What did he have, 10 8o?

who? BTN had KQ flopped the nuts

Sick.................pad made me hate that word like serious. Time for new lingo durrrr.

Belongs in the LC thread or the BBV threads.

Also, did you or didn't you have a backdoor flush draw?

no back door flush draw. and im sorry im new to the site, i normall play all live poker, not online

In brick and mortar or online, the situation in this hand you are asking about is trivial. Yes your are getting all your money in here with the second nuts in a limped pot. Yes it can suck. Whatever. You should think the opponent would raise KQ PF.

The somewhat discussion worthy spot is how you should respond to your opponents flop raise.

Do you think he is capable of raising marginal strength hands? How do you think he would respond with pair + draw or two pair to a re raise by you? Basically, do you think your opponents raising range consists of hands that will fold to a re raise? How much of those hands do you think occupy his raising range. Can a case be made for calling vs. re raising? I'm not arguing if it can or can not, I am asking you to ask yourself.

no i totally agree...thats why as i was putting my money in, i said QK is good. because after i evaluated it for a second, the only hand i pretty much think he would do this with was QK. i didnt have him for a set. 7 8 also came across my mind.

i dont like the 3-bet on the flop. it should allow villain to play perfectly: i call and see a turn, and let him bet his value bet range for me: 2 pair, Jx etc, unlikely sets, (as well as better straights), rather than let him fold all those hands to a 3-bet.

echo last post..

why blow the pot up soo early in the hand ?

he wanted to take it down right there.
and so did villain apparently, with the nuts on an unpaired rainbow flop.

exactly, i knew a turn card of K or paired board and im lost, and somewhat committed

This is a topic that most will not agree with me on i would assume. I rarely go broke for over 100bb in a limped pot.

How many here have flopped a set on 4 5 7 and gave villains all sorts of combo draws etc or two pair and get it in and looked at 8 6 ? EVERY player fears the cold nuts in limped pots. So when they start putting all their money in (in limped pots), its usually somewhere real close to the nuts.

There are certain times that we can rule out somewhat the 88 99 etc in the above hand since they would raise pre, but in general i would call the $100 on flop and go from there. If nothing else, many times with the nuts if we act as if we are going to fold, the villain will far underbet the pot as they always do in live poker instead of bet correctly to get stacks in. I would say in general if we call the avg villian here on flop, he bets turn strong, then shoves river, i fold river. (barring something about the villain that would make me think he plays other holdings this way)

But bottom line is, we just look at the nuts here a ton if villain never so much as stops any moment to think about what we have. A great majority will simply cry out second nuts, cooler, move on. I like to do just a slight bit better than that, but i will agree, we have to be pretty confident of our soul reads on things like this, otherwise just call it off and sleep good at night.

Welcome to my weekend. The only good thing about was when I started a session, realized I was playing my "C" game and got up within 40 minutes to call it a night.

I was at a 2/5 table with two other 2+2ers (enjoyed meeting both of you). There was table coach at the table who started off telling me I played my hand wrong, then proceeded to quote wrong odds on every situation, hadn't heard of EV, chatted with the dealer about how he used to play 150/300 HOE, but was here trying to rebuild his roll all the while with a 50BB stack. After the 2+2ers left, the table got even better. A complete noob sits at the table and builds a huge stack by calling an AI and a call of the AI with a gutshot and hitting it. A rich husband and wife sit down and play terribly. The best was that there was a nit that actually would muck his hand pf if he didn't like the first card he got. Yes, he'd fold before the dealer pitched the second card, including in the BB.

It was the softest, easiest 2/5 table I've ever seen there.

Me. I get sucked out on a 4 outer for 2/3 of my $700 stack and end up only $150 ahead, leaving just after the old guy gets finally felted (I lost flips for his stack twice to keep him in ).

Yes, we've all been there.

The straight-over-straight hand is almost certainly zero-sum.

The old guy in seat 3 got felted???

Yes, seat 10 was annoying. You played that hand well. You got seat 1 to fire a missed flush on the river.

It was great meeting you. not often do you mett genuinely nice people at the poker table.

Sounds like the table became really great
I wish that I had a room so that I could have just taken a nap and come back

Lost a $2,700 pot last night as a 90% favorite heading to river.

I turned straight....villain rivered 4 outer for boat.

Need January to end.

Ok we've all been here in one form or another.
We're cruising through another session up about 250bbs, only been playing about four hours and we are thinking about maybe leaving in about a half hour or so. Lifes good.

Then it happens. Some middle aged guy decked head to toe in wsop gear, wearing greg raymour shades, and sipping a Kaluha and cream gets transferred to your table. He sits with about 150bbs, notices your 400+bb stack and instantly starts chatting you up. Your thinking, "god what a f$%%$n douche." You force a faint smile and try to answer the questions spewing out of his mouse like mouth, as short and quick as possible. Hes a tourny player,(shocker) no your not playing in the mid night $50 tourny that has about 15 runners currently signed up tonight. no your not staying in the hotel. Yes Ive had the breakfast buffet, "god let me alone dude!"

He raises 3bbs, seemingly unaware that the normal raise at this table has been between 6 and 8bbs.

You look down in poss to see AKs. Perfecto! Pop it up 14bbs.
He starts in on man that sure is a big raise, jeeez what am I gonna do.

