small pairs, call off with AJ+ no pair on 10 and 9 high boards, call off with AJ+ on Jxx and Qxx in 3bet pots all day.

Maybe the games are tough in your part of the country. No fe in california, florida and AC. I'm not sure about vegas. I always hear about the games being snug with fe.
05-20-2012 , 04:36 PM
Anyway last night I posted a.1.7k score which made up for vegoos. Nh nlhe.
05-20-2012 , 04:38 PM
If that's true, then why didn't you raise bigger pre?

      
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