My image young TAG grinder. Has been pretty active last 1/2 hour, playing hands, image is quite active, a little compromised as I've been losing small pots. Table is mostly grinders who know I'm generally tight.

Stacks. I have $1600 and all Vs have me covered except the Asian lady who's balling $1000.

UTG+1 Asian 35ish lady limps (she's generally a nit but is on tilt after having her QQ stacked), young guy Bad Hyper LAG grinder raises opens to $40 in MP1, I call HJ with KQs, older man amateur reg (but not a nit at all) makes it $140 in BB, Lady FLATS, Ultra LAG flats and... it's on me.

I have position on everyone. HLAG is superwide. The 3bettor and the lady have stronger ranges obviously. I'm putting the Lady on PP.

So should I flat also due to pot odds or whatever? If you think I should flat or not please explain why.

If your question is just to flat or fold I think Flatting is fine. KQs plays well multi way especially in position. You are getting better than 4/1 to make the call and have plenty back to play a pot.

If you had more info on the "Old man but not a nit" it would be helpful. Usually a 3 bet from the blinds is pretty damn strong. Any idea what his 3 betting range is? Or what his 3 betting range is from the blinds is? If it's pretty wide a 4 bet could be profitable but the sizing would be tricky. The safest play by far is to just flat and see what develops on the flop.

So you think we have enough in pot/implied and deep enough to flat, eh? I was tempted to flat but this is something I've never done before so wanted to see what you guys think. Sure I can define old man's range quite well - TT+, AQ+.. maybe AJ+, big maybe KQo+. 4b is out of the question.

As long as you aren't the type of player who gets too excited when flopping top pair in a multiway pot, I think calling is fine.

Let's say we flop is Q-high or K-high (with former being better for us I think) and no favorable draws for us. Are we in pot control mode then? We're EASILY dominated in both cases.

Doesn't seem like you are deep enough to profitably call here. The 2 other callers definitely make it closer to break even, but with a compromised image you are asking for trouble.

Why didn't you 3b yourself pf?

I would be. Depending on the action, I might even fold on the flop. Most of the time though, I'd call a bet or if checked to me usually bet myself.

I don't like KQ when calling 3bets but this is a situation where I would call. We have position and the flop will be going 4 ways so we can safely assume our opponents will play their hands straight forward a very high % of the time.

I'd be looking to make a straight or flush with this hand and proceed carefully when we make a pair.

Sent from my SM-G900I using 2+2 Forums

Idk man I guess a call isn't bad but your pretty much crushed here IMO. I fold here a lot tbh.

I don't play 5/10, but I'd imagine KQ is pretty crushed here, and if you make top pair and get action, you are probably beat a lot. Tough to over flush somebody with a 3 bet and cold call preflop, as they shouldn't have too many suited cards outside of big suited aces. The LAG is likely to have a lot of suited cards, but what are the chances of you both flopping the same flush draw?

I don't think you can count on straight forward play from a bad hyper lag and a Young Asian Woman on tilt. IME the former is usually bad precisely because of ******ed moves they pull in multi-way pots and YAW tilt like none other.

Off topic: Search Google for: tilt. Pretty clever easter egg.

Flatting the first raise was sub-opt allowing ulag to retain initiative. No good in my book.

I would have 3 bet to 105 and iso him all day.

As played, like so many live hands the multiway aspect begins to grey out quite often with the pie split up between 4 players with reasonable equities each. I play VERY few of these pots 4-5 way because i dont let them get that way.

To me we are in a neutral spot here and will be villain dependant as well as your postflop skill (how well you will play one pair post).

3b and flat are fine the first time around

now call

Playing a dominated hand MW with a SPR under 4 in a 3bet pot is suicide. You are 20:1 to hit 2pair +. The first go around is a 3bet or fold. I fold to the 3bet.

UltraLAG opened from a bit of an "too early" position for me to 3b.. I mean if he opened a bit later I'd strongly consider 3b. Also KQs plays very well postflop and I felt like I could extract good value from him IP and of course there's a chance the amateurs in the blinds will "defend" by calling which makes this hand even sweeter to see the flop. 3bing.. would probably just fold him out. In other words, I felt it was more +EV to flat but I don't think 3bing would be bad.

I don't disagree about the hand playing well multi-way, but could you be overestimating how much wider his range is from MP1 vs positions after one (tilted) limper? It worries me more that the HJ might be early to 3B with four players left to act. Is the bad hyperlag that positionally aware? Exactly what makes him bad and hyper vs just laggy?