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NL€400 live vs old man, bluff riv?

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04-25-2011 , 04:29 AM

SomeEvilMothers

grinder

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 571

I've seen him play very loose pre, thats the only read. Game is super fishy. We have about 600 effective.

Hero is B with J

3 deepish limpers, I make it €30, blinds fold and only old guy calls.

Flop: 8 6 3 Pot: €74
Villain checks, Hero bets €50, Villain calls pretty fast

Turn: Q Pot: €174
Villain checks, Hero bets €130, Villain calls pretty fast

Riv: 8 Pot: €434
Villain checks and stares at Hero trying to look tough/strong?, Hero?

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04-25-2011 , 09:00 AM

tultfill

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 2,926

AI.

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04-25-2011 , 12:53 PM

tmckendry

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 4,201

Your image is what?

Tighter image = AI

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04-25-2011 , 01:40 PM

AintNoLimit

Coach live/online NLHE

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 6,399

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterCooper

A shove is brain dead here. You are going to put 390 more into him when you know he is a station and won't fold nines or better, is capable of having limped AA and is also capable of checking any eight on the river. Braindead.

For a lot of the older players a bet of 150 on the river will seem huge as they don't think in terms of % of the pot because they grew up playing limit. Bet that and fold his king or ace high flush draw, or, just check and get another hand.

Shoving here is a train wreck.

Pretty much this right here.

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04-25-2011 , 01:59 PM

Lime n Soda

adept

Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 704

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterCooper

Yea, i'd be extremely surprised if he ever folds his KQ and you're just burning money by trying to get this station to fold.

Fold and wait for a similar spot where this time, you actually have it because you know you're getting called.

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04-25-2011 , 02:06 PM

poke4fun

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 3,190

I would put in something in the neighborhood of $150 as well.

Old man is probably on a flush draw, and we just have to be right 25% of the time for the $150 bet to be EV+.

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04-25-2011 , 02:21 PM

Nogyong

veteran

Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,801

From villain's perspective is hero capable of value-bet potting e.g. KQ here?

If not, I think we're probably just better off surrendering.

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04-25-2011 , 03:40 PM

schlep

adept

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 808

Shove it.

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04-25-2011 , 09:20 PM

mark82880

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 427

Quote:

Originally Posted by poke4fun

I would put in something in the neighborhood of $150 as well.

Old man is probably on a flush draw, and we just have to be right 25% of the time for the $150 bet to be EV+.

I'm pretty sure this is right.

Bluffing is fine, but only in an amount that gets Villain to fold his draws that we can't beat (which should be a sufficient amount of his range) plus maybe the random 6 or something that he decides to finally pitch (not that I"d count on it). $150 sounds close. I assume described Villain is never capable of bluff c/shoving river, so the fact that our bet size would scream "jam" to a good player is moot.

Shoving is crazy on this river, but I'd feel much differently about it on other cards.

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04-26-2011 , 03:58 AM

#10

SomeEvilMothers

grinder

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 571

If I would have bluffed I agree that around 150-180 is best, I just figured his turncall range was very strong since it was a bet over a HUNDRED and that he now wouldn't fold any of its non draw hands. His limp call pre probably means his draws are generally lower and I thought JT was good sometimes.

He had 65ss btw.

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04-26-2011 , 06:29 AM

#11

canoodles

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 7,017

Just a note: if he's staring at us trying to look tough, that is barely an airball. If he missed a draw (unless it's A-high), he's done with the hand and doesn't care what we do. Staring at us like that usually means he has something with weak show-down value trying to intimidate us into checking back.

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