He calls. FLOP: A K 9 r.
he checks you bet top two
he tanks then calls

"This is heavenly" turn x
he checks again
You fire
he tanks then shoves

You crack your knee of the table trying to beat him in the pot only to see him turn over the 99 for bottom set!

river x

He doubles through you and instantly starts saying something like, "Yeah I hate AK, I never riase w/ in a cash game, you know its only an A high hand its basically a drawing hand." At this point you tap the table say nice hand take a breath and walk outside to have a cigarette and calm down a bit.

You now Know your on full blown tilt. You know that you can still cash out now w/ a modest win and meet that girl you been diggin on down town for a drink. You know if you sit back down where this is gonna go.

But...your thought process is along the lines of, "well its not quit mid night, its prob busy down there she"ll get off work late, plus I'm wearing sweats, kinda wanna go home and grab some jeans and a more stylish phillies hoodie then the one I'm wearing, I'm gonna sit back down play for a half hour drop the car off, cab it and meet here around one."

Your already texting her as you sit back down.

You still have 225bbs and rest ashored the first time douchey puts $ in the pot you'll be waiting. It dosn't take long.

He raises two hands later to 3bbs again. "lol, this guys a fooool!" You make a poor decision and 3bet,again, to 14bbs with the 7c 8c.

Justification to self: I want to play this idiot heads up in position, thats my $ sitting in front of him I don't want him to give it to anyone else.(soo soo bad on your part)

he calls and the flop comes: 9d 10c 5h

Boom! I got a piece of that lets punish this guy

he checks you bet the pot
he tanks, then min raises
you 3bet all in
he tanks, then reluctantly calls, saying"I guess I have to call nh"
tables the QcQs
turn Qh
river 5d
"full boat" is yelled from across the table.

You "power muck" your cards that you didn't show as hes saying "must a been aces, only reason I called was cause I'm running so good this week! I just Knew it was coming!"

You reload and this time have two cigarettes at the bar along with a whiskey on the rocks.

Back at the table wsop guy has put his raymour shades on his hat and is having an "extra loud" conversation with the girl beside him. "Its really after midnight?" "Last time I checked it was only 8:30, man I must be drunk, I don't know how many kaluha's i've had!" "jeeez I missed the start of the tourny, I'd better just head up to my room, I don't want to miss the am tourny."

With that he racks up and leaves.

You look around the table and realise no one has more than 100bbs and you feel sick!

"How did that just happen" "What was I thinking" "How did I let myself tilt like that." wtf!

You then don't meet the girl, instead choosing to playing your d- game until 5am leaving stuck 1 1/2 buyins.

You get home flip on sports center and want to break the flat screen because all the sudden its unbearable to watch wall to wall pittsburgh green bay coverage knowing your beloved eagles came up short and the team from the otherside of the state you grew up in and the team that beat you did not.

But thats not the real problem.

The real problem is how did you, a suppossed pro, a superior player, an intellegent man let last night happen?

You know better than that. You are better than that.

The pain is like a dull weight on your soul. You just can't shake the fact that, you degressed to, if not below, the level of the people that you make your living off of.

This brings me to my question for you 2+2

What do you do to get over a total and complete melt down?
What do you do when you know your better than that but for some reason in that moment in time you wern't?

How do you guys cope or shrug aside a complete self inflicted debactle?

One can't change the past but he surely has some control moving forward, how do we leave this in the past and get back to playing our A game asap.

How do we make sure that one bad session is just that, one bad session.

I would love to have a discussion on this, moving on and how we best do this.

what works for you guys?

Thanks ahead of time guys...

mod: I put this here as I play lllnl and the point or question I'm posing has nothing to do with the actual cards or result of certain hands but how other guys playing the same game as myself for a living cope w/ said circumstance.
Nothing to do w/bbv, but how we maintain the right mindset and attitude to continue being the winning hero we all stride to be, thank you

First mistake is taking the game personally. Whether you think the guy is a douche or not should have 0 affect on your decisions.

Also, you shouldn't feel bad if you lose unless you make a mistake. In the AK hand, you probably didn't make a mistake. In the other hand, you made a huge mistake and you should just quit and take a break after that.

Just remember practice and execution of the game plan always prevail.


First you need to respect all opponents. Second when your deep always remember your stack size. Make sure you are not over valuing your hands. Third stop telegraphing your hands. Choose to outplay your opponents. Cold call more flops. Reraise on the turn or lead more turns. Where your opponents have less equity.

cali can you give a specific example for the bolded part?

This makes it sound like your cigarette break was not long enough and you're still tilting.

When I look back on a session and conclude that I played awfully, there is only one method of getting back on my game that experience shows me has worked: take a long break from playing (at least a week) and totally reset my brain.

What can you do?? In a word;

QUIT


Learn to quit properly, (on non A game performance)
and don't make it personal,
you set yourself up for what happened by making it personal,
but you already know that?

I understand 100% I should have quit I knew that at first cig break, what I'm more asking is after the damage is done what do you guys do to help "get over it" Do you take a week of like vern said?

Do you show up at noon the next day residied to play the way you can?
Maybe get a message? He out to the bar with some friends? Meditate?

What methods are tried and true for you guys?

I'm also would like if you could elaborate on this as well even though this isn't where I was trying to go with this thread.

I was looking more for the away from the table/pyscology aspects others use.

I'm well aware of the fact that making things personal is exteremely-ev