2/5 690 eff. Villain is my best friend and a balanced crusher who has been grinding 200z hard recently with good results.

Open AcAh to 15 utg, fish calls HJ friend calls Btn. 690 eff

Js4d3s I check fish check friend 25 I 80 friend calls

9h I bet 130 friend calls

Jc I check friend jams

Nah fold, still like 500. Like sure he knows he can jam this card but just meh, too much value that shoves for the same reason the air can shove… but it’s like always value.

Unimproved aces are just a pair by the river. Not going to stack off with them without a good read, especially when TP becomes trips.

I think c/r'ing the flop was horrible, why would you wanna fold out a jack, or other hands that would call a cbet just lead out, but since he called a 3x raise otf it's either a jack + or a FD. So how many jacks are in his range that he would flat? Probably raising AJ and KJ pre, which are the only likely jacks that might possibly call a flop raise, so he's possibly flatting QJ and TJ pre but they probably won't call the flop raise. How does he play his FD's? if he doesn't play them aggressively it's a snap fold. If you're unsure, just fold. He could still have a set too and we only have a bluff catcher to a missed fd.

Noob perspective:

How many flush draws is he playing this way vs. how many Jx or sets (now boats)?

A worse overpair (QQ or KK) would have been 3-bet, and it's unlikely he's getting this far with TT or 88 (99 now beats you).

You unblock the nut flush draw, but again, AKss or AQss is getting 3-bet, and he can't have AJss, so there are only a few combos here that are realistic (ATss, KQss, maybe a worse Axss, maybe KTss or QTss). T9ss is probably checking back.

As far as value hands, there are a ton of QJ, JT, KJ type hands that are taking this line. Even possibly set-mining from the button with 33 or 44.

If my math is right, this is almost a full pot bet on the river, and you need to be good 30% of the time. I just don't see enough bluffs ending up here unless this is basically a stone cold maniac bluff, which doesn't fit "balanced crusher". This is a grumble-fold for me.

Fair assessment. But what hands are you defending against all in?

What are you stacking off with?

Why are we reluctant to check raise near the top of our range in a spot where the vast majority of his made hands are one pair holdings?

Because you're gonna fold everything out that you beat, and may have gotten more money from them if you cbet/bet/bet. C/r'ing is over playing the hand otf.

It's a fair question, and I usually don't think enough about MDF.

From an MDF point of view, AA probably ends up in the defending portion, but from a pot odds and value combos vs. bluff combos point of view, I just don't see how this is a call.

That's a conflict I really don't know how to resolve.

Why is he going to fold a Jack? Isn’t he way over folding if he’s folding a Jack?

We simply have to call off unless we can reasonably assume that opponent won’t be able to find the proper amount of bluffs, right? OTOH, a lot of opponent’s natural bluffs block my own natural folds. Like KsQs is a bad bluff from villain’s POV.

He was described as a crusher, so that would be a bad call on his part if he called a c/r otf from an UTG opener with just a jack.

But Vil and hero are friends so they have history. What if Hero is a balanced player too? Then Vil knows Hero has bluffs so he can’t fold top pair to a single raise.

So what’s he calling with? Sets? He’s folding almost his entire range to a 1/2 pot check raise? Does that sound like a crusher strategy?

I wouldn't be in this situation by x/r the flop and checking the river. I'd probably call trips with TK or SK or a FH.

The ckr flop is pretty bad on J43s. Honestly if I'm betting flop and you're making it 55 more for me to continue IP w 600 or whatever behind, then, you're doing me a favor. He's going to to call J9+, sets, FDs, gutters, OESDs, slow played QQ/KK etc etc etc. You found one of the few relatively good turns too and he still called 130 - not sure how he plays his Jx hands, but if he continues a lot of them at that sizing I cannot see how you can ckc river, which is why i folded. IDK you just opened yourself up so badly with the flop play, I hate it.

del

He does bet call flush draws though.

Why aren’t you check raising this flop at any frequency?

If he isn’t continuing with Jx hands, our check raise is pretty terrible from a range POV.

Do you have a check raise range on flop?

What is the worst J with which your friend calls the flop C/R? That should hone his value combos.

Would he call the turn with a naked FD? What is the worst J he will continue with OTT?

Flop xr too small. As played lean call.

if V truely is a crusher as stated then he folds a J to your C/R and turn lead (fish will call and jam river when hitting trips)

shoving river with KK or QQ doesn't make sense either (again based on desc by OP)

so we only beat a missed flush draw bluff

So question is does V think we'll lay down AA here ?


with 2 players calling your UTG open they expect you to c-bet 90% here so I don't get the check .

then you C/R knocking out the 3rd player leaving you to face a crusher OOP ???

Because I don't want worse hands to fold on the flop. Preferably, I want them to call me on the river. Better hands are never folding.

My goal in poker is to win money, not win hands.