½$ Horseshoe Hammond
V1 – 120$, Complete nit. Older black guy, has had a stack around 150 the majority of the night. Has opened maybe 4 times in last 4 hours for 7-10$. He has been showing me his cards and talking about how he can’t catch a break. He folded AK on a KT89 board, after the flop checked through, to a small bet multiway(and was right). He isn’t paying much attention ever, since he is ‘running bad’
V2 – Young white guy, bought in for 150$. This is his second hand at the table.
Hero – 325$, mid 20’s, white. Im easily the most active player at the table. Im opening about 50% of the hands I play…playing about 40% of my hands. Showed down a few made hands over last 4 hours. But V2 doesn’t know this since he just got here and V1 I doubt remembers.

Pre: V1 opens for 10$ UTG. V2 calls from button. SB folds. I call from BB with 7h6d.

Flop: 7c6h4c (31$)
Hero bets 15. V1 calls, V2 makes it $50 straight.
Hero????
V1 has about 100$ more behind at this point. V2 has about the same after his raise. If I call OOP OTF hoping for V1 to get it in and then V2 jams, that leaves about 330 in the pot when it comes back round to me, costing me another ~100$.
Im 99% sure I have V1 beat, putting him on JJ+. But I have no reads on V2 and his raise to 50$ (which has been relatively big for this table OTF, but he doesn’t know this). I feel like his his range is so wide here on the button. Ive got top two on a super wet board.

Do you shove? Call? Fold? Reason?

I shove for value. Since the board is wet and V2 has put more than 1/3 of his stack in the pot he doesn't really have any good decisions if you shove because folding is bad and also calling is bad depending on what he has.

Though calling w/ 76o OOP from old man nit's UTG raise is marginal at best.

Once this thread has a lot of responses, you're going to see that the majority of them begin with butchering you for preflop. Hopefully, people will include postflop analysis as well, instead of just "fold pre and this doesn't happen". Admittedly, preflop is pretty loose and bad, since you have a trash hand OOP, but you're asking about postflop, so:

Both of your opponents are shallow, and you already have $25 of a maximum of $150 effective invested, with top two pair, so this can't be -EV by much (if it is at all). That being said, when an unknown makes it $50 on this board after calling $10 pre, right after they've sat down, they generally have a huge hand. Sets are easily in his range, and 85s isn't out of the question. If you are ahead, often you're "ahead" of something you're only slightly ahead of now %-wise, like Ac6c, 9c8c, 65/54 etc. It's not as if he's going to show you something you crush like K4o - he's got a big hand here.

Spot is also very high variance since you're guaranteed to go to showdown, and sometimes may do so 3-way, where each of the other players has significant outs to beat you (if they aren't beating you already).

V2's raise size and willingness to commit 90 seconds after he sat down screams to me set. I think you can safely fold here.

Even if you feel you have an edge postflop, and even though it's live, a VPIP of 40+ is very high and is likely to get you in trouble.

ya u can't really fold here. ur hand got too much equity on this super wet board with flush and straight.

i can't ever see a made straight here OTF of 35 or 58, so the hand ur only behind here is 44. but u beat everything else. im shoving here for value, u beat any pocket pair and big draws. u have 4 outs (not much but still outs) if they got 44.

if u are gonna play 67o, and u hit top 2, which is pretty much ur dream flop. u just gota ship it. mainly because villian both are relatively short so i dont mind it if its a cooler.

if villain has 100bb+ it would be more of a decision.

Every sign says to fold connectors against V1, because he's probably too nitty to stack off even if you hit, and yet you call from OOP, which makes it even harder to stack him.

Then you pretty much hit your dream flop and...fold? Nice play.

what did you hope to flop with 76o? 777? because thats about the best flop you can get with 76. jam it in there and be confident. also fold pre you are way way way too shallow for this to be profitable oop.

um..

V1 is absolutely behind with his overpair.

V2 could easily make this play with 88+

I'm not even sure what you're contemplating... Are you wondering whether you should just flat? I'm shoving here without really thinking about it. You have the nuts.

oh yea, and fold PF with 6,7o lol

doesn't matter that you're in the blinds. I would bet money that V1 doesn't even open AK. You really want to burn money with two unsuited under cards?

TBH, your fold is pretty terrible.

easy ship... that is a dream flop against V1... V1 has overpair at best, V2 might have 88-JJ

only hand you're scared of is 44... can't really seeing a new player calling 10 PF with 85 or 35 when he has no information on any players

are your other 5k posts as garbagey as this?

calling pre is atrocious. you lose like 7 of the 8 dollars you called on average or something.

x/r or c/c the flop. v1 is going to bet some higher % than he will call your bet and then v2 is going to call v1s bet frequently.

im not saying iv have never made that call pre flop, but when u do you really need a battle plan. if ypu dont think a cpl of streets ahead dont do it. if u are calling u can't really ask for much better board. it is a shove and let them fall where they fall. think ahead and you don't have such a hard decision

not folding top two pair. i made a bad fold last night in a similar situation and, though it would up saving me money by the river, i felt stupid after folding. flopped bottom two from the BB in an unraised pot on 8s 6s 4d board ... i led out for pot, got called in spot, raised and then called with still the original caller to act after i decided what to do. i eventually just folded, figuring i was beat or facing too many draws to be +EV

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/26...-tl-dr-989763/

This is silly. We do not have "the nuts". Villain can very easily have 77, 66, 44 here, in addition to hands which are coinflips against OP - Ac5c, 9c8c, Ac6c, etc. We are not always behind here, and not even behind any incredible percentage of the time, but V2's line is very strong. He's willing to commit against two players immediately after he sat down .... he doesn't have an overpair here all that often (notwithstanding what actually happened).

You have to separate yourself from the "we have top two and it's live they all suck and overplay marginal hands" line of thought.

1) don't include results
2) this is an obvious 3b/valueshove, your results show perfectly why.

There's exactly 5 combos of those hands out there. There's 9 combos of AA. Think about what that means.

He'd be considerably more likely to call $10 preflop with the combos that make a set here than he would the ones that make big pocket pairs. Regardless of what happened here, V2 rarely has a big PP here.

You cant call pre with 67o then fold when you flop top two lol, your just not gonna make manies playing these connectors this way,

you probably have the best hand, albeit a possibly vulnerable hand vis-a- vie V2. a shove won't fold a set of fours ( set of sevens or sixes is very unlikely ) so why not let him bet is draw or overpair ? maybe even V1 will come along for a few dolllars.

to even think V2 has to call your shove because he has put 1/3 of his stack in is misunderstanding "pot committed".

your preflop call was not marginal it was fishy. playing 40% of hands preflop is also fishy for a typical $1/$2 game.

This is irrelevant. 5 set combos available, TT-KK have 36 combos.

It's not irrelevant at all. The preflop action suggests that big PP's (QQ KK AA) are very unlikely. JJ and TT are somewhat unlikely. Rarely is someone going to flat the $10 preflop and show up with AA or KK, it has to be an incredibly small piece of his range, even with the fact that he had it this instance. The hands that make sets fit the preflop action, as do the hands that make combo draws.

After looking at the majority of posts, I COMPLETELY agree on two things...
1-preflop call is easily -EV
2-if i play this type of hand OOP, and hit this flop, against said V's with said stacks, I need to be playing for stacks.

BUT, there is also on thing that I COMPLETELY DIS-agree with that many have said...
1-this is by no means a 'dream' flop for 76off. Yes, it is a very good flop, but no way is a dream flop. Many, many hands can counterfeit me, draw me out, or just straight have me beat. This all points back to me NOT playing this type of hand OOP for a raise PF.
FWIW, 458r or 77A is my dream flop for 76off

bet 22 on the flop.... as played i reshove over his making it 50... he could have fd, pair and fd... pair and open ender.... weirdly played over pair... bottom 2... top pair top kicker... this range we beat or flip against... he could have bottom set or flopped straight... but whatever.... i shove over

Shove this anytime of the day vs a random V2. From your description V1 has an overpair any day of the week and is not stacking off at all, or only doing so with aces.

Range for V2? He called pf for 8% of his stack, doing so with 85o/85s is pretty -EV this shallow so unless a bad player this is not in his range. Maybe something like {66+,67s,89cc, A8cc+, KQcc}, most of which you're crushing pretty bad and the flush draws are at best about 50% equity.


Why you call with 67o OOP vs V1 is a good question - seeing as you're unlikely to be paid off. You need to bluff him off many hands for it to be close to profitable.

FWIW if 77A is your dream flop then you're drawing to one out whenever you get dream flops